HELP! Purchase E92 M3 w/V8 or wait for next gen F82 M4 w/V6

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by JulieDriving

I would think that depends on the interest rate.

• Say, interest rate with lease is lower. EDIT: lower than financing
• EDIT: This doesn't apply if you have the cash to pay the car upfront. Paying no interest is the best thing. Unless the finance/ lease rates are pretty low and you like keeping the cash available. (Or because you can get a better return in another way, etc.)
• Pay the lease payment on a monthly basis, which in total equates to the depreciation amount with the lower interest rate.
• When the lease is over, you can decide if you want to keep it or buy it out.
• If you want to buy it out, pay cash and voila, you have not spent more.
• Key is to negotiate based on total price of car, from invoice up, regardless of method of paying for it.
• In addition, if your car gets damaged during the lease period, you don't swallow any of the depreciation if you give it back. I may be paranoid, but this has happened to me. Then I decided to try leasing and did as I described above.

This won't work if the lease rate is not attractive though.

I don't have the cash to buy the car upfront and I think it is better for me to just lease the M3 and then buy it at the end like you are saying. That's why I got a 328i and leased it. It is my first BMW of probably many more in my future. I wanted to see if I like BMW and see if I would get sick of it or not.

The main reason for me suddenly thinking of getting the M3 is because I would like the V8 engine and I love the design of the E92. I don't want to regret not having the M3 in the future when only the next gen is available for order (I don't want to buy used). Even if I end up paying a little more, I think it is worth not regretting missing out on the E92 M3 in the future. Thanks for the long, explanatory post.

EDIT: Just to reiterate, I would not be getting the M3 (most probably for lease) until around June. So lease rates will be different? Better hopefully?

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by esquire

i agree with what most others in this thread have said. leasing the car presents a win/win situation for you. in the event that you love the next gen m3/m4 you can return the car upon lease-end (or even earlier). in the event that the m3/m4 ends up being a disappointment to you, you can just stick with the leased current gen M3 and buy it out at the end of the term.

i wouldn't buy the e92 M3 outright at this point if you are also seriously considering buying the next gen M3/M4.

re: financing, if you end up leasing the car, ED might not be the route to go. obviously you won't realize the full ED savings unless you end up purchasing the lease at the end of the term. not to mention that ED takeks 3 months from beginning to end. maybe the move here for you is to negotiate an M3 at a few cents above invoice.

- esquire

I'm not seriously considering the next gen M3/M4, but do not want to regret buying a car when I could have gotten the one that is more appealing to me. The E92 M3 is almost flawless in my opinion and I'm sure the next gen will be too, regardless.


I'm a bit confused about what you are saying about ED. Are you saying financially the discounts won't play that much affect unless I end up buying the car? And what do you mean about the 3 months? I don't mind waiting if thats what you are saying. My current 328 is amazing.


The main reason I was thinking ED is because the great savings (so I might as well tour Europe too, never been). That's what I was thinking. If I save less than $2k over the 3 year period on a lease, then it is not worth it too me. 14% off is a lot if that number is precise.

[Mr. ///M3 RD]

Originally Posted by parham2652

I'm not seriously considering the next gen M3/M4, but do not want to regret buying a car when I could have gotten the one that is more appealing to me. The E92 M3 is almost flawless in my opinion and I'm sure the next gen will be too, regardless.


I'm a bit confused about what you are saying about ED. Are you saying financially the discounts won't play that much affect unless I end up buying the car? And what do you mean about the 3 months? I don't mind waiting if thats what you are saying. My current 328 is amazing.


The main reason I was thinking ED is because the great savings (so I might as well tour Europe too, never been). That's what I was thinking. If I save less than $2k over the 3 year period on a lease, then it is not worth it too me. 14% off is a lot if that number is precise.

Just to chime in here on the ED issue ... I think you should go for it ... take in account also you save at least 1,200 Euro to rent a VW for 3 weeks (and you be driving a M3 your own if you do get one). So as they say "It's all good" you will always remember the ED as they treat you like a KIng (naturally). Also the drive along some of Europe's country roads and of course the Autobahn will always be one of your sweetest memories, I guarantee it so go for it.

[JulieDriving]

I agree with you parham that the current M3 is almost perfect, so I suspect you would never regret picking one up.

I have the sneaking suspicion that the new M3/M4 will be even better than the current generation.

However, cars at the end of their generation are the most tweaked, have had things fixed (e.g. DCT software) and new options added (e.g. competition package). That will always be the case.

I'm sure I'll drool over the new one. However, I wouldn't personally want to pick it up soon after it's released. If you're going for a new coupe and at least one model year after its release, you're looking at 2015.

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

Originally Posted by JulieDriving

I agree with you parham that the current M3 is almost perfect, so I suspect you would never regret picking one up.

I have the sneaking suspicion that the new M3/M4 will be even better than the current generation.

However, cars at the end of their generation are the most tweaked, have had things fixed (e.g. DCT software) and new options added (e.g. competition package). That will always be the case.

I'm sure I'll drool over the new one. However, I wouldn't personally want to pick it up soon after it's released. If you're going for a new coupe and at least one model year after its release, you're looking at 2015.

I learned that lesson the hard way. Never going to pick up the first model year of anything anymore. My bike has been a nightmare. Issues have been fixed in the following years, though.

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by Rolf-Dieter

Just to chime in here on the ED issue ... I think you should go for it ... take in account also you save at least 1,200 Euro to rent a VW for 3 weeks (and you be driving a M3 your own if you do get one). So as they say "It's all good" you will always remember the ED as they treat you like a KIng (naturally). Also the drive along some of Europe's country roads and of course the Autobahn will always be one of your sweetest memories, I guarantee it so go for it.

I know it will be amazing if I do it. I have seen many pictures from other members. But would it be worth it financially on a lease? I would definitely do ED if I knew for sure that I would be buying the car.

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by JulieDriving

I agree with you parham that the current M3 is almost perfect, so I suspect you would never regret picking one up.

I have the sneaking suspicion that the new M3/M4 will be even better than the current generation.

However, cars at the end of their generation are the most tweaked, have had things fixed (e.g. DCT software) and new options added (e.g. competition package). That will always be the case.

I'm sure I'll drool over the new one. However, I wouldn't personally want to pick it up soon after it's released. If you're going for a new coupe and at least one model year after its release, you're looking at 2015.

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

I learned that lesson the hard way. Never going to pick up the first model year of anything anymore. My bike has been a nightmare. Issues have been fixed in the following years, though.

I agree with both of you that the last model of everything is the most tweaked and usually the best. Which is another pro for the E92, then again the whole new factor and design of the M4 catches the eye. So this is basically just leading me to believe that a lease is truly the best option.

[parham2652]

So I have pretty much decided on doing a 3 year lease around May/June 2012 till 2015 (about a year or so after the next gen E92 M3 will be out? hopefully).
Now, is it financially worth doing ED on a lease?
Approximately how much would I be potentially saving over the course of the lease if I decided not to buy the car at the end of the 3 year lease?

To be honest, I think there will be a high probability that I would upgrade to the next gen M3. So let's account for me most likely not purchasing the car at the end of the 3 year lease. This car would be my daily driver; I don't need a strictly track only car, so power wise the new M3 would be fine. I just love the sound of the V8 and the ability of having the V8 engine.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by parham2652

So I have pretty much decided on doing a 3 year lease around May/June 2012 till 2015 (about a year or so after the next gen E92 M3 will be out? hopefully).

I assume you meant next gen F32 M4 (?).

No one knows yet, but it could very well be that the the M4 does not go on sale in the US until early 2015. It all depends on the timing of the F32 3 series which we still don't know. But just for comparison, the E46 M3 went on sale in the US in early 2001 and the E92 M3 went on sale in the US in early 2008. So, if the pattern continues, it will be early 2015 for the F32 M3.

Also, just so you are aware, there may yet be an MY 2013 E92 M3. If there is, it will likely go on sale in July of next year. We should know by early next spring whether this will be the case or not. Given your planned purchase timeframe, I thought this might be of interest to you.

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

I assume you meant next gen F32 M4 (?).

No one knows yet, but it could very well be that the the M4 does not go on sale in the US until early 2015. It all depends on the timing of the F32 3 series which we still don't know. But just for comparison, the E46 M3 went on sale in the US in early 2001 and the E92 M3 went on sale in the US in early 2008. So, if the pattern continues, it will be early 2015 for the F32 M3.

Also, just so you are aware, there may yet be an MY 2013 E92 M3. If there is, it will likely go on sale in July of next year. We should know by early next spring whether this will be the case or not. Given your planned purchase timeframe, I thought this might be of interest to you.

Yes, the next gen M4 (if that's what it's called, but I thought that it will be the F82 rather than the F32).

Anyway, I know no one knows for sure, but I am just asking for opinions based on what people think and on their past experience.

Also, what is the MY 2013 E92 M3. I have seen MY somewhere else, but can't find it exactly. What does it stand for and what does it mean?

[JulieDriving]

Originally Posted by parham2652

Also, what is the MY 2013 E92 M3. I have seen MY somewhere else, but can't find it exactly. What does it stand for and what does it mean?

MY = "model year"

Production of MY 2012 E92 M3's stop in June of 2012.

It's still unknown whether there will be a (likely short) production run of MY 2013 coupes.

This thread contains the most info we have to date on that possibility, including posts from a couple of insiders (Scott26 & mapezzul). http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=589067 It's still very much unsure though. If you want the condensed version, start from post 68.

I'm actually quite interested myself, as if I could get the car later (i.e. a MY 2013 one), I could use my funds for something else I really would like to do first.

[Titanium Silver]

Originally Posted by parham2652

I know a V6 will save on fuel consumption, but I do not care about that.

It will likely have an insane amount of torque compared to the current S65 motor in addition to better fuel consumption.

Originally Posted by parham2652

Money is not an issue.

You may be able to afford either, or may not make it much of a consideration in this particular deal, but...

Money is always an issue.

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by Titanium Silver

You may be able to afford either, or may not make it much of a consideration in this particular deal, but...

Money is always an issue.

True, but what I meant was that I would rather pay more and compromise financially than compromise on the car.

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by JulieDriving

MY = "model year"

Production of MY 2012 E92 M3's stop in June of 2012.

It's still unknown whether there will be a (likely short) production run of MY 2013 coupes.

This thread contains the most info we have to date on that possibility, including posts from a couple of insiders (Scott26 & mapezzul). http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=589067 It's still very much unsure though. If you want the condensed version, start from post 68.

I'm actually quite interested myself, as if I could get the car later (i.e. a MY 2013 one), I could use my funds for something else I really would like to do first.

thanks for the thread, but don't care too much about the MY being 2013; price would be higher for no reason. I don't even care about getting a 2011 M3 as long as it is new with the options and colors I want.


The only differences would be the way options are packaged or something small like BMW Apps was added recently. It is not going to be a major thing like LCI light change (although I really would love BMW to include the LED lights from the non-M E92 LCI on the M3 why isn't it even an option?)

Right?

[benn.]

just get a GTR.. that's what i'm doing

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by benn.

just get a GTR.. that's what i'm doing

Lol. That's what I was thinking of, but the cost is higher and I don't want a car for just for specs and racing. I love the E92's style and technology (speakers, iDrive, iPod integration etc.). I want a balance between luxury, design, and sport = E92 M3

[esquire]

Originally Posted by parham2652

I'm a bit confused about what you are saying about ED. Are you saying financially the discounts won't play that much affect unless I end up buying the car? And what do you mean about the 3 months? I don't mind waiting if thats what you are saying. My current 328 is amazing.


The main reason I was thinking ED is because the great savings (so I might as well tour Europe too, never been). That's what I was thinking. If I save less than $2k over the 3 year period on a lease, then it is not worth it too me. 14% off is a lot if that number is precise.

yes. that's exactly what i'm saying. when you lease a car you are only financing the amount that depreciates, not the entire amount. for simplicity's sake let's just say that amount is 40% (which is not correct, do some research and find out for yourself exactly what the residual amount is, and for the sake of this calculation subtract it from 100% to see what amount you'd be financing).

now let's say your ED car ends up being 7000 dollars cheaper than if you had bought it here (non-ED purchase). well since you're leasing you wouldn't realize that full 7000 dollar savings. you'd only be saving 40% of that 7000, or in other words 2800 dollars.

then take into account the cost of your ED trip, the delay in getting the car, and the 1 month payment you'll have to make before you even receive the car and it's likely you won't be saving anything. you might even be losing money.

if you end up negotiating an ED discount greater than that, that's another story ,you'll have to do the math on that. but i think the results will be about the same.

the point being that unless you end up purchasing the ED car outright, you wont be saving the kind of money on ED with a lease that would make the trip worth it FINANCIALLY speaking. (of course there's value to the trip aside from the financial savings. i.e. memories, pictures, experiences etc etc).

DISCLAIMER: the math is technically a little more complicated than what i've presented above as far as calculating actual cost/savings. but for the purposes of this excercise, it's a good indicator of whether ED is the way to go or not.


hope that helps,
- esquire

[parham2652]

Originally Posted by esquire

yes. that's exactly what i'm saying. when you lease a car you are only financing the amount that depreciates, not the entire amount. for simplicity's sake let's just say that amount is 40% (which is not correct, do some research and find out for yourself exactly what the residual amount is, and for the sake of this calculation subtract it from 100% to see what amount you'd be financing).

now let's say your ED car ends up being 7000 dollars cheaper than if you had bought it here (non-ED purchase). well since you're leasing you wouldn't realize that full 7000 dollar savings. you'd only be saving 40% of that 7000, or in other words 2800 dollars.

then take into account the cost of your ED trip, the delay in getting the car, and the 1 month payment you'll have to make before you even receive the car and it's likely you won't be saving anything. you might even be losing money.

if you end up negotiating an ED discount greater than that, that's another story ,you'll have to do the math on that. but i think the results will be about the same.

the point being that unless you end up purchasing the ED car outright, you wont be saving the kind of money on ED with a lease that would make the trip worth it FINANCIALLY speaking. (of course there's value to the trip aside from the financial savings. i.e. memories, pictures, experiences etc etc).

DISCLAIMER: the math is technically a little more complicated than what i've presented above as far as calculating actual cost/savings. but for the purposes of this excercise, it's a good indicator of whether ED is the way to go or not.


hope that helps,
- esquire

Thanks for the help. That's exactly what I was understanding, just wanted confirmation.

I think I will just wait toward the end of the E92 M3 production and go from there. If I do ED, I definitely want to buy the car (so perhaps I should go with next generation M3 b/c the E92 will age and have low resell value if I decide to get the next gen M3 and sell the E92).

[parham2652]

What are your thoughts on me buying my current 328 at the end of it's lease and just waiting a couple years more for the next gen M3?
I would buy the next gen M3 with ED if at all.

I have had my coupe since about February 2011 and by the time the second or third year next gen M3 comes out in the USA it will be about 2016?

here is some info on my car...

328i coupé
alpine white on coral red
M-Sport with the 193m wheels + paddle shifters
Navigation
Convenience Package
Premium Package
Harman Kardon speakers
Heated seats
Smartphone Integration

matte black grille
m3 style lip spoiler
tints 35%
clear reflectors
white side lights
other minor stuff, nothing major, just cosmetics really


So thoughts on ^^^ ?

EDIT: it's honestly perfectly equipped and i love it

[stefan]

I would get the E92. Personally, I believe there is a good chance you might not enjoy the turbo experience. At least then you will still have your minty E9x to fall back on. You can always sell the E92 as well. It won't take as much of a hit as a lot of people are predicting. Yeah you're going to lose a bit, but not as much as you'd lose by not driving one of these cars from now until then!

[Prophizee]

There is a lot of factors that play in for the cars resale value. For example if it is the last m3 coupe that will make it's resale value go up. It being the first and last v8 engine would make the the resale value go up. Now don't get me wrong you will still take a hit but not as bad as everyone thinks. Also If you do get the e92 m3 by the time the f82 has it's kinks fixed your e92 will be just be finishing it's financing terms, which means you sell it, and use that money to put a down payment on the new f82.

[parham2652]

Both good points guys. I think I'm just going to wait until spring and see what's up then. I keep on getting mixed thoughts.