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      10-05-2010, 11:10 AM   #265
Dave07997S
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Originally Posted by bluovalguy2002 View Post
It is also somewhat common for Ford to underrate their engines after the 99 Cobra fiasco. Everyone is happy if they find out their engine makes more power than advertised, but buyers are understandably upset if it makes less than advertised. Underrated is apparently the case with the new 5.0 according to almost every one that dyno's the car.
+1

For those of you who don't know the history of the 1999 Mustang Cobra a brief recap...Ford recalled 1999 Mustang Cobras when it was learned they weren't making the 320hp they were rated at, in fact some were even making less than the 1998 Mustang Cobra that it replaced. The recall included a extrude honed intake, new mufflers and a different tune.

In 2003 when the 03 Mustang SVTs came out they were making 360rwhp when they were rated at 390hp, definitely underrated.

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      10-05-2010, 01:56 PM   #266
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Very familiar with that - I owned a 1999 Cobra vert. I never got "the fix" done because I sold it and bought a 2001. The fix was a hack anyway. The reason for the hp deficit was eventually determined to be out of spec head castings as I recall it. They didn't want to pull everyone's motor apart so they found another way to get the HP back.

Ford has come a long way since those days.
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      10-05-2010, 05:17 PM   #267
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It's not my nature to wait, and the timing was right because I received a very good price on my 08 E93 M3. I paid $61.5K for it during the depths of the economic crash in March 09 when dealers couldn't get rid of them. I sold it for $57K after driving it for 18 months and 12K miles.

I needed a new daily driver, this was perfect, and I pocketed a healthy wad of cash.
I just ran into a similar situation. I got offered good money for the 2009 997.2S I just bought a couple of months ago and decided to jump on it to free up some cash. I replaced the Porsche with a 2011 Mustang Shelby GT500 with the SVT performance package and the electronics package. It is a world apart from the Porsche, but so far I'm enjoying the heck out of driving a muscle car. The sound alone is worth the price of admission.
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      10-09-2010, 05:25 PM   #268
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So I hate to beat a dead horse here, but I just got back from the OC car show, and I sat in a Mustang GT 5.0, and here's what I think... Any post on this or any other thread that implies that Ford quality and materials are anything even remotely resembling BMW is just plain ridiculous. A lot of the plastic (door panels, lower dash, etc) resembles the material used to make the trash cans in elementary schools, and pretty much every other material inside and out feels about 3 notches below normal BMW stuff. And I have speed cloth, so I don't even have much leather in my interior. I've heard a lot of "Ford has come a long way", which is true, but anyone that tries to compare an M3 with a 5.0 in anything but objective performance is just being silly. Based on my aesthetic senses, the extra $25K spent on an M3 feels completely justified.

Just my .02.

PS - Off topic, but I sat in a WRX Sti, and same thing. It feels a lot like my Honda. There was another thread on here trying to compare it to an M3.
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      10-09-2010, 05:35 PM   #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdgamble View Post
So I hate to beat a dead horse here, but I just got back from the OC car show, and I sat in a Mustang GT 5.0, and here's what I think... Any post on this or any other thread that implies that Ford quality and materials are anything even remotely resembling BMW is just plain ridiculous. A lot of the plastic (door panels, lower dash, etc) resembles the material used to make the trash cans in elementary schools, and pretty much every other material inside and out feels about 3 notches below normal BMW stuff. And I have speed cloth, so I don't even have much leather in my interior. I've heard a lot of "Ford has come a long way", which is true, but anyone that tries to compare an M3 with a 5.0 in anything but objective performance is just being silly. Based on my aesthetic senses, the extra $25K spent on an M3 feels completely justified.

Just my .02.

PS - Off topic, but I sat in a WRX Sti, and same thing. It feels a lot like my Honda. There was another thread on here trying to compare it to an M3.
I think many people tend to judge interiors on aesthetics and don't really have a sense of build quality, materials, and fit & finish.
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      10-11-2010, 08:25 AM   #270
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I think many people tend to judge interiors on aesthetics and don't really have a sense of build quality, materials, and fit & finish.
Agree.

Hwoever, one reason people do this is because expensive interiors don't make a car's performance better. So, if performance is your focus, a low rent interior can be a worthy tradeoff for more hp/$. I'll bet plenty of folks would trade their fancy BMW interior for a 500hp stroker from the factory, for example.
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      10-12-2010, 09:35 AM   #271
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I don't even know that I'd call the M3 interior fancy. I was in an S4 last night and its interior blew the M3s away. Fit and finish, material, and I think it had a more intimate feel. But that's me.
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      10-12-2010, 02:03 PM   #272
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I don't even know that I'd call the M3 interior fancy. I was in an S4 last night and its interior blew the M3s away. Fit and finish, material, and I think it had a more intimate feel. But that's me.
negative. i guess everyone have different opinion, but I don't see what you are saying when I compare the s5 and m3 last time.
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      10-12-2010, 02:09 PM   #273
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negative. i guess everyone have different opinion, but I don't see what you are saying when I compare the s5 and m3 last time.
I understand you compared different models, however, as with BMW, interior styling is pretty consistant form model to model.
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      10-12-2010, 02:53 PM   #274
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I don't even know that I'd call the M3 interior fancy. I was in an S4 last night and its interior blew the M3s away. Fit and finish, material, and I think it had a more intimate feel. But that's me.
Really? That's surprising to me. I sat in an S4 the other day, and while I think the seats LOOK better and the styling is better, I think the materials (plastics, leather, etc.) feel significantly cheaper... especially the dash and door panels. And going back to the seats... I am 6-3 200#, and the bolsters on those seats are totally irrelevant to my frame. I can't imagine how massive I would need to be to feel secured in the seat during aggressive driving.
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      10-12-2010, 03:01 PM   #275
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I can see why the seats wouldn't be your cup of tea. I'm 5'9" and 170#, the bolsters are kind of a big deal for me. The other thing is, the leather on anything in VW/Audi's lineup simply does not have the wear issues that my M has. That alone drops the M3 a few points in interior quality in my book. As does the fact that the whole interior is pressure fit into place. NOTHING in a VW/Audi is simply snapped in. Everything is screwed in. It definitely makes is a pain in the ass to work on but it also make for tighter panel gaps.

But this is also why both companies are thriving. Different products for different consumers.
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      11-01-2010, 08:02 AM   #276
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I bought the GT

I know this thread is getting long in the tooth, but figured I'd chime in with the perspective of one who bought the Mustang.

'11 GT, Brembo brake / summer tire package, 3.73 rear, Picked up 10/24/10, $30K out the door.

First Mustang. Wasn't really planning on one, I was looking for a 2003 or so used M3. I stopped at a dealer to try the GT for the hell of it and was impressed. I decided that for the same money, I would rather have the new GT.

I have a loaded 328xi (3rd one) in the yard and love the car. I've made the pilgrimage been to 'ring, visited the factory museum for the big four in Munich, Stuttgart and Ingolstadt. I get it.

What I was looking for was a stripped down coupe with gobs of power and good handling to use as a sunny day fun car and a track weapon, Sadly, that is not the M3. The Mustang was a perfect fit.

While I can afford the M3, used or new, I can't justify the cost, particularly for a track car. The money for the repairs on the BMW out of warranty are crazy. God forbid I ball it up at the track.

From FoMoCo I was able to order a striped car, big engine, big brakes, high ratio rear, period. BMW refuses to offer us that. I have all the luxo stuff in my SUV and my other car, I don't need or want it in my fun car.

Time will tell if it holds up.
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