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      01-23-2007, 03:04 AM   #1
swamp2
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440 hp rumor

Well I may just br spreading bad rumors but over at the m5board.com I found a rumor stating a Geneva launch (proto, production ... something), CF roof and 440 hp. Check it out here:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...ighlight=600hp

We can only hope.

I guess if there were any decent posts here to keep me busy I wouldn'y have even posted this...
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      01-23-2007, 03:11 AM   #2
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They might as well give the new M3 450BHP.
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      01-23-2007, 03:37 AM   #3
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I rather have them drop mass than increase hp. At this point I will be happier to hear 400hp but 2700lbs :-)
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      01-23-2007, 04:22 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbo View Post
I rather have them drop mass than increase hp. At this point I will be happier to hear 400hp but 2700lbs :-)

+1, it`s like a disease, we want an anorexic kind of M3
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      01-23-2007, 04:46 AM   #5
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I'd take both

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbo View Post
I rather have them drop mass than increase hp. At this point I will be happier to hear 400hp but 2700lbs :-)
In this glorious age of consumerism I want both! I think the new M3 will be on a decent diet. I don't know if that is 3600 or 3500 or what (I guess that is not even "decent" in your book) but I think it will have some significant use of composites and aluminum where we are not typically seeing it. 3500lb + 440 hp would really get me pretty excited, that would be almost exactly E60 M5 lb/hp (stated, as most agree M5 puts out 520-530 hp).
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      01-23-2007, 04:50 AM   #6
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If they could make the new M3 like 3,300, I'd be impressed.
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      01-23-2007, 02:32 PM   #7
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i heard rumors that it might be the same weight as the e46 because of differnet materials they use...
is that b.s?
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      01-23-2007, 02:34 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m_bazeepaymon View Post
i heard rumors that it might be the same weight as the e46 because of differnet materials they use...
is that b.s?
I don't know about same weight of the e46, but the new M3 will likely have several weight-saving features. For example, a carbon fiber roof (like M6) is one of the things that is certainly posssible.
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      01-23-2007, 04:13 PM   #9
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450 bhp is where it'll be for real. Hartge just came out with a software ECU tune for the 335i to take it to 293 kW (340 hp) / 5800 rpm and 450 Nm (lb-ft 332) / 1500 rpm, which will already make it an E46 M3-killer (minus LSD of course.)

Best regards,

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      01-23-2007, 04:47 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
450 bhp is where it'll be for real. Hartge just came out with a software ECU tune for the 335i to take it to 293 kW (340 hp) / 5800 rpm and 450 Nm (lb-ft 332) / 1500 rpm, which will already make it an E46 M3-killer (minus LSD of course.)

Best regards,

Jussi


Hey Jussie, welcome back!!

BMW likes round numbers; for example E46 M3, 252 KW, 343 HP (Europe that is)

Now E92 M3, 323 KW, 440 HP

Better is; 333 KW, appr 454 HP..........................speaking of round numbers
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      01-23-2007, 06:18 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
450 bhp is where it'll be for real.
Best regards,

Jussi
I hope you are right! 450 should be enough for the life of the new M3. 415, on the other hand, will be eclipsed by competitors almost from the beginning in terms of performance if not numbers.
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      01-23-2007, 09:02 PM   #12
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That thread sucked...no new info worth speculatig over.

Everybody including BMW knows that the M3 has always set the benchmark for the mid-sized sports-luxury cars...And BMW also knows that this E92 M3's design has to last for 5 years on the market...and the competition in this market is growing very rapidly. They will not become the laughing stock of the industry and only put out a 415HP 3600lb car.

If a corvette can go anorexic, so can the M3. Final predicition 3500lbs or less, and 425-440 CLAIMED CRANK HP.

(I have made several predictions, so when the official numbers are released we are all in agreement that I will refer to the thread with the closest numbers and say "I told you so!" )
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      01-23-2007, 09:05 PM   #13
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And...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
450 bhp is where it'll be for real. Hartge just came out with a software ECU tune for the 335i to take it to 293 kW (340 hp) / 5800 rpm and 450 Nm (lb-ft 332) / 1500 rpm, which will already make it an E46 M3-killer (minus LSD of course.)

Best regards,

Jussi
Welcome back.

But 340 vs. 415 is hardly a threat, is it? The real aftermarket "threat" for the E46 and a bit for the E92 M3 is Vishnu. Have a read about the numbers folks are getting from his software in the FI forums. I also think an under rating by BMW is less likely for the E92 M3 (esp with RS4 at 420). Maybe they want to make a subtle statement that "we can still beat you with less hp". I guess I am still leaning toward my inital prediction of 433 hp actual. Don't want to commit on a stated number.
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      01-23-2007, 09:08 PM   #14
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Well...

Quote:
Originally Posted by replicat View Post
That thread sucked...no new info worth speculatig over.

Everybody including BMW knows that the M3 has always set the benchmark for the mid-sized sports-luxury cars...And BMW also knows that this E92 M3's design has to last for 5 years on the market...and the competition in this market is growing very rapidly. They will not become the laughing stock of the industry and only put out a 415HP 3600lb car.

If a corvette can go anorexic, so can the M3. Final predicition 3500lbs or less, and 425-440 CLAIMED CRANK HP.

(I have made several predictions, so when the official numbers are released we are all in agreement that I will refer to the thread with the closest numbers and say "I told you so!" )
Well it was someone who knows someone who knows someone... That is better than making up numbers isn't it. Like I said if there was any action here I probably would not have posted. Also the real debate/speculation/prize winner can't be closed out until we have specs and DYNO numbers!

Last edited by swamp2; 01-24-2007 at 01:27 AM.
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      01-23-2007, 09:41 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
450 bhp is where it'll be for real. Hartge just came out with a software ECU tune for the 335i to take it to 293 kW (340 hp) / 5800 rpm and 450 Nm (lb-ft 332) / 1500 rpm, which will already make it an E46 M3-killer (minus LSD of course.)

Best regards,

Jussi
Glad to see you here again!

Anything 440HP and above would be with me. Me likey.
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      01-23-2007, 11:08 PM   #16
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I am hoping it to be 34XXlbs...
if it goes up to 35XXlbs, it better be LOW!
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      01-23-2007, 11:29 PM   #17
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I'd say 444hp would be a good followup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Welcome back.

But 340 vs. 415 is hardly a threat, is it? The real aftermarket "threat" for the E46 and a bit for the E92 M3 is Vishnu. Have a read about the numbers folks are getting from his software in the FI forums. I also think an under rating by BMW is less likely for the E92 M3 (esp with RS4 at 420). Maybe they want to make a subtle statement that "we can still beat you with less hp". I guess I am still leaning toward my inital prediction of 433 hp actual. Don't want to commit on a stated number.
But, like others said, 400 is enough if the weight were to be kept down. I just don't see enough opportunities to get it lower than the regular coupe, with bigger fenders, brakes, tires, engine, etc. And, I don't think the CF roof will be standard--probably a future CSL variant.

Last edited by GregW / Oregon; 01-24-2007 at 10:45 PM.
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      01-24-2007, 05:05 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
I hope you are right! 450 should be enough for the life of the new M3. 415, on the other hand, will be eclipsed by competitors almost from the beginning in terms of performance if not numbers.
Now you're getting near the point. It needs to be enough for the life of the model. And it'll be. Expect more turbo-charged gasoline engines from BMW in the next 2 years also, and count those into the competition and you'll begin to see the light. Can't get into more specifics than that, but a 540i with a straight six has been mentioned, for one.

Best regards,

Jussi
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      01-24-2007, 06:30 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
Now you're getting near the point. It needs to be enough for the life of the model. And it'll be. Expect more turbo-charged gasoline engines from BMW in the next 2 years also, and count those into the competition and you'll begin to see the light. Can't get into more specifics than that, but a 540i with a straight six has been mentioned, for one.

Best regards,

Jussi
There are 3 turbo-charged petrol engines scheduled:

- the inline 6 already launched in 335i and U.S. 535i

- a inline 4 engine for the 1 series, most probably called 125 with the output of the 325 engine, i.e. 218 hp

- and a V8 engine for the X6 and 7 series.

For sure the engine found in the 335i has a lot more potential and can be upgraded to almost 400 bhp (and I mean upgraded by BMW itself and not by any aftermarket tuners). For example Alpina which is associated with BMW will bring the B3 this year which is based on the 335 engine and has atleast an output of 360 bhp [BTW: Here are the first pictures of the Alpina B3 if anybody's interested; found on www.m5board.com]

Anyway it is hard to believe the M3 will have 450 HP, let's wait and see...
Only about 40 days left...

Best regards, south
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      01-24-2007, 08:42 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
There are 3 turbo-charged petrol engines scheduled:

- the inline 6 already launched in 335i and U.S. 535i

- a inline 4 engine for the 1 series, most probably called 125 with the output of the 325 engine, i.e. 218 hp

- and a V8 engine for the X6 and 7 series.

For sure the engine found in the 335i has a lot more potential and can be upgraded to almost 400 bhp (and I mean upgraded by BMW itself and not by any aftermarket tuners). For example Alpina which is associated with BMW will bring the B3 this year which is based on the 335 engine and has atleast an output of 360 bhp [BTW: Here are the first pictures of the Alpina B3 if anybody's interested; found on www.m5board.com]

Anyway it is hard to believe the M3 will have 450 HP, let's wait and see...
Only about 40 days left...

Best regards, south
South,

Like I mentioned, Hartge already pulls out 340hp and 450Nm out of the 335i.

There are other forced induction engines scheduled besides the ones you mentioned, however, they are not public yet.

Best regards,

Jussi
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      01-24-2007, 08:56 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
Expect more turbo-charged gasoline engines from BMW in the next 2 years also, and count those into the competition and you'll begin to see the light. Can't get into more specifics than that, but a 540i with a straight six has been mentioned, for one.

Best regards,

Jussi
That's great to hear. So far the 335i engine has been getting great reviews so hopefully turbos will be implemented on other BMW gasoline engines with similar results
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      01-24-2007, 08:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK42 View Post
South,

Like I mentioned, Hartge already pulls out 340hp and 450Nm out of the 335i.

There are other forced induction engines scheduled besides the ones you mentioned, however, they are not public yet.

Best regards,

Jussi
That could be, but they're not ready to be launched within the next 3 years. Never mind.

Do you have any new information on the M3? Is your 450 hp prediction you presonal estimation or was it confirmed to you by anybody?

Best regards, south
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