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      03-19-2011, 03:08 AM   #1
saeedg48
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Thumbs down 6MT WTF - did something just break?

Okay it's pretty late so this is going to be sloppy;

driving home 12:30AM. cars fully warmed up. Engage first gear moving along to 4,000RPMs full throttle on my way up to 6,000RPMs and all of a sudden I hear a boom!

I look down and the shifters in the neutral position.

Basically the car popped itself out of 1st gear..

My first thoughts; did I just blow something up or drive into a dead cow on the road...

Seriously WTF just happened. I'm definitely not a noob when it comes to driving stick..
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Last edited by saeedg48; 07-28-2011 at 07:54 PM.
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      03-19-2011, 03:42 AM   #2
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Wait & see if it happens again (I gather it didn't happen again on the way home).
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      03-19-2011, 04:00 AM   #3
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Maybe you weren't completely engaged in 1st? This hasn't happened to me in my car but in my cousins z4m, if you don't push the shifter all the way forward and you floor it, it pops back out into neutral. His shifter is kind of loose and fucked up so that could be the problem. Yours could be something else, just stating my experience with this.
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      03-19-2011, 04:03 AM   #4
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You didn't fully engage it. The gears can be cranky. Pull harder.
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      03-19-2011, 05:49 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattle S65B40 View Post
You didn't fully engage it. The gears can be cranky. Pull harder.
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      03-19-2011, 05:52 AM   #6
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It just popped out of gear... has happened to me on other cars in the past because the gear wasn't fully engaged. I bet everything is fine.
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      03-19-2011, 06:41 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal View Post
It just popped out of gear... has happened to me on other cars in the past because the gear wasn't fully engaged. I bet everything is fine.
Agreed, did that once in a 330ci... scared the sh** out of me, but just went on to resume normal driving.
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      03-19-2011, 06:47 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattle S65B40 View Post
You didn't fully engage it. The gears can be cranky. Push harder.

Fixed....1st gear is up
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      03-19-2011, 07:10 AM   #9
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no big deal, probably didn't do much damage, the gear probably crunched a little though...
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      03-19-2011, 09:10 AM   #10
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      03-19-2011, 10:56 AM   #11
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Thats the synchors pushing the tranny out of 1st gear as you didn't fully engage it. If it continues to happen you may have a bad synchro in the tranny. It just sounds like to me as others have said that you weren't fully in gear.

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      03-19-2011, 11:09 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreasyGinzo View Post
Fixed....1st gear is up
haha
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      03-19-2011, 12:20 PM   #13
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Yep, not in gear all the way. This car is especially tricky, since on most other cars the lever goes in maybe 50% (falsely), so if you're familiar with the car, you can tell right away it's not in all the way. But with the M3 is like 75% IMO, so easier to think it's in when it's not. When that happens, I quickly shift to 2nd then back to 1st and that has always solved the issue. Or releasing the clutch quickly in N then engaging 1st again right away.

By the way, when that happens is that the gears stopped, aligned right against each other (not common). Best way to avoid that altogether is to quickly engage 1st after pushing the clutch pedal in, so the input shaft is still turning. You have like a second to put the tranny in gear before shaft stops. Hope this helps.
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      03-19-2011, 12:32 PM   #14
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check your engine mounts. BMW engine mounts suck.
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      03-19-2011, 12:53 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elp_jc View Post
You have like a second to put the tranny in gear before shaft stops. Hope this helps.
The centrifugal force of the rotating clutch disc at 4000 to 6000 rpm (engine speed) will keep the input shaft and counter shaft (first input gear) spinning for longer than 1 second. The spinning weight takes a while to spin to a full stop. The first output gear is rotating at drive shaft speed.
When shifting gears the clutch disc does not stop spinning.

For the OP:
The synchronizer ring (blocker ring) will not cause the synchronizer sleeve and shifter to “pop” back to neutral, not fully engaging the gear selected will cause the sudden disengagement. Your problem was the sleeve (green in the animation) was not full engaged with the clutch teeth on first gear.

Here is a flash animation of the synchronizer operation from TomBirch.com:
http://tombirch.com/3/flash/Synchronizer_Operation.swf

Tom is a friend that has done an outstanding job of creating instructional flash animations that I use in class….great textbooks also.

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      03-20-2011, 01:58 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenwelch View Post
The centrifugal force of the rotating clutch disc at 4000 to 6000 rpm (engine speed) will keep the input shaft and counter shaft (first input gear) spinning for longer than 1 second.
Thought he was talking about engaging 1st when stopped . Sorry about the brain fart .
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      03-20-2011, 03:09 AM   #17
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That used to happy to me in my e46 m3... it turned out my clutch was slipping...
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      03-20-2011, 03:46 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dajimba View Post
That used to happy to me in my e46 m3... it turned out my clutch was slipping...
+1
If its not the fact that the gear wasn't engaged I'd be suggesting clutch
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      03-20-2011, 09:23 AM   #19
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Quote:
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check your engine mounts. BMW engine mounts suck.
Check transmission mounts, too.
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      03-21-2011, 12:37 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenwelch View Post
The centrifugal force of the rotating clutch disc at 4000 to 6000 rpm (engine speed) will keep the input shaft and counter shaft (first input gear) spinning for longer than 1 second. The spinning weight takes a while to spin to a full stop. The first output gear is rotating at drive shaft speed.
When shifting gears the clutch disc does not stop spinning.

For the OP:
The synchronizer ring (blocker ring) will not cause the synchronizer sleeve and shifter to “pop” back to neutral, not fully engaging the gear selected will cause the sudden disengagement. Your problem was the sleeve (green in the animation) was not full engaged with the clutch teeth on first gear.

Here is a flash animation of the synchronizer operation from TomBirch.com:
http://tombirch.com/3/flash/Synchronizer_Operation.swf

Tom is a friend that has done an outstanding job of creating instructional flash animations that I use in class….great textbooks also.

Ken Welch, Instructor
Power Train / Automatic Transmissions
Saddleback College
Great post. Interesting to me that a powertrain instructor such as yourself would have a DCT car. Care to comment? I am close to a purchase and still debate the transmissions (but do NOT intend to start a DCT vs 6MT thread) I had SMG in my E46 M3 which was good, but I always missed the MT from my E36 M3...
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