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      03-11-2007, 10:56 PM   #1
maximus54
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E92 M3 or 996 turbo

I like the new m3 alot but i would have to wait for smg, and for it to be available and i am sure there will be problems first year of production. A used 996 turbo is in that price range with better performance. What do you think i should chose and why. I am a performance driven guy, and don't know which one to go with.
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      03-11-2007, 11:43 PM   #2
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A turdo is a turdo is a turbo. Pcar hands down!
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      03-12-2007, 05:28 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus5403 View Post
I like the new m3 alot but i would have to wait for smg, and for it to be available and i am sure there will be problems first year of production. A used 996 turbo is in that price range with better performance. What do you think i should chose and why. I am a performance driven guy, and don't know which one to go with.
is warranty important to you?
is driving the latest new thing important to you.
how about rear seats and large boot.

if you are a 'performance driven guy' and the above dont apply.. its a no brainer really.
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      03-12-2007, 07:00 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus5403 View Post
I like the new m3 alot but i would have to wait for smg, and for it to be available and i am sure there will be problems first year of production. A used 996 turbo is in that price range with better performance. What do you think i should chose and why. I am a performance driven guy, and don't know which one to go with.

That's a tough choice.

Regarding the above post; you can get a certified car with 100k, 6 year warranty in the states and turbo's have rear seats. I could care less about a large boot. Most people buy these cars for the performance, not the trunk space.

If I was looking for a used 996 turbo, I'd only buy one with the X50 package (450 HP instead of 414). The latter years had this option with the last year (2005) having the S package, which included Ceramic brakes. The 2005 S will be the most sought after in future years IMO.

There is strong rumor that Porsche upped the HP in the 2003 and later models without disclosing it due to higher costs associated with the SAE standards. So, I'd stick with a 2003 or later even if you didn't want X50.

Absolutely great cars, but be careful the market has not adjusted yet for the current 997 turbo. As those become even more available -and they are, the 996 turbos will depreciate even further. Find a very low mileage one and have the dealer perform a diagnostic test to ensure that the engine was not beat on by many over revs. Porsche tracks this well and will delay warranty claims because of owner abuse.

Lastly, the 996 does not have the electronic awd like the 997 so it FEELS like an awd car; i.e. heavy steering, etc... And, 996 interior quality is not anything like the 997 quality.

Not to be redundant, but get the X50 because if the M3 is anything like we hope it to be the 996 w/o/ X50 won't be much faster.

I was able to find some for sale on Auto Trader. You can buy a 2005 S (retail $135-140+) for 100K or less if you look hard enough and negotiate well. I found one which I could have bought for $100k. It had less than 5k on it. Even at that price I'd rather save the bucks and buy the new M. Otherwise, go all the way and get the 997 turbo.

Last edited by devo; 03-12-2007 at 10:14 AM.
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      03-12-2007, 09:01 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpencerM3 View Post
A turdo is a turdo is a turbo. Pcar hands down!
You are darn right but a very good used one is hard to find.
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      03-12-2007, 12:18 PM   #6
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i am with E92 M3.

probably because i am in love with 997TT
if it's not 997, i will pass.
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      03-12-2007, 12:21 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Last E92 M3 View Post
i am with E92 M3.

probably because i am in love with 997TT
if it's not 997, i will pass.

your like me..
has to be the newest model
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      03-12-2007, 12:32 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
That's a tough choice.

Regarding the above post; you can get a certified car with 100k, 6 year warranty in the states and turbo's have rear seats. I could care less about a large boot. Most people buy these cars for the performance, not the trunk space.

If I was looking for a used 996 turbo, I'd only buy one with the X50 package (450 HP instead of 414). The latter years had this option with the last year (2005) having the S package, which included Ceramic brakes. The 2005 S will be the most sought after in future years IMO.

There is strong rumor that Porsche upped the HP in the 2003 and later models without disclosing it due to higher costs associated with the SAE standards. So, I'd stick with a 2003 or later even if you didn't want X50.

Absolutely great cars, but be careful the market has not adjusted yet for the current 997 turbo. As those become even more available -and they are, the 996 turbos will depreciate even further. Find a very low mileage one and have the dealer perform a diagnostic test to ensure that the engine was not beat on by many over revs. Porsche tracks this well and will delay warranty claims because of owner abuse.

Lastly, the 996 does not have the electronic awd like the 997 so it FEELS like an awd car; i.e. heavy steering, etc... And, 996 interior quality is not anything like the 997 quality.

Not to be redundant, but get the X50 because if the M3 is anything like we hope it to be the 996 w/o/ X50 won't be much faster.

I was able to find some for sale on Auto Trader. You can buy a 2005 S (retail $135-140+) for 100K or less if you look hard enough and negotiate well. I found one which I could have bought for $100k. It had less than 5k on it. Even at that price I'd rather save the bucks and buy the new M. Otherwise, go all the way and get the 997 turbo.
I agree with you for the most part except I think you are being generous when talking about a back seat. The back seat is merely cosmetic at this point. A friend of mine went in the back and she could barely fit (she was only 5'4) with the person in the front pushing the seat all the way forward.

Also, you really don't need the X50. Most people I know installed GIAC chip that gets them 100+ extra HP for around $1000.

I love the M3, as it is probably one of my favorite cars of all time. But if you don't need to carry more than two people, and don't need to carry a lot of stuff around, then the 996 (IMHO) is the better choice. Even without the X50, it should be able to outperform the new M3 all around. Either way, both are fantastic cars and I doubt you will be unhappy with either.
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      03-12-2007, 12:49 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by porscheC4S View Post
I agree with you for the most part except I think you are being generous when talking about a back seat. The back seat is merely cosmetic at this point. A friend of mine went in the back and she could barely fit (she was only 5'4) with the person in the front pushing the seat all the way forward.

Also, you really don't need the X50. Most people I know installed GIAC chip that gets them 100+ extra HP for around $1000.

I love the M3, as it is probably one of my favorite cars of all time. But if you don't need to carry more than two people, and don't need to carry a lot of stuff around, then the 996 (IMHO) is the better choice. Even without the X50, it should be able to outperform the new M3 all around. Either way, both are fantastic cars and I doubt you will be unhappy with either.
I have fit some very small adults in the rear for short drives, but admittantly they are not intended for anything more; except, of course, children. Granted, you can chip the car and gain some nice improvements, but I have not heard of anyone getting 100 RWHP from a $1,000 GIAC chip.(There are a lot of 520+ HP (996) 911tts out there, but they're not making that kind of power with a $1,000.00 investment.) And, I would not be willing to risk the warranty. The engine on a turbo can easily cost $40,000-$50,000 to replace. Any CHIP maker who claims Porsche can't tell if it was flashed, isn't aware that they can or is...well, being dishonest.
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      03-12-2007, 12:58 PM   #10
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I like making horsepower the natural way - M3 or GT3 me! Turbo is just not desireable. I just like the power building characteristics of a naturally aspirated engine.
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      03-12-2007, 02:17 PM   #11
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As much as I like P cars, it has to be a brand new one.
So E92 M3 for me.
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      03-12-2007, 03:26 PM   #12
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Pcar hands down. E92 M3 is not in the same league as a 911, especially a Turbo. If you have the money I rather have the Pcar. More reliability, more performance, and an even better marque.
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      03-12-2007, 03:39 PM   #13
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996's are soooo crappy inside. on par with my S2000. go for the Mtre.
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      03-12-2007, 03:55 PM   #14
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996's are soooo crappy inside. on par with my S2000. go for the Mtre.

Exactly. And,I'm not so convinced about the reliability issue.
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      03-12-2007, 04:14 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Manz_UK View Post
your like me..
has to be the newest model
Yeah, I love the fresh leather smell too!
Some people don't like it and put refresher in the car
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      03-12-2007, 04:35 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
I have fit some very small adults in the rear for short drives, but admittantly they are not intended for anything more; except, of course, children. Granted, you can chip the car and gain some nice improvements, but I have not heard of anyone getting 100 RWHP from a $1,000 GIAC chip.
You can perform a search on Rennlist, but here is someone who chipped a non-S turbo and gained 100+ HP (dyno graph shown):

http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforum...1&postcount=31

Upsolute claims 95HP and I do know someone who has gained 100+ HP from their GIAC chip.

I will agree with your later post that the 996 interior is down-right cheap especially compared with interiors of other high end cars. The 997 is a huge step forward but it still is not on par with that of Audi or BMW, but then again, it is also not seen as a luxo-sports car. The only way I would ever get rid of my P-car is if I needed to travel with more than two people and I needed luggage space, other then that, from a pure performance/looks/cache perspective, I think you would not go wrong with the Pcar. I guess it all depends on what you are looking for in the end as it most likely comes down to personal preference.
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      03-12-2007, 05:42 PM   #17
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Yeah

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manz_UK View Post
your like me..
has to be the newest model
You're like me too. 997's are so much better. But the E92 M3 is still the new kid in town.
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      03-15-2007, 02:47 PM   #18
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E92 M3. 996TT has known issues with the tranny. The syncros just give out. If you go to 6speedonline you will see many people changing them out for a mere 10k...if you have extra money to cover the cost of the tranny, then I would go with the 996tt.
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      03-15-2007, 08:27 PM   #19
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The 996TT is a great car and can be driven everyday.

I very much disagree that it is hard to find a good used 996TT. I think you or anyone will have a hard time finding an abused 996TT anywhere. Most Pcars are babied to death.

Anyways, the 996TT is going to be faster and has the potential to be very very fast.

I think the greatest thing about Porsche is the timeless looks. A 10 year old 993 looks just as good as a 2 year old 997 and I think this will always be the case when it comes to Porsche's. So a 996TT is always going to be a beautiful Porsche. With BMW a 10yr car looks out dated especially with the drastic strides in styling BMW has taken and probably will continue to take in the future.

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      03-16-2007, 04:44 AM   #20
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The M3 is more practical and would be the better daily driver, but I'd rather have a 997S or a 996GT3.
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      03-16-2007, 09:32 AM   #21
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I am in the middle of that exact same desicion right now. The 996tt is an extremely beautiful car and the Porsche crest carries a lot of prestige but to be perfectly honest I have always enjoyed driving either my Mcoupe or my friends E46 M3 more. The 996tt redlines at a very boring 6500 rpm so while the engine is a lot of fun its not fun for very long, also the cable shifter is one of the worst Ive ever fealt. So, if performance is really the goal I think the debate should be between the M3 and the 996 GT3- that is a fun car!
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      03-16-2007, 11:07 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus5403 View Post
I like the new m3 alot but i would have to wait for smg, and for it to be available and i am sure there will be problems first year of production. A used 996 turbo is in that price range with better performance. What do you think i should chose and why. I am a performance driven guy, and don't know which one to go with.
Well performance wise M3 won't beat a rear engined turbo charged AWD Porsche!
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