BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications
 
European Auto Source
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-26-2011, 04:26 PM   #89
Brandon26pdx
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Drives: 2011 135i
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Portland, OR

Posts: 1,938
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge2Dub View Post
Interesting. Our local 100 octane fuel station has VP Racing insignias over all of the pumps and on their marque. Google states that it is a Chevron, but Chevron doesn't list them as being apart of their network.

Check out the streetview below and tell me what you think?

Clicky!
I'd totally be filling my car up there all the time if they sold unleaded 100 from the pump!
Brandon26pdx is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-06-2011, 06:43 PM   #90
guess2098
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2010 AW M6
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Rowland Heights, CA

Posts: 186
iTrader: (1)

got vp ms109 today 5 gal mix with half tank of 91 .... super stuff. i think i am starting burning money on gas from now on
guess2098 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-07-2011, 03:18 AM   #91
0-60Motorsports
Major
 
0-60Motorsports's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW M3 JB 04 Coupe
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Kingdom of Bahrain

Posts: 1,248
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via AIM to 0-60Motorsports Send a message via MSN to 0-60Motorsports Send a message via Yahoo to 0-60Motorsports
What octane would i get if I put a 5 gallon VP Motorsport 109 (Motor Octane: 101, Research Octane: 109) or torco 100 UL (M.O.N. 97 • R.O.N. 104) with the rest of the tank filled up with 91?
__________________
Current Mods: GC Coilovers, Eibach Sways, PF RTABs, RE RCAs, INTRAVEE II + Alpine KCA-420i, Black Roundels, ///MFEST Badges, Depo's, Screen protector for OEM 16:9 display, VCSL Bumper + Race Lip + CF Boot + CF Rear Diffusor, DIETZ TV in Motion, SuperSprint V1 Headers + Catless S-pipes + Res Sec 2 + Race Exhaust, Z8 Starter Button, Lamin-X, OME CSL Steering, OEM CSL Interior, OEM CSL Intake, OEM CSL Roof, EVOLVE Alpha-N, BBS CH's, LIGHTWERKZ....
0-60Motorsports is offline   Bahrain
0
Reply With Quote
      08-07-2011, 12:11 PM   #92
guess2098
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2010 AW M6
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Rowland Heights, CA

Posts: 186
iTrader: (1)

tank 15-16gal. fill 5 gal 109 and 10 gal 91 gives you
(91*2+109)/3 = 97
guess2098 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-07-2011, 01:24 PM   #93
0-60Motorsports
Major
 
0-60Motorsports's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW M3 JB 04 Coupe
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Kingdom of Bahrain

Posts: 1,248
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via AIM to 0-60Motorsports Send a message via MSN to 0-60Motorsports Send a message via Yahoo to 0-60Motorsports
Quote:
Originally Posted by guess2098 View Post
tank 15-16gal. fill 5 gal 109 and 10 gal 91 gives you
(91*2+109)/3 = 97
Thanks Brother!
__________________
Current Mods: GC Coilovers, Eibach Sways, PF RTABs, RE RCAs, INTRAVEE II + Alpine KCA-420i, Black Roundels, ///MFEST Badges, Depo's, Screen protector for OEM 16:9 display, VCSL Bumper + Race Lip + CF Boot + CF Rear Diffusor, DIETZ TV in Motion, SuperSprint V1 Headers + Catless S-pipes + Res Sec 2 + Race Exhaust, Z8 Starter Button, Lamin-X, OME CSL Steering, OEM CSL Interior, OEM CSL Intake, OEM CSL Roof, EVOLVE Alpha-N, BBS CH's, LIGHTWERKZ....
0-60Motorsports is offline   Bahrain
0
Reply With Quote
      08-07-2011, 03:55 PM   #94
1MOREMOD
2014 Track Days - 6|Ridge 1:54:61|Pacific 1:35:72
 
1MOREMOD's Avatar
 
Drives: Race car->
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: check your mirrors

Posts: 11,742
iTrader: (5)

Can't find those original dynos by pencilgeek showing the improvments with higher octane gas. Earlier on in my ownership I ran a straight 100 octane thru and didn't notice much of anything other than the price. I seem to remember it being stated that several tanks needed to go thru for the benefit due to the ecu learning as you go. Wasn't looking for less jerkiness at the time just extra power.
__________________

02 Tiag e46 M3|6MT|GC plates|MCS c.o.|GC bars|GC race control arms|GC bushings & bearings|BW eng. & tran. mounts|subframe kit|BW race shifter|BW Jaffster|Euro header|BW race|K&N c.a.i.|Epic race tune|Rouge pulleys|Seibon CF hood|CSL bumper|ST-40|XR-2|SS lines|half cage|Recaro profi|Profi 2 harness|BMWpedals|BW studs|
1MOREMOD is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-07-2011, 04:45 PM   #95
dcstep
Brigadier General
 
Drives: '09 Cpe Silverstone FR 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Colorado

Posts: 4,792
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 M3  [4.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
Can't find those original dynos by pencilgeek showing the improvments with higher octane gas. Earlier on in my ownership I ran a straight 100 octane thru and didn't notice much of anything other than the price. I seem to remember it being stated that several tanks needed to go thru for the benefit due to the ecu learning as you go. Wasn't looking for less jerkiness at the time just extra power.
When I ran my comparitive test it only took a few miles for the ECU to adjust. You need a dyno to measure it. Butt dynos don't work.
__________________
dcstep is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 02:45 AM   #96
1MOREMOD
2014 Track Days - 6|Ridge 1:54:61|Pacific 1:35:72
 
1MOREMOD's Avatar
 
Drives: Race car->
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: check your mirrors

Posts: 11,742
iTrader: (5)

and how much extra power do you make with 100 octane. where is the cut off for the ecu? im guessing around 95-96 it stops making any more power?
__________________

02 Tiag e46 M3|6MT|GC plates|MCS c.o.|GC bars|GC race control arms|GC bushings & bearings|BW eng. & tran. mounts|subframe kit|BW race shifter|BW Jaffster|Euro header|BW race|K&N c.a.i.|Epic race tune|Rouge pulleys|Seibon CF hood|CSL bumper|ST-40|XR-2|SS lines|half cage|Recaro profi|Profi 2 harness|BMWpedals|BW studs|
1MOREMOD is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 10:00 AM   #97
IMG
VT3
 
IMG's Avatar
 
Drives: E36 M3 Track car,Ess E90 M3 DD
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: The Couch

Posts: 6,970
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh
Can't find those original dynos by pencilgeek showing the improvments with higher octane gas. Earlier on in my ownership I ran a straight 100 octane thru and didn't notice much of anything other than the price. I seem to remember it being stated that several tanks needed to go thru for the benefit due to the ecu learning as you go. Wasn't looking for less jerkiness at the time just extra power.
Here you go:
http://bmw.pencilgeek.org/showDyno.php?recID=13
http://www.pencilgeek.org/2008/05/dy...-100-octa.html

You'll notice the version in the is listed as 346whp, and the version at PG's blog is 361whp. This is the same dyno. The difference is the Dyno Database uses the standard "SAE" correction whenever possible, but the version posted at PG's blog used the "Dynapack SAE-Adapted" correction -- which is more like STD correction and produces higher corrected values.
__________________
NO FEAR.NO LIMITS.NO EQUAL

Ess VT3 LC built motor,Volk TE37SL,Euro taillights,Dinan Xpipe,Custom Headers,Akra axle back CF tips,ModeCarbon FR lip,BMW CF wing
LOW BOOST 60-130 6.7 sec
IMG is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 01:25 PM   #98
dcstep
Brigadier General
 
Drives: '09 Cpe Silverstone FR 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Colorado

Posts: 4,792
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 M3  [4.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
and how much extra power do you make with 100 octane. where is the cut off for the ecu? im guessing around 95-96 it stops making any more power?
At 5400 ft above sea level, which I am, you're right. I peak around 95-96 octane; however, at sea-level, as demonstrated by PG and others, it seems to be more like 100-octane.

At 96 I start losing hp. At 100-octane my rwhp is lower than with 91-octane!!!

Dave
__________________
dcstep is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 03:59 PM   #99
1MOREMOD
2014 Track Days - 6|Ridge 1:54:61|Pacific 1:35:72
 
1MOREMOD's Avatar
 
Drives: Race car->
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: check your mirrors

Posts: 11,742
iTrader: (5)

so about 30hp gain that is nice. add that in with a tune and exhaust and your getting into 400hp at the wheels territory.
__________________

02 Tiag e46 M3|6MT|GC plates|MCS c.o.|GC bars|GC race control arms|GC bushings & bearings|BW eng. & tran. mounts|subframe kit|BW race shifter|BW Jaffster|Euro header|BW race|K&N c.a.i.|Epic race tune|Rouge pulleys|Seibon CF hood|CSL bumper|ST-40|XR-2|SS lines|half cage|Recaro profi|Profi 2 harness|BMWpedals|BW studs|
1MOREMOD is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 06:17 PM   #100
guess2098
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2010 AW M6
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Rowland Heights, CA

Posts: 186
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcstep View Post
At 5400 ft above sea level, which I am, you're right. I peak around 95-96 octane; however, at sea-level, as demonstrated by PG and others, it seems to be more like 100-octane.

At 96 I start losing hp. At 100-octane my rwhp is lower than with 91-octane!!!

Dave
I dont get it here, why does 100 octane give lower hp than 91 octane? some ppl said it just runs like 96 but paying extra more.
guess2098 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 07:05 PM   #101
Dave07997S
Colonel
 
Drives: 2013 BMW M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Playa del Rey, CA

Posts: 2,418
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by guess2098 View Post
I dont get it here, why does 100 octane give lower hp than 91 octane? some ppl said it just runs like 96 but paying extra more.
Less octane is required at higher altitudes. There is a point of no return, for the M3s S65 motor and DME it is around 95.5 octane.

Dave
__________________
2013 M3 Coupe-MR/BLK ZCP, ACM test pipes, BPM Stg2 dev. tune and Megan catback, AFE Stg2. with C/F elbow
Previous rides: 2011 M3 Coupe-MR/Blk
2007 Porsche 997C2S Speed Yellow/Blk sport seats
2004 BMW M3 Imola/Blk
Dave07997S is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 07:07 PM   #102
Dave07997S
Colonel
 
Drives: 2013 BMW M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Playa del Rey, CA

Posts: 2,418
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdosu View Post
wow, I may be moving to California in a year. I am not looking forward to this. My car has been filled with 93 Shell consistantly for it's life...
Quite a few stations have 100+ octane available...here is a site to help you out.

http://www.davebarton.com/Unleaded_Racing_Fuel_in_SoCal

Dave
__________________
2013 M3 Coupe-MR/BLK ZCP, ACM test pipes, BPM Stg2 dev. tune and Megan catback, AFE Stg2. with C/F elbow
Previous rides: 2011 M3 Coupe-MR/Blk
2007 Porsche 997C2S Speed Yellow/Blk sport seats
2004 BMW M3 Imola/Blk
Dave07997S is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 07:11 PM   #103
1MOREMOD
2014 Track Days - 6|Ridge 1:54:61|Pacific 1:35:72
 
1MOREMOD's Avatar
 
Drives: Race car->
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: check your mirrors

Posts: 11,742
iTrader: (5)

i need some here in washington also. only place i know is pacific raceways but thats a tank of gas to get there kind of defeats the purpose
__________________

02 Tiag e46 M3|6MT|GC plates|MCS c.o.|GC bars|GC race control arms|GC bushings & bearings|BW eng. & tran. mounts|subframe kit|BW race shifter|BW Jaffster|Euro header|BW race|K&N c.a.i.|Epic race tune|Rouge pulleys|Seibon CF hood|CSL bumper|ST-40|XR-2|SS lines|half cage|Recaro profi|Profi 2 harness|BMWpedals|BW studs|
1MOREMOD is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-10-2011, 07:42 PM   #104
Dave07997S
Colonel
 
Drives: 2013 BMW M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Playa del Rey, CA

Posts: 2,418
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
i need some here in washington also. only place i know is pacific raceways but thats a tank of gas to get there kind of defeats the purpose
contact VP racing distributor..

http://www.vpracingfuels.com/vp-racing-dealers.html
__________________
2013 M3 Coupe-MR/BLK ZCP, ACM test pipes, BPM Stg2 dev. tune and Megan catback, AFE Stg2. with C/F elbow
Previous rides: 2011 M3 Coupe-MR/Blk
2007 Porsche 997C2S Speed Yellow/Blk sport seats
2004 BMW M3 Imola/Blk
Dave07997S is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-11-2011, 11:05 AM   #105
guess2098
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2010 AW M6
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Rowland Heights, CA

Posts: 186
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
Less octane is required at higher altitudes. There is a point of no return, for the M3s S65 motor and DME it is around 95.5 octane.

Dave
thanks. lucky i am at CA not CO
guess2098 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-22-2011, 12:07 PM   #106
Zba
Lieutenant
 
Zba's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011.685 E92 M3
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Denver, CO

Posts: 557
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2011.5 M3  [4.87]
After reading this thread I went to the drags last week with four gallons of Shell 91, and put three gallons of Sunoco 104 at the strip. Now this was my second time to the strip so everything with my driving was fairly equal.

I don't remember what the weather was like the first time either, but I ran the same ET with a 1 mph lower trap speed. I do remember the DA was between 6k-7k while this past week was 8k-9k+ with a mid 80's temp.

Either way, not what I was really expecting based on the reading and PencilGeeks dyno charts.

I did find out about a station that sells 100 in a town nearby so I may try a few gallons of that a day or two before I go back to the track.
Zba is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-22-2011, 08:44 PM   #107
Dave07997S
Colonel
 
Drives: 2013 BMW M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Playa del Rey, CA

Posts: 2,418
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zba View Post
After reading this thread I went to the drags last week with four gallons of Shell 91, and put three gallons of Sunoco 104 at the strip. Now this was my second time to the strip so everything with my driving was fairly equal.

I don't remember what the weather was like the first time either, but I ran the same ET with a 1 mph lower trap speed. I do remember the DA was between 6k-7k while this past week was 8k-9k+ with a mid 80's temp.

Either way, not what I was really expecting based on the reading and PencilGeeks dyno charts.

I did find out about a station that sells 100 in a town nearby so I may try a few gallons of that a day or two before I go back to the track.
It will take at least a 1/4 tank before your motor will make adjustments. However, going back to 91 it is noticeable pretty quickly as your cars knock sensor will start going off and pulling some timing.

Keep in mind the S65's 414hp rating US SAE is with 93 octane..it says so right in the manual. There is a gain to be had by going to 93 octane...it diminishes after this though.

I see you are in Denver and the altitude of Denver will probably make anything above 91 octane a waste.
__________________
2013 M3 Coupe-MR/BLK ZCP, ACM test pipes, BPM Stg2 dev. tune and Megan catback, AFE Stg2. with C/F elbow
Previous rides: 2011 M3 Coupe-MR/Blk
2007 Porsche 997C2S Speed Yellow/Blk sport seats
2004 BMW M3 Imola/Blk
Dave07997S is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-22-2011, 10:43 PM   #108
Zba
Lieutenant
 
Zba's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011.685 E92 M3
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Denver, CO

Posts: 557
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2011.5 M3  [4.87]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
It will take at least a 1/4 tank before your motor will make adjustments. However, going back to 91 it is noticeable pretty quickly as your cars knock sensor will start going off and pulling some timing.

Keep in mind the S65's 414hp rating US SAE is with 93 octane..it says so right in the manual. There is a gain to be had by going to 93 octane...it diminishes after this though.

I see you are in Denver and the altitude of Denver will probably make anything above 91 octane a waste.
I have done some research saying that due to our altitude up here, 91 is all high performance cars really need, but given the fact that the S65 is a 12:1 engine, I figured it was worth a shot. It definitely pulls smoother with less dips if you know what I mean, but. not even picking up 1mph at the strip was kind of a bummer.
Zba is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-23-2011, 01:47 AM   #109
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
 
Singletrack's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 12 AW X5d
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Posts: 3,791
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wall$treet View Post
Its actually not true that it takes long at all for your ecu to adapt. It literally adapts within seconds of running the car and a few taps on the gas. You can easily see this if you hook up a computer to your car with the right software while it runs and you can see the changes take place very quickly.

It likely doesn't do much unless the weather is super hot or your running at a track.
Riiiiight. The engine adjusts timing across all throttle positions, loads, and engine speeds by simply running and then blipping the throttle.
Singletrack is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-23-2011, 08:36 AM   #110
dcstep
Brigadier General
 
Drives: '09 Cpe Silverstone FR 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Colorado

Posts: 4,792
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 M3  [4.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
..

I see you are in Denver and the altitude of Denver will probably make anything above 91 octane a waste.
Actually my dyno runs improved up to 96-octane.

Dave
__________________
dcstep is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:11 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST