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      06-08-2014, 09:39 AM   #1
blankstar43
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Summit Point fatal accident

Bad day at summit point , be safe out there everyone

http://www.your4state.com/story/d/st...t0W3CDbMCgcDbA
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      06-08-2014, 09:49 AM   #2
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always hate hearing this stuff
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      06-08-2014, 11:00 AM   #3
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Awful. I heard it was on Jefferson circuit. I once drove that for an entire weekend in the pouring rain. A lot of the runoff is downhill grass, some with trees at the end of it. Pretty terrifying.

I'm going to be at Summit on the main track at the end of July. Just had an event last week at NJMP Thunderbolt with ZERO incidents in the student groups. Hoping for another one like that.

Safe driving out there you guys.
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      06-08-2014, 11:54 AM   #4
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Eh, absolutely terrible.
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      06-08-2014, 12:15 PM   #5
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Damn that sucks. Pretty rare occurrence. Street driving is more dangerous.
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      06-08-2014, 03:50 PM   #6
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so sorry to hear about this, I feel for the family! massive respect for instructors, they literally put their lives on the line every time they get into a passenger seat.
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      06-08-2014, 04:14 PM   #7
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Very sorry to hear about this. I agree with the above poster, instructors risk every time they sit in a passinger seat with an uknown driver usually with limited driving skills at the track.
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      06-08-2014, 04:53 PM   #8
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RIP. The driver must feel awful.
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      06-08-2014, 04:59 PM   #9
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Quote:
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RIP. The driver must feel awful.
Agreed
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      06-08-2014, 05:44 PM   #10
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Let me start off saying that this is an unfortunate incident. I can't find any more details so I'll leave the particulars of what happened later on.

Here's a link to the event...

http://hyper-fest.com/

I've always said this...be careful who you DE with. It is a growing activity...more and more people are getting into it for a wider range of reasons. I've noticed this over the past 3 years in TX. I'm seeing more and more "advanced" drivers and "instructors" exhibiting very troubling behavior. I think most DE orgs have the wrong the definition of an advanced driver. An advanced driver is 1. SAFE 2. PREDICTABLE 3. AWARE. 4. COURTEOUS and 5. FAST.

Notice how fast is last. Speed differentials are meaningless within a group if drivers have the first 4 attributes. I've been on a 3.1 mile track with about 45 cars...don't have an issue if people are safe, predictable, aware, and courteous.

As an instructor...I would have had 2nd thoughts about associating myself with this event. First clue is the Daisy Dukes contest. That would tell me its a show off fest with some adrenaline added in. I can't see how that turns out good. Second is a one-off event generally has VERY poor vetting of drivers and instructors.
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      06-08-2014, 05:52 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post

<snip>

I've always said this...be careful who you DE with.


This is worth repeating. Sponsors and programs are NOT pretty much the same. Some events are disorganized affairs with few controls, a shoulder shrug to safety and little emphasis on education and improvement.

There are sponsors that I will not instruct with.

Choose the programs that you participate in with care.
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      06-09-2014, 12:15 AM   #12
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+1 That's why I'm mainly only running with PCA, POC, and BMW CCA.
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      06-09-2014, 12:23 AM   #13
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Very well said!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
Let me start off saying that this is an unfortunate incident. I can't find any more details so I'll leave the particulars of what happened later on.

Here's a link to the event...

http://hyper-fest.com/

I've always said this...be careful who you DE with. It is a growing activity...more and more people are getting into it for a wider range of reasons. I've noticed this over the past 3 years in TX. I'm seeing more and more "advanced" drivers and "instructors" exhibiting very troubling behavior. I think most DE orgs have the wrong the definition of an advanced driver. An advanced driver is 1. SAFE 2. PREDICTABLE 3. AWARE. 4. COURTEOUS and 5. FAST.

Notice how fast is last. Speed differentials are meaningless within a group if drivers have the first 4 attributes. I've been on a 3.1 mile track with about 45 cars...don't have an issue if people are safe, predictable, aware, and courteous.

As an instructor...I would have had 2nd thoughts about associating myself with this event. First clue is the Daisy Dukes contest. That would tell me its a show off fest with some adrenaline added in. I can't see how that turns out good. Second is a one-off event generally has VERY poor vetting of drivers and instructors.
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      06-09-2014, 01:24 AM   #14
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All said well above. Can someone explain the tree? RIP
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      06-09-2014, 08:45 AM   #15
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Another issue that needs to be addressed at Hyper-Fest /Hyper Drive events are the fact that they venue serves alcohol to everyone and I even saw under-age drinking with the groups that camped out there.

My instructor with BSR at Jefferson told me his concern that they had no way of knowing if the students had anything to drink.

Further more, the students were horrible; not only were they driving offline and had horrible driving lines; it was the attitudes they had of just wanting to go fast and not letting people pass! (espcially that green java M3, that red corvette and that SRT-8 Chrystler 300)

I had two sessions and decided to give my other session away because of how I felt the groups were way unsafe!

My biggest pet peeve that day were how students would not give clear point bys- there was so much attitude on how they did them too!
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      06-09-2014, 09:39 AM   #16
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Wasn't this a NASA event? I have never done an event with them, but isn't the consensus that, in general, NASAis a very good organization? This seems to be some sort of special, one-off event so maybe it's different. But some of the best drivers I've met instruct for NASA (in addition to PCA and BMW CCA) and have praised the group's organization.
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      06-09-2014, 01:49 PM   #17
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Additional details: confirmed Jefferson Circuit, apparently turn 5.

+1 on choosing DE organizations wisely. Can't go wrong with BMW CCA and/or PCA. By reason of the name alone, I would not attend something called "hyper fest."
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      06-09-2014, 02:24 PM   #18
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i think we all have a little bit of the it wont happen to me syndrome to be able to love this hobby.
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      06-09-2014, 02:52 PM   #19
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Turn 5 of the Jeff is a downhill left leading to the short back straight. The rear of the car will be a little light from the slope and throttle management coming off the apex is an issue. Rumor has it the student floored it at the apex and spun. There is some run-off room there but not a ton before the grass gives way to trees. Weekend before last there was a backhoe making a big hole in that area to fix something (PCA got moved to the other track because of this) and it may have been muddy to boot.

This is very sad to hear about. Lately the fatalities I hear about seem to be the right seat not the left. NASA reportedly runs some good stuff (like the Spec E30 series on this coast) but their Hyperfest is sui generis
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      06-09-2014, 06:10 PM   #20
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Jalopnik article: http://jalopnik.com/instructor-kille...1588064352/all
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      06-09-2014, 07:16 PM   #21
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This sent a big chill up my spine, as I'm in the right seats @ HPDEs...

As Bigjae & Estoril mention above--the organization should be competent in choosing instructors & advancing drivers.

I instruct for PCA down iin the SE & they don't mess around w/ safety & qualifications.

RIP...
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      06-09-2014, 08:20 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Day Laborer
Another issue that needs to be addressed at Hyper-Fest /Hyper Drive events are the fact that they venue serves alcohol to everyone and I even saw under-age drinking with the groups that camped out there.

My instructor with BSR at Jefferson told me his concern that they had no way of knowing if the students had anything to drink.
See, I didn't know alcohol was out there. Not a direct factor but surely that would be an indicator that this event is not meant to be educational.

Like I said...there are clues. The very first indication is the Driver's meeting. That really sums up what the organizer values and how well prepared they are. I'm willing to bet that the drivers meeting at this event was a sh1tshow.

Drivers seem to think running a track event is easy. It's not.
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