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      06-25-2010, 02:09 AM   #23
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      06-25-2010, 04:32 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by asdflkijd View Post
Where the hell are you getting this information? Might want to re-check that.

I got it from HBO, and since its a premium channel and I'm too drunk to argue any further, I'm gonna leave it at that.

Real Sports did a piece on running shoes vs. barefoot a few months back and there was not a single study/ piece of evidence that shows that hi-tech running shoes provide any sort of gains in terms of performance/ durability. They even interviewed two of Nike's lead designers and they even admitted that the design and amount of tech that goes into a running shoe doesn't actually do much to improve the human body's natural capability.

Why do you think African nations always dominate at running competitions? It is, in part, because they've learned to run the way the human body has been conditioned to run and not through the guidance of Nike/ Addidas/ Puma/ New Balance.

I never said a running shoe wasn't more comfortable. I mean sure, a running shoe may provide comfort, but it does NOTHING to help your performance or prevent injury caused by the natural act of running (muscle strains, knee problems, etc...)

BTW, where are you getting the unprovided info necessary to effectively dispute my claim? Commercials, or are you a bonafide shoe salesman??

Last edited by Seabiscuit; 06-25-2010 at 04:38 AM.
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      06-25-2010, 07:52 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Seabiscuit View Post

I never said a running shoe wasn't more comfortable. I mean sure, a running shoe may provide comfort, but it does NOTHING to help your performance or prevent injury caused by the natural act of running (muscle strains, knee problems, etc...)
So what you're saying is that you could either run comfortably to your natural ability or run less comfortably to your natural ability? I did a fair amount of reading on the subject and as long as you aren't running on air pockets or shocks or any of that shit, and have a well shaped shoe for your arch, injury cannot really be attributed to wearing a shoe over wearing a barefoot shoe. The people for which barefoot shoes are best are people who have natural runners feet with high arches. Well, I have wide flat feet, so the shoe "corrects" that in a sense without getting you to "be something your not" if that makes any sense. My coffee just finished making itself so I'll see if that makes any sense in like 20 min
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      06-25-2010, 08:14 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Seabiscuit View Post
Recent studies have shown that running shoe technology actually has ZERO benefit on injury prevention/ performance gains. Your best bet is to pick up a "barefoot" running shoe. Your feet have been evolving for millions of years to get the this point, so why try to change them with 30 years of "shoe tech".

If you want to cut down on injury, try landing on the front of your foot while running, instead of your heel. Landing on your heel causes your body to stop almost completely on impact and greatly decreases your durability.
If you run 30+ miles a week in barefoot running shoes, prepare to be injured after a few months.

This quote about the foot evolving and shoe tech is nothing short of nonsensical, and same with the quote about changing your gait. Unless you are a professional runner doing 100+ miles per week consistently, attempting to change your gait can have some severe consequences in the form of injuries that appear from overcompensation and overuse of muscles that you have not often used before (this does of course assume that you are running enough miles for it to matter, and you are approaching that level based on what OP said).

Also, where you strike first largely depends on how fast you are running. The faster you are running, the greater propensity to strike forefoot first. Although it is technically better to strike midfoot or even forefoot, don't try to play god with your mechanics too much is all I'm saying. If you change your gait significantly too quickly you can plan on being very sore or injured for a while. I would suggest that if you are a heel striker and want to change, start with your midfoot first, in more of a flat-footed strike. It's a better compromise that will probably serve you better in the end. I prefer to strike midfoot myself.

For real though if you're running more than 20 miles a week and you are serious about a steady increase (edit: just saw that you are doing it for cardio purposes), you should go to a forum where there are plenty of people that know what they are talking about, and avoid this kind of misinformation. I ran in high school and D1 so I'm not just pulling things out of my ass or regurgitating what some scientist told me on HBO.

Oh yea and as far as which shoe, you need to go get checked out at a running store. It's hard to choose a shoe for you without knowing your weight and your pronation, among other things. The best running shoe that I ever ran in (ran in the series for about 5 years) is the Asics GT series. I think they might be on the 2150 or so at this point. Great all around shoe.
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      06-25-2010, 08:28 AM   #27
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I picked up a pair of nike frees and some vibram fivefingers, and changed how I run. I use to get knee pain from running in the proper running shoe in the "typical" heel ball striking motion. I switched to barefeet or pose running or whatever you want to call it and my knee pain is gone and I've gotten faster. Gimmick or not, it worked for me.
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      06-25-2010, 08:36 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by oct1285 View Post
I picked up a pair of nike frees and some vibram fivefingers, and changed how I run. I use to get knee pain from running in the proper running shoe in the "typical" heel ball striking motion. I switched to barefeet or pose running or whatever you want to call it and my knee pain is gone and I've gotten faster. Gimmick or not, it worked for me.
Pain that could have been caused by any number of things. If you've got a problem, it's not out of the ordinary to try and change things up if you do it right. If you're not having trouble though, and it's probably just the shoes that you are wearing, then I don't suggest that you change your gait.
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      06-25-2010, 11:17 AM   #29
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thanks for the info guys i found this shoe store that specializes in running so im gonna check them out tomorrow i'll let you guys know what kinda shoes they recommended. its pretty cool i called them up and you get to run 2 miles and get hooked up to this machine i never knew it could get this serious lol
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      06-25-2010, 04:13 PM   #30
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      06-25-2010, 04:24 PM   #31
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Ignore anything here anyone is saying about a specific brand, model or type of shoe. Find out through the grapevine where all the serious runners in your area go (check for a running club and get a recommendation). A good store will measure your foot, make you run and watch your gait, or even video or measure it on a machine. They will determine the type of shoe you need based on your foot strike / bio mechanics, your comfort and your mileage volume/purpose. They should present several different brands of the same type of shoe for you to try running with. Buy what feels the best after hearing what they say and buy somewhere that will allow you to run a 5 miles or so and return if they don't work for you.

Good luck.

BTW, I'm a long time marathoner who used to average 70 miles per week year round.
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      06-25-2010, 04:25 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by ejazbmw View Post
thanks for the info guys i found this shoe store that specializes in running so im gonna check them out tomorrow i'll let you guys know what kinda shoes they recommended. its pretty cool i called them up and you get to run 2 miles and get hooked up to this machine i never knew it could get this serious lol

Great. See my post above.
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      06-25-2010, 06:06 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by asdflkijd View Post
nike free's are good, if you run under 3 miles.. They are meant for training and short distance runs.
when i run, i do 5 miles, guess i dont use them how they are supposed to, but i still love em
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      06-25-2010, 06:41 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBull View Post
Ignore anything here anyone is saying about a specific brand, model or type of shoe. Find out through the grapevine where all the serious runners in your area go (check for a running club and get a recommendation). A good store will measure your foot, make you run and watch your gait, or even video or measure it on a machine. They will determine the type of shoe you need based on your foot strike / bio mechanics, your comfort and your mileage volume/purpose. They should present several different brands of the same type of shoe for you to try running with. Buy what feels the best after hearing what they say and buy somewhere that will allow you to run a 5 miles or so and return if they don't work for you.

Good luck.

BTW, I'm a long time marathoner who used to average 70 miles per week year round.
yeah you basically summed up what the guy at the store said it sounded like he knew what he was talking about as well. and damn 70 miles per week is crazy i think the most i ever did was like 42 in a week and i was sore as hell everyday lol
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      06-25-2010, 06:53 PM   #35
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Running shoes are meant to correct your strike and/ or provide the cushion needed for running on hard pavement.

I'm a runner btw. I just ran today for the first time in 4 months and sweated more than I ever have in my life. Even more than in 130 F + Iraq. I had shoulder surgery and couldn't do shit.
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      06-25-2010, 07:02 PM   #36
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Running shoes are meant to correct your strike and/ or provide the cushion needed for running on hard pavement.

I'm a runner btw. I just ran today for the first time in 4 months and sweated more than I ever have in my life. Even more than in 130 F + Iraq. I had shoulder surgery and couldn't do shit.
im not trying to correct anything i just want better shoes that wont eff up my feet anymore then they are. All I want are shoes that are meant for my feet and will better suit them while running. I'm not trying to get another 2 miles out of better shoes or anything
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      06-25-2010, 10:05 PM   #37
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im not trying to correct anything i just want better shoes that wont eff up my feet anymore then they are. All I want are shoes that are meant for my feet and will better suit them while running. I'm not trying to get another 2 miles out of better shoes or anything
Yeah shoes should compliment your running style. That's why I exclusively wear Nimbus 9s/11s. They have the perfect amount of support and cushion for MY foot.

BTW when you run make sure that you vary your distance and pace. Like have one endurance run a week, one day of sprints, one 5 mile, one 6 mile, two 3 miles, w/e. Also vary the intensicty.

I used to go 100% race pace once a week at a 5k. Saturdays. Then Sunday would be easy nice pace medium distance, monday would be sprints, then the rest of the days would be varied distance and pace.

Also make sure that you stretch before and after running 45 seconds each, start at the muscles up top (Neck, upper back, chest, triceps) then proceed to stretch muscles further down your body (Lower back, wrists, quads, hams, groin, calves, shins, etc)

When you finish running make sure that you gradually slow down after running and do a cool down walk. When I rowed at the international level in I think in the 2004 Worlds an Irish lightweight rower died from heart failure because he went from a fast pace to a dead stop. Now I know you aren't doing anything crazy, but it helps. The purpose of stretching top to bottom also has to do with slowly decreasing your heart rate. People make the mistake of running stopping and then doing ham stretches and having their blood flow and heart rate jacked up.
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      06-25-2010, 11:46 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aonarch View Post
Yeah shoes should compliment your running style. That's why I exclusively wear Nimbus 9s/11s. They have the perfect amount of support and cushion for MY foot.

BTW when you run make sure that you vary your distance and pace. Like have one endurance run a week, one day of sprints, one 5 mile, one 6 mile, two 3 miles, w/e. Also vary the intensicty.

I used to go 100% race pace once a week at a 5k. Saturdays. Then Sunday would be easy nice pace medium distance, monday would be sprints, then the rest of the days would be varied distance and pace.

Also make sure that you stretch before and after running 45 seconds each, start at the muscles up top (Neck, upper back, chest, triceps) then proceed to stretch muscles further down your body (Lower back, wrists, quads, hams, groin, calves, shins, etc)

When you finish running make sure that you gradually slow down after running and do a cool down walk. When I rowed at the international level in I think in the 2004 Worlds an Irish lightweight rower died from heart failure because he went from a fast pace to a dead stop. Now I know you aren't doing anything crazy, but it helps. The purpose of stretching top to bottom also has to do with slowly decreasing your heart rate. People make the mistake of running stopping and then doing ham stretches and having their blood flow and heart rate jacked up.
thanks for the tips man I'm always looking for something new to try while running i think I'm gonna give the sprinting and then jogging thing a try since i usually just run at a 7.4mph rate
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      06-27-2010, 01:41 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Seabiscuit View Post
I got it from HBO, and since its a premium channel and I'm too drunk to argue any further, I'm gonna leave it at that.

Real Sports did a piece on running shoes vs. barefoot a few months back and there was not a single study/ piece of evidence that shows that hi-tech running shoes provide any sort of gains in terms of performance/ durability. They even interviewed two of Nike's lead designers and they even admitted that the design and amount of tech that goes into a running shoe doesn't actually do much to improve the human body's natural capability.

Why do you think African nations always dominate at running competitions? It is, in part, because they've learned to run the way the human body has been conditioned to run and not through the guidance of Nike/ Addidas/ Puma/ New Balance.

I never said a running shoe wasn't more comfortable. I mean sure, a running shoe may provide comfort, but it does NOTHING to help your performance or prevent injury caused by the natural act of running (muscle strains, knee problems, etc...)

BTW, where are you getting the unprovided info necessary to effectively dispute my claim? Commercials, or are you a bonafide shoe salesman??
Oh my god... you sound like one of those text book nerds that believe everything that comes out of a tv or newspaper.
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      06-27-2010, 01:42 AM   #40
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when i run, i do 5 miles, guess i dont use them how they are supposed to, but i still love em
You should try the Vibram Five Fingers
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      06-27-2010, 04:47 PM   #41
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Being in an Airborne unit...you either run...or you literally get left behind...so a good pair of running shoes are pretty important to me...I agree with a lot of people on this post and you should definetly go to a running store and go through the whole workup of getting the running shoes you specifically need (depending on your foot shape, gait, foot strike, running surface, etc.)...Im a big Nike fan...but their running shoes are just too narrow for me...Im a really big fan of the Brooks Cascadia's or the Soloman GT Wings
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      06-27-2010, 07:35 PM   #42
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I stress fractured my foot in improper running shoes. My feet are wide and flat. I was in shoes that were too narrow and soft.
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      06-27-2010, 07:49 PM   #43
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yeah you basically summed up what the guy at the store said it sounded like he knew what he was talking about as well. and damn 70 miles per week is crazy i think the most i ever did was like 42 in a week and i was sore as hell everyday lol
No sweat.

Good luck with your shoe choice and with your running. The soreness will diminish for that level as you become more fit and efficient by building volume and frequency.

I'd be doing 70+ again but at age 51 my body just can't take it anymore. The most I've done has been 80 miles and that was about 4 years ago. I did hit 52 miles in a week about 4 months ago. Normally now it's about 35-40.
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      06-27-2010, 08:22 PM   #44
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You should try the Vibram Five Fingers
+1!!

I have the KSOs because they're a little more versatile as opposed to purely running like the Bikilas. Check out birthdayshoes.com. Anyway, I certainly feel that a forefoot strike is much more natural and comfortable for me. There are guys running marathons and longer while wearing these shoes or going completely barefoot. You naysayers are poopooing millions of years of evolution in favor of shoe technology that is only a few decades old. Look at Olympic runners pre-WW II and you'll see they had nothing but a little leather under their feet. Even today sprinters land with the forefoot. Look at a toddler run, and you'll see a forefoot strike. To me it just feels more natural. Try it you might like it...
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