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      04-14-2011, 12:54 PM   #23
BMRLVR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrad01 View Post
I saw the bearings out of my old engine, there were buggered. The engine had done 30,000 kms. It was a July 2007 build, so it did have the bad bearings and crank that they changed from Nov2008 onward.

Exactly what I am talking about!!!! You said your crank and main bearings were changed and the knock persisted. The cause of the knock and the bad bearings you saw out of your old engine were most likely not bad due to the bearings/crank themselves. It is quite possible the main bearing bores were out of round/tapered in your block which would cause bearing wear and noise and is also the reason why it persisted even after the bearings and crank was changed.

There are two proper ways to do repair a bearing/crank replacement on an engine diagnosed with bad main bearings.

1)Pull the engine out, put the bedplate back on the engine block, torque it down and then take measurements to verify everything is in spec. All of the new crank journals should also be measured to ensure they are in spec. Finally after this is done the bearings and crank should be installed, all mains should have plastigauge placed on them and the bedplate torqued. Once this is done and all of the measurements are within spec on the plastigauge, block and crank. You can be satisfied everything is ok. If this process is not followed then you are only assuming the block, crank and bearings is within spec. (The same process should be followed for the rod bearings, rods and journals but for the sake of this post I am only speaking about the mains)

2)The engine should be replaced with a complete long block. A long block will have all of the measurements I described above done during assembly so when you get it is "SHOULD" be good to go!

To me it seems that every dealer replacing crank and main bearings is not following the proper procedure and myself I would refuse to accept a dealer replacing crank and main bearings on my car without pulling the engine and verifying the block is within specs.
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      04-15-2011, 11:17 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMRLVR View Post
Exactly what I am talking about!!!! You said your crank and main bearings were changed and the knock persisted. The cause of the knock and the bad bearings you saw out of your old engine were most likely not bad due to the bearings/crank themselves. It is quite possible the main bearing bores were out of round/tapered in your block which would cause bearing wear and noise and is also the reason why it persisted even after the bearings and crank was changed.

There are two proper ways to do repair a bearing/crank replacement on an engine diagnosed with bad main bearings.

1)Pull the engine out, put the bedplate back on the engine block, torque it down and then take measurements to verify everything is in spec. All of the new crank journals should also be measured to ensure they are in spec. Finally after this is done the bearings and crank should be installed, all mains should have plastigauge placed on them and the bedplate torqued. Once this is done and all of the measurements are within spec on the plastigauge, block and crank. You can be satisfied everything is ok. If this process is not followed then you are only assuming the block, crank and bearings is within spec. (The same process should be followed for the rod bearings, rods and journals but for the sake of this post I am only speaking about the mains)

2)The engine should be replaced with a complete long block. A long block will have all of the measurements I described above done during assembly so when you get it is "SHOULD" be good to go!

To me it seems that every dealer replacing crank and main bearings is not following the proper procedure and myself I would refuse to accept a dealer replacing crank and main bearings on my car without pulling the engine and verifying the block is within specs.
I'm just curious as to how you would go about asking a dealer to pull your engine and verify the block is within spec? I imagine the average dealer would tell you to take a hike.
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      04-16-2011, 10:54 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX View Post
I'm just curious as to how you would go about asking a dealer to pull your engine and verify the block is within spec? I imagine the average dealer would tell you to take a hike.
I'm pretty sure they'll pull your engine to install the bearings. It's just a matter of them doing the measurements to make sure the block is OK.

Thanks BMRLVR for that insight. Never though the problem could be with the block.

.
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      04-18-2011, 10:00 AM   #26
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is there any connection between premature engine wear and the 16-18K drain intervals?? I always do an oil change out of pocket every 8-9K...
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      04-18-2011, 10:11 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
I'm pretty sure they'll pull your engine to install the bearings. It's just a matter of them doing the measurements to make sure the block is OK.

Thanks BMRLVR for that insight. Never though the problem could be with the block.

.
You can slide new bearings in most engines without removing the block from the car as long as you can get the pan off to get access.
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      04-18-2011, 10:44 AM   #28
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I would ask for a new engine or new car by now. Call BMWNA and tell them what is going on and next I would talk to a lemon lawyer.
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      04-18-2011, 12:31 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX View Post
I'm sorry to jump in on your thread, but I also have a ticking noise near the left and right firewalls when it is running. I purchased the car with 16,000 miles back in october and now have 18,000 miles on it. The ticking has been there since I purchased it and I just assumed it was normal. I thougth it might be an emission control vavle ticking at idle like on my previous cars. Can someone please chime in if the tick tick tick tick sound I hear is normal. You are talking about a steady tick tick tick sound at idle right and not a random clicking like in this video? See below.

I really hope this is not against rules posting another users youtube link. I appologize if it is, but wanted to help out the OP.
That is my car. I went through two 2008 E90 M3s with the same ticking noise. I now have a 2009 that does not have the issue. I was told that they found the problem to be related to the main bearing.

I heard the ticking noise as soon as I had my break in oil change (1200 miles).
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      04-18-2011, 06:18 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
You can slide new bearings in most engines without removing the block from the car as long as you can get the pan off to get access.
Thanks.

I've heard that video many times and can MAYBE hear a faint slapping/ticking sound in it, but it's pretty faint. I think my dealer would laugh at me if I brought it in for that.

.
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      04-18-2011, 06:28 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
Thanks.

I've heard that video many times and can MAYBE hear a faint slapping/ticking sound in it, but it's pretty faint. I think my dealer would laugh at me if I brought it in for that.

.
As the person that filmed the sound, it is not very faint in person. Any tech that has been servicing E9x M3s will know that sound very well. In any case, if anyone wants more context, please feel free to PM me.
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      04-18-2011, 09:54 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
You can slide new bearings in most engines without removing the block from the car as long as you can get the pan off to get access.
This issue needs to have the crank replaced also. The cranks and bearings up to Nov 2008 need replacing.
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      04-19-2011, 10:57 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrad01 View Post
This issue needs to have the crank replaced also. The cranks and bearings up to Nov 2008 need replacing.
Replacing the crank is a big deal, they might as well but a new engine in it.
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      04-24-2011, 02:30 PM   #34
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Newbie here, unfortunately, chiming in on a (possibly) related problem. Bought a 2008 M3 Sedan with 28k on the clock and all dealer records since new. Pristine paint & interior, snatched it up on the spot. Though the car was just serviced (oil, included), while driving from work, noticed the car had a very rough idle and reduced power. Service Engine Soon (or something to that effect) light went on, and I headed for the dealership. I will note this is after less than 1 month of ownership, and about 600 miles - just to & from work & 1 road trip about 130 miles each way (no "spirited driving", at all).

Didn't make it. Car died as I crossed an intersection, and I had it towed to the dealership. Service Advisor told me the next day that they found an engine problem and are contacting BMW (N. America?) to know if they will "rebuild or ship out a new engine". All he said when I questioned was that this was likely "some rare defect", but said no more.

It has been about a week, and no further reply. I understand the whole buying a used car "risk", but this 'just doesn't feel right', after dropping a good chunk of cash on a fully documented vehicle, putting about 600 miles on it & having all this.

I, too, will post any updates, but my guess is that I will be out my M3 for a few months!
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      04-24-2011, 05:05 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taleof2bricks View Post
Newbie here, unfortunately, chiming in on a (possibly) related problem. Bought a 2008 M3 Sedan with 28k on the clock and all dealer records since new. Pristine paint & interior, snatched it up on the spot. Though the car was just serviced (oil, included), while driving from work, noticed the car had a very rough idle and reduced power. Service Engine Soon (or something to that effect) light went on, and I headed for the dealership. I will note this is after less than 1 month of ownership, and about 600 miles - just to & from work & 1 road trip about 130 miles each way (no "spirited driving", at all).

Didn't make it. Car died as I crossed an intersection, and I had it towed to the dealership. Service Advisor told me the next day that they found an engine problem and are contacting BMW (N. America?) to know if they will "rebuild or ship out a new engine". All he said when I questioned was that this was likely "some rare defect", but said no more.

It has been about a week, and no further reply. I understand the whole buying a used car "risk", but this 'just doesn't feel right', after dropping a good chunk of cash on a fully documented vehicle, putting about 600 miles on it & having all this.

I, too, will post any updates, but my guess is that I will be out my M3 for a few months!
Sorry to hear the bad news. At least BMW should replace or rebuild your engine. I would push for an extended warranty in either case.

This type of issues were exactly the reasons I pushed so hard to get into a 2009 after having the same issue with 2 2008s.
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      04-24-2011, 05:59 PM   #36
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Thanks - I am trying to be patient and let "the process" go through its motions, and I hope that they come through and take care of this mess. The dealership has all records on this car (it was sold & traded back in at the same place), but I don't know if an engine teardown will be required before they give the 'green light' one way or the other.

Hopefully, I will take a lesson from all this, and HOPEFULLY, that will be what a great company they are in honoring true failures under warranty.
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      04-24-2011, 06:07 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taleof2bricks View Post
Thanks - I am trying to be patient and let "the process" go through its motions, and I hope that they come through and take care of this mess. The dealership has all records on this car (it was sold & traded back in at the same place), but I don't know if an engine teardown will be required before they give the 'green light' one way or the other.

Hopefully, I will take a lesson from all this, and HOPEFULLY, that will be what a great company they are in honoring true failures under warranty.
Are you sure it is a bottom end failure?You made no mention of noises which are a very good indication of bottom end problems.Rough running could could be caused by valve spring issues which were not uncommon in one batch of 08 production engines.
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      04-24-2011, 06:28 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taleof2bricks View Post
Thanks - I am trying to be patient and let "the process" go through its motions, and I hope that they come through and take care of this mess. The dealership has all records on this car (it was sold & traded back in at the same place), but I don't know if an engine teardown will be required before they give the 'green light' one way or the other.

Hopefully, I will take a lesson from all this, and HOPEFULLY, that will be what a great company they are in honoring true failures under warranty.
BMW of NA was very good to me. I hope the same will happen to you.
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      04-24-2011, 11:36 PM   #39
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The saga continues.

I'm curious about the number of instances where folks had this noise and actually had an engine failure. If I recall, the total number of folks who honestly had the same noise is pretty small, and, aside from an earlier member who mysteriously stopped posting after the engine was shipped to germany, there appear to have been relatively few actual bearing replacements and even fewer actual engine failures.

I was one of the first few to notice and post a video describing this problem. At the time I was unable to conjure the BMW dealership goodwill to get multiple replacement cars. But this ticking in my engine utterly disappeared, and I've been driving it without issue for the last 25000 miles. Curious.
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      04-25-2011, 12:12 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by farbarg View Post
The saga continues.

I'm curious about the number of instances where folks had this noise and actually had an engine failure. If I recall, the total number of folks who honestly had the same noise is pretty small, and, aside from an earlier member who mysteriously stopped posting after the engine was shipped to germany, there appear to have been relatively few actual bearing replacements and even fewer actual engine failures.

I was one of the first few to notice and post a video describing this problem. At the time I was unable to conjure the BMW dealership goodwill to get multiple replacement cars. But this ticking in my engine utterly disappeared, and I've been driving it without issue for the last 25000 miles. Curious.
I'm in a 2009 and have an odd random ticking/pinging sound when the car is warming up. Sound comes from the front end. I can only hear it in a quiet garage. I always just assumed it was the metal expanding as it comes up to temp. I've not had any engine problems, but I do have a constant valve clacking type sound through the low RPM range and at idle which I also assume is normal with these engines. Correct?
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      04-25-2011, 01:25 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX View Post
I'm in a 2009 and have an odd random ticking/pinging sound when the car is warming up. Sound comes from the front end. I can only hear it in a quiet garage. I always just assumed it was the metal expanding as it comes up to temp. I've not had any engine problems, but I do have a constant valve clacking type sound through the low RPM range and at idle which I also assume is normal with these engines. Correct?
yeah, lots of folks confuse the possibly "bad" ping with the normal relatively loud valve noise. There are lots of heat-induced pings/pops all over the car after hard driving, and those are also totally normal. It seems likely that your problem is that you have a normal M3
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      04-25-2011, 01:47 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by farbarg View Post
yeah, lots of folks confuse the possibly "bad" ping with the normal relatively loud valve noise. There are lots of heat-induced pings/pops all over the car after hard driving, and those are also totally normal. It seems likely that your problem is that you have a normal M3
Thanks for the confirmation. I've only had the car for 5 thousand miles and it has just over 19,000 miles on it so I've always assumed these sounds were totally normal. I was just curious to see if others might be confusing the "failing bearing ticking sound" with the normal sounds of a warming engine or the valve clack which I always assumed was also normal to these engines. In my case I will continue to drive the car and so far it just says give me more! I may think differently once I'm out of my warranty period as a ($25,000?) engine is a little much to buy.

I've listened to the video posted above which was supposed to point out the bearing noise in question. I did hear the noise, but I wasn't sure what I was hearing. What do you guys hear in the video posted above?
Cheers,
TX.
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      04-25-2011, 01:11 PM   #43
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Are you sure it is a bottom end failure?You made no mention of noises which are a very good indication of bottom end problems.Rough running could could be caused by valve spring issues which were not uncommon in one batch of 08 production engines.
In my case, just before the car died, I heard a nasty sound, similar to a piece of metal falling and hitting the street. I looked under the car, and all was visibly intact - I believe hinting to something internal breaking...

I will take top end problems any day, vs bottom end!
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      07-11-2013, 11:37 AM   #44
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Bearing Failure

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Originally Posted by MDM View Post
2011 M3 DCT:

Have had numerous engine stalls as in completely shuts off...but starts right back up! This has happen 4X and they cant find anything.

Also have the dreaded ticking/knocking syndrome. First visit to the dealership they did verify the noise. PUMA case started and engineer response was to re-tourque the bedplate bolts. This was done on the second visit. When I went to check on the status of my car, the technician was just returning from a test drive. He tells me that the ticking/knocking is gone. I wasnt so optimistic, so he says lets go on a test drive. We go on a test drive and I take the car behind a local grocery store where it is somewhat quite and a fence line to where we could easily here any noise. It took about eight passes at slow speed but it finally did it and the technician did once again confirm the noise.

Technician elevates the PUMA case again and the engineers come back with: Wait for it....CHANGE THE CRANK SHAFT and BEARINGS!!! This of course has generated a third visit at which point the car is at the dealership now. The new Crankshaft and associated bearings arrived last week. As a side note: The second engineering response took less than 24hrs to receive. I have a feeling that the engineers understand that "SOME" S65 engines have substandard bearings!! My car has 10,831 miles clocked so far.

I will keep everyone posted.
Would you let me know the outcome of this "fix". I just experienced a bearing failure in my 2011 M3 with just under 30K. I am just starting to research this issue and looking to gather up as much information as possible and see what outcomes owners have had with BMW on this issue.

Thanks
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