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      11-17-2010, 03:14 AM   #1
Ben Choad
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Anyone with experience with California Lemon Law

With only 1,600 miles on the car I am starting to experience problems with the car. I have taken the car into the dealership and, as expected, I am being told that the dealership cant replicate the problem.

I have no intention of keeping the car in its current condition. Does anyone have any experience with utilizing a state's lemon law to rectify a situation similar to this.

Thank you.

Last edited by Ben Choad; 11-18-2010 at 04:54 PM.
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      11-18-2010, 02:07 PM   #2
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There must be an unwritten law somewhere that says the problem goes away when you take it in to get fixed!

According to the California Lemon Law the dealership is allowed 2 repair attempts for a defect that might cause death or serious injury, 4 repair attempts for non safety related or 30 calendar days out of service. Even if you don't qualify yet, make sure you keep records even if they don't find a problem. I recommend http://www.lemonlawspecialists.com/ . They are a reputable firm in California that specializes in lemon law.
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      11-18-2010, 04:15 PM   #3
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Also, it would be to your advantage to video issues (if possible). At least you would have something to show the dealer when attempting repairs (and evidence later).
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      11-18-2010, 04:26 PM   #4
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Most of the time you dont need to go through the actually lemon law. If you are unsatisfied then just call BMW NA and they will work something out for you. They have been very accommodating for me and my Lemon 335i.
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      11-18-2010, 04:34 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muncher79 View Post
There must be an unwritten law somewhere that says the problem goes away when you take it in to get fixed!

According to the California Lemon Law the dealership is allowed 2 repair attempts for a defect that might cause death or serious injury, 4 repair attempts for non safety related or 30 calendar days out of service. Even if you don't qualify yet, make sure you keep records even if they don't find a problem. I recommend http://www.lemonlawspecialists.com/ . They are a reputable firm in California that specializes in lemon law.
Thanks. I spoke with BMW NA and they suggested that I take the car into another dealership for a second opinion. Doing that tomorrow. After that, BMW NA will determine next steps
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      11-18-2010, 04:36 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by E92_SID View Post
Most of the time you dont need to go through the actually lemon law. If you are unsatisfied then just call BMW NA and they will work something out for you. They have been very accommodating for me and my Lemon 335i.
Yes, I am working with BMW NA. They asked me to take the car to another dealership for them to have a look at it since the the dealership where I bought the car cant seem to locate the source of the problems. Next steps will be based on the results of the evaluation from the second dealership.

Last edited by Ben Choad; 11-18-2010 at 04:55 PM.
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      11-18-2010, 04:39 PM   #7
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Also, it would be to your advantage to video issues (if possible). At least you would have something to show the dealer when attempting repairs (and evidence later).
Thanks, this is a good suggestion
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      11-18-2010, 05:43 PM   #8
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If they can't replicate the problems, at least 3 times as is required under California Lemon Law, you're not getting a new car.

I tried it before on my 550i, they could only replicate the problem once (it was a misfiring cylinder, and even that, as per my lemon law attorney who had a 99% success rate with BMW, wasn't enough for a substantial safety issue claim.)

Basically, you need a mechanical problem/defect that is due to the BUILD and/or WORKMANSHIP of the automobile. If after 3 attempts at IDENTIFYING and FIXING does not alleviate it, then your car is a lemon under California law.

Sorry to hear you'r having problems on a brand new car, maybe you can share what your problems are with the forum.
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      11-18-2010, 05:53 PM   #9
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What kind of problems are u experiencing at 1600 miles brand new car?? I dot think op stated
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      11-18-2010, 05:57 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Choad View Post
With only 1,600 miles on the car I am starting to experience problems with the car. I have taken the car into the dealership and, as expected, I am being told that the dealership cant replicate the problem.

I have no intention of keeping the car in its current condition. Does anyone have any experience with utilizing a state's lemon law to rectify a situation similar to this.

Thank you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by richpuer View Post
What kind of problems are u experiencing at 1600 miles brand new car?? I dot think op stated
What richpuer said would be useful, but anyways, below is just some general information.

For various reasons, I had to remove the bulk of my story, but yes, I am very familiar with CA lemon law.

CA lemon law states as a guideline that if you have the same problem 3 times, you may have a good case in court. If a problem occurs twice, and it poses a significant threat to safety or a significant decrease in vehicle value, then you also could have a case. Finally, if your vehicle is in the shop for repairs for over 30 cumulative days in the first 18 months or 18,000 miles of ownership, you have a strong case as well.

I would document everything, keep ALL service records, whether a problem was solved or not, and then submit everything to a lemon law lawyer. I know some people open cases with BMW NA directly, but I found them to be less than willing to be of help. Also note that you cannot have a case with BMW and a case with a lawyer open at the same time. Oh, and like others have stated, photos/videos help immeasurably. I've taken photos and videos of my problems on my iPhone, they really helped me at the dealerships once in a while.

Don't believe the rumors that a lawyer will charge you. They are not supposed to charge you anything. Contact Dave Barry: talking to him will cost you nothing (neither will your case anyways), and he will tell you exactly how strong your chances are. Just let him know that Brian referred you.

David N. Barry, Esq.
THE BARRY LAW FIRM
520 Broadway, Suite 350
Santa Monica, California 90401
310.854.4015 tel
310.862.4539 fax

Last edited by LateBraking; 11-18-2010 at 06:31 PM.
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      11-18-2010, 06:14 PM   #11
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...so the bottom line is, if the dealer chooses to deny there is a problem on something that is intermittent you do not have a claim under CA lemon law since there was no attempt to repair?
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      11-18-2010, 06:26 PM   #12
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...so the bottom line is, if the dealer chooses to deny there is a problem on something that is intermittent you do not have a claim under CA lemon law since there was no attempt to repair?
Not necessarily. You can file a claim all you want, it's just filing a claim without proof is likely to get thrown out by the judge. There is always the chance of getting your case dealt with before it ever gets to a judge, of course.

I say "not necessarily" 'cuz I have seen some ridiculous cases being filed at my job. For instance, some lady opened a lemon case against Honda because she claimed that her Honda Civic Hybrid wasn't getting 50mpg....

I'm no pro on CA lemon law though. Best thing to do would be to call a knoweldgeable lawyer and get your case appraised by them.

Last edited by LateBraking; 11-18-2010 at 06:35 PM.
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      11-19-2010, 03:18 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by iBeJayKaying View Post
What richpuer said would be useful, but anyways, below is just some general information.

For various reasons, I had to remove the bulk of my story, but yes, I am very familiar with CA lemon law.

CA lemon law states as a guideline that if you have the same problem 3 times, you may have a good case in court. If a problem occurs twice, and it poses a significant threat to safety or a significant decrease in vehicle value, then you also could have a case. Finally, if your vehicle is in the shop for repairs for over 30 cumulative days in the first 18 months or 18,000 miles of ownership, you have a strong case as well.

I would document everything, keep ALL service records, whether a problem was solved or not, and then submit everything to a lemon law lawyer. I know some people open cases with BMW NA directly, but I found them to be less than willing to be of help. Also note that you cannot have a case with BMW and a case with a lawyer open at the same time. Oh, and like others have stated, photos/videos help immeasurably. I've taken photos and videos of my problems on my iPhone, they really helped me at the dealerships once in a while.

Don't believe the rumors that a lawyer will charge you. They are not supposed to charge you anything. Contact Dave Barry: talking to him will cost you nothing (neither will your case anyways), and he will tell you exactly how strong your chances are. Just let him know that Brian referred you.

David N. Barry, Esq.
THE BARRY LAW FIRM
520 Broadway, Suite 350
Santa Monica, California 90401
310.854.4015 tel
310.862.4539 fax

Thanks for the info - appreciate it.

For those of you that have asked what problems. Its basically a loss of engine power issue. I purposely avoided getting into details in order to try and resolve the problems with BMW NA in a civil manner. In the event I am left holding the bag, I will be more than happy to give you all the details you desire.

Thanks to everyone for your input
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      11-19-2010, 03:24 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaykay View Post
If they can't replicate the problems, at least 3 times as is required under California Lemon Law, you're not getting a new car.

I tried it before on my 550i, they could only replicate the problem once (it was a misfiring cylinder, and even that, as per my lemon law attorney who had a 99% success rate with BMW, wasn't enough for a substantial safety issue claim.)

Basically, you need a mechanical problem/defect that is due to the BUILD and/or WORKMANSHIP of the automobile. If after 3 attempts at IDENTIFYING and FIXING does not alleviate it, then your car is a lemon under California law.

Sorry to hear you'r having problems on a brand new car, maybe you can share what your problems are with the forum.

Wow, I am surprised that you continue to purchase BMWs after they sold you a less than perfect 550i. I have purchased (or rather leased) 3 BMWs in the last 5 years. If they dont do right by me here, the M3 will be the last BMW I ever own/lease. Once the 3 year lease is up. I return it and move on to AMG for a daily driver and dont look back regardless of how great a car BMW may come out with in the future. I own a second car (not lease) for performance/weekend drives, and it trounces the M3 so I can live with not owning another M in the future.
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