Illegal Immigration Poll!

[f80]

Lets hear it folks...and please let's NOT call it "UNDOCUMENTED", it's illegal, OK!

Disregard #4. I can't delete it.

[Neurorad]

A thread where I can bitch about the bitchers...

Illegal immigrant take your job? Your poolboy doesn't speak English?

Illegal aliens in the headlines is SCAPEGOATING, taking the public's attention away from the more important issues.

Seriously, what's changed in the last 10 years? Illegals performing U.S. citizens' shitty jobs, below minimum wage, has worked quite well. The money lost in tax revenue is made up back at the store; you'd pay $8 for a head of lettuce if it was picked by a U.S. citizen in a labor union, working at minimum wage.

If the illegals became citizens, and were to receive minimum wage, the U.S. farming industry would tank; retail prices would soar.

The real problem is for the illegal aliens, working like dogs and getting paid for shit.

[f80]

Lets give them amnesty!!! Cash too!!! What about legal college graduate immigrants that spend 5-10 years trying to get green cards? Damn fools. Morons that pay taxes.

Are we a country of laws or not?

People CHOOSE to come to this country. They DON'T have to. When they do it illegally, they break the law.

Did you know that US has diversity visa program? It's green card lottery.
Go ahead, check it out.

We award 55,000 green cards annually to high school graduates. Yet legal immigrants with advanced degrees that have been here on a working visa wait 5-7 years to get a green card.

I agree that there is no good legal way for unskilled workers to come here. There should be a guest worker program. Until then, laws have to be obayed.
Illegal immigrants should be fined.

What happened to this country? Pussification caused by political correctness? We can’t hurt anyone’s feelings?
Try and cross Swiss border and survive illegally. AYFKM?

[magmd]

Why does your solution not include anything about the people that employ these immigrants??

Maybe because you are short-sighted when laying sole blame the illegals for these problems.

Well, if the citizens of the US were not so willing to hire out labor for the cheapest amount...just to make the most profit, then these workers would not really have a reason to come to this country.

I am tired of listening to people bitch about the problem, and blame the immigrants while completely failing to realize that this is purely a supply and demand phenomenon. If we did not have a demand for cheap ass workforce..the supply of immigrants would not be here.

You should blame your fellow citizens, and start penalizing, jailing, putting out strict fines to those that employ @ the farms, workshops, custodial, and construction industries.

In addition, you should look at the evergrowing lazy young americans that waste their time in various levels of education. In the last 10-20 years, everyone feels that college education is an entitlement. Maybe there should be a program for students that are not able to perform academically to a certain level..to then be retrained into manual labor/technical industries instead. So that you can fill the workforce that you are trying to deport.

[its ray den]

i'd rather work on securing the borders so people can't sneak in as easily. i would allow the current illegals to stay as long as they're not criminals and what not. if they get arrested for a felony crime, they should be deported.

if these people could make good citizens, i have no problem allowing them to stay and work on getting their green card.

[Sara504]

Originally Posted by e90im

Lets hear it folks...and please let's NOT call it "UNDOCUMENTED", it's illigal, OK!

Disregard #4. I can't delete it.

ILLEGAL

[!Xoible]

what's the difference between the last 2? or just to split the count

[AndrewAZ]

I think we have this fear but its the wrong fear... We should be more worried about the muslims and how we are catering to their religion slowly, looks at london and various other european countries with large populations of muslims they can no longer control them. On the other hand most of the building in the USA and a large portion of our agriculture are done by mexicans, they are really honest true hard working folks for the most part, the issue is the ones that break the law need to be deported along with the drug trade stopped across the boarder. We need to make a program for the hard honest working folks so they pay taxes ect so our schools and medical and various other areas are not hurt by giving free services to illegals who are not paying.

[drF80]

Originally Posted by AndrewAZ

I think we have this fear but its the wrong fear... We should be more worried about the muslims and how we are catering to their religion slowly, looks at london and various other european countries with large populations of muslims they can no longer control them. On the other hand most of the building in the USA and a large portion of our agriculture are done by mexicans, they are really honest true hard working folks for the most part, the issue is the ones that break the law need to be deported along with the drug trade stopped across the boarder. We need to make a program for the hard honest working folks so they pay taxes ect so our schools and medical and various other areas are not hurt by giving free services to illegals who are not paying.

???
WOW, FOX news should not be allowed at all!
Go travel to the cities you know by name and learn a little bit about their history and culture.
I hate to say but you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about (including the other thread where you analyze how great it is to have $10T debt...)...

[AndrewAZ]

Originally Posted by dr325i

???
WOW, FOX news should not be allowed at all!
Go travel to the cities you know by name and learn a little bit about their history and culture.
I hate to say but you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about (including the other thread where you analyze how great it is to have $10T debt...)...

I have lived in Arizona my entire life. I have seen first hand how illegal immigration has taken a toll on my state, both in terms of crime and financially. I used to be like you and a lot of folks who were extremely outraged.

I do support kicking out the illegals who commit any crime.
But we have to face the facts we cant kick everyone out its not possible we just dont have the man power or the money to do it. We need to stop the illegal immigration first, then make a good program that makes it easier for the honest working folks to come here, most of them work here for a few years and send money back to their family then go back, only a small percentage stay here.

Again the issue needs to be looked at more, we need to be realistic here and figure out a plan that is feasible not something that sounds good.

But radical islam is more of a treat, just look at london and the muslim communities that ignore the laws, for the most part the mexican illegals here stay out of the trouble and only want jobs and economic benefit for their families back home. I am not worried about a mexican illegal immigrant committing acts of terrorism and apparently neither is our government. On the other hand the radical Islamic only benefit in their eyes for terrorist attacks.


But again look at the poll choices.. $10k fine... The average middle class American doesnt have $10k lying around. $10k is probably an entire years wage for an illegal worker and after paying for housing and food little is left.

Deport them- we dont have the man power to deport 12 million people, that like deporting the entire state of Arizona twice.

$5k fine... Come on....

[f80]

^^^

I agree that my poll choices are grotesque and unrealistic. However, so are many laws, like law against illegal substances, etc. Does that mean that there are no pot smokers in US?

I created this thread (I admit it is half-ass poll) to start a debate.
What would your poll choices look like?

[!Xoible]

yah the poll options are nowhere near a "solution" they all suck IMO for both the country and for the immigrants.

[3onDubs]

I don't see a "deploy snipers on the border" option anywhere

[Neurorad]

Originally Posted by e90im

I created this thread (I admit it is half-ass poll) to start a debate. What would your poll choices look like?

a. Increase border security and grant citizenship.
b. Increase border security and grant half-assed citizenship.
c. Increase border security and grant some type of citizenship with a fine/tax (turn them into indentured servants for 10 years).

[dlwhite]

Just imagine if the Native American had enforced an Immigration policy!

[3onDubs]

Originally Posted by dlwhite

Just imagine if the Native American had enforced an Immigration policy!

I believe they tried to (correct me if i'm wrong)



....also, they didn't have the socal traffic problem back then

[f80]

Originally Posted by Neurorad

a. Increase border security and grant citizenship.
b. Increase border security and grant half-assed citizenship.
c. Increase border security and grant some type of citizenship with a fine/tax (turn them into indentured servants for 10 years).

How about grant work permit, that could lead to green card, that could lead to citizenship.

There are many LEGAL immigrants that wait up to 15 years for citizenship. They'd be pretty pissed.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by Neurorad

A thread where I can bitch about the bitchers...

Illegal immigrant take your job? Your poolboy doesn't speak English?

Illegal aliens in the headlines is SCAPEGOATING, taking the public's attention away from the more important issues.

Seriously, what's changed in the last 10 years? Illegals performing U.S. citizens' shitty jobs, below minimum wage, has worked quite well. The money lost in tax revenue is made up back at the store; you'd pay $8 for a head of lettuce if it was picked by a U.S. citizen in a labor union, working at minimum wage.

If the illegals became citizens, and were to receive minimum wage, the U.S. farming industry would tank; retail prices would soar.

The real problem is for the illegal aliens, working like dogs and getting paid for shit.

Apparently you don't have any kids. There is a huge problem for 14-18 year old kids trying to get jobs for the exact same reasons you mentioned. I don't think we should sacrifice our own jobs for an ILLEGAL immigrant.

I would chose #2 but with a higher penalty because it takes so long to catch most of them.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by AndrewAZ

II do support kicking out the illegals who commit any crime.
But we have to face the facts we cant kick everyone out its not possible we just dont have the man power or the money to do it. We need to stop the illegal immigration first, then make a good program that makes it easier for the honest working folks to come here, most of them work here for a few years and send money back to their family then go back, only a small percentage stay here.

I agree with the first part but I doubt they would ever go back after making as much as they would here. More likely they would do as the chinese do and open a half assed restaurant and have the whole family come and work for it. There are about 35 chinese restaurants in Des Moines alone!

[its ray den]

i agree with e90im. the illegal immigrants should not get a free ride, or an easier time than those in this country under work visas.

the current process to gain citizenship is pretty messed up, so part of the reform plan i would like to see would be to make this process more efficient so people aren't waiting over 5 years for their papers to be processed. during this time, they are pretty much enslaved to the employer sponsoring their H1 visas.

[AndrewAZ]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Apparently you don't have any kids. There is a huge problem for 14-18 year old kids trying to get jobs for the exact same reasons you mentioned. I don't think we should sacrifice our own jobs for an ILLEGAL immigrant.

I would chose #2 but with a higher penalty because it takes so long to catch most of them.

What jobs? Plenty of jobs for high school kids.. Illegals are mostly doing agriculture and clean up work. Thing you dont what your high school student doing.. They are not working at your local sun glass hut or polo store in the mall or gap ect.

[AndrewAZ]

Originally Posted by e90im

^^^

I agree that my poll choices are grotesque and unrealistic. However, so are many laws, like law against illegal substances, etc. Does that mean that there are no pot smokers in US?

I created this thread (I admit it is half-ass poll) to start a debate.
What would your poll choices look like?

I wouldnt really have a poll since the only realistic option I am about to list below.

1. Kick out all the illegals who commit crimes, an illegal shouldn't be convicted of a DUI multiple times and not get deported then end up killing a family.
2. Create a guest worker program that is practical for works to come up and do the jobs Americans wont do.
3. With the guest worker program they will be forced now to pay taxes since we have info on them, so that solves the issue of education and healthcare funding, since now they will be paying for schools and now they can go to a doctor not the hospital to get treatment saving everyone money.
4. Have a program for honest workers that after 5 years of problem free working in the USA they can apply for citizenship, since in effect they have paid taxes for 5 years aka the hidden fine and have shown they contribute positively to the community without getting into trouble.