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      03-26-2010, 07:43 AM   #1
Levi
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BMW M3 GTS vs. BMW M3 GT4 ?

I know that the M3 GT4 is a stock M3, that is stipped down and has some modiffications. Is the engine exactly the same or is there at least a carbon air box? The M3 GTS is much more different, specially because of its new engine.
But does anyone know what are the real technical differences between the M3 GTS and M3 GT4?
Which one is better/faster?
Which parts are better? Boysen / Akrapovic, S65B40 / S65B44, Brembo / AP Racing, KW V3 CS / Íhlins, aerodynamics / body panels, BBS 19" / 18"?
Except the M3 GTS stripped down interior, the lip and the rear wing, what are the other differences that the after-market can not offer? Electronic setup?

Last edited by Levi; 08-04-2010 at 04:58 AM. Reason: Confirmation of parts supplier
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      03-29-2010, 12:55 PM   #2
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To my eye, the GTS has a chance of being faster - I think it weighs less and has a bigger engine. The GT4's engine is basically stock, I think a requirement for the classes where it competes.

If the price ends up being fairly similar, I'd give the GTS a try - if nothing else it will be so rare/special, you will aways be able to swap it out for a GT4.

But I'd really like to see some instrumented tests. (Fat chance though, with the cars being so rare/expensive).
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      04-16-2010, 10:49 AM   #3
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But I'd really like to see some instrumented tests. (Fat chance though, with the cars being so rare/expensive).
And wel'll never see them here in the US
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      07-21-2010, 11:30 AM   #4
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I had a chance to see both cars this week end at the Northloop.

The GTS has more power, yes! But lighter ?? I don┤t think so. Why?
The GT4 Series has (appart from windshield) Makrolon windows all round & is 6 spd stick shift The GTS is full glass and has a 40kg heavier DCT.
Both have titanium exhausts so not much difference there. GTS is BTW street legal the GT4 is not!
As for the rims: anyone with knowledge will tell you that the 18" rims are the better track performers 19" is more show.

Hope this might help
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      07-22-2010, 04:15 AM   #5
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Thanks.

N-Ring:
M3: 8.05 min
M3 ZCP: 8.00 min
M3 GTS: 7.40 min
M3 GT4: ??? 7.30 min?
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      07-22-2010, 07:58 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
Thanks.

N-Ring:
M3: 8.05 min
M3 ZCP: 8.00 min
M3 GTS: 7.40 min
M3 GT4: ??? 7.30 min?
Is this 8:00 time of ZCP with or without cup tires?
I heard the same time but is it written somewhere? I couldn't find the actual data.
8:05 time was done by Sport Auto. It was a manual M3 running on cup tires and upgraded brake pads. The same car did 1:14,3 on Hockenheim.

On the recent test of Sport Auto, M3 equipped with DKG + Comp. pack and running on regular tires did 1:14,2 on Hockenheim. But there was no mention of The Ring time.

Also there is no official time for M3 GTS on the Ring yet.

As for the Topic Question:
I guess GT4 is lighter and even it has 30 hp less, it may be quicker than GTS on track. This is my personal opinion. I find GT4 as a more track focused M3.
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      07-22-2010, 08:34 AM   #7
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Which car will be faster around the ring! The GTS has 30Hp more, it has M-DCT and proper aerodynamics! both cars have good suspension and brakes. Tires the GTS has P zero corsas and the Gt4 has Dunlop Direzza 03G. To close to call! well have to wait for a Sport Auto comparison
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      07-22-2010, 08:36 AM   #8
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Oh by the way BMW charges $2500.00 extra for springs and wheels it's called ZCP.
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      08-03-2010, 05:28 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trier Germany View Post
...well have to wait for a Sport Auto comparison
Which will be next month !
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      08-03-2010, 06:20 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great White View Post
Which will be next month !
Can't wait for that!
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      08-03-2010, 07:31 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
Thanks.

N-Ring:
M3: 8.05 min
M3 ZCP: 8.00 min
M3 GTS: 7.40 min
M3 GT4: ??? 7.30 min?
Levi loves posting 'ring numbers

Where did you get the M3 ZCP ring times, Levi?
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      08-03-2010, 08:58 PM   #12
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M3 GT4 is a race car designed by BMW Motorsports to compete in the FIA GT4 series, which is a series designed for amateur racing drivers to run cost-effective race cars.

Therefore the GT4 rule book only allows minimal changes from series production M3 components, and engine modification is generally not allowed. The cars even run catalytic converters.

Nonetheless, for the parts that are modified, i.e. brakes, suspension, clutch disc, they are racing parts and need to be rebuilt on a regular basis, so it would not make sense to run these on the street.

The M3 GTS is a street-legal track car designed by M GmbH. It is not designed to any specific racing series, so everything is basically a free-for-all for M. This is why BMW can increase the engine displacement, add aero, etc.

Performance wise the GT4, being a stripped out race car (3150 vs. ~3400 lb), with race suspension (~twice as stiff as GTS), actual slick tires vs. street legal tires, I would image it would be faster despite being 30 hp down.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...&highlight=gt4
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...&highlight=gts
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      08-04-2010, 04:55 AM   #13
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The M3 GT4 doesn't really have less power or torque than the M3 GTS, as it has Full Akrapovic Evolution System. But the M3 GTS specs might be conservative, and I would say it has closer to 460 PS, 440 Nm is correct, it is the displacement.
4.0l V8: 105 PS/l -> 420 PS, 100 Nm/l -> 400 Nm
4.4l V8: 105 PS/l -> 462 PS, 100 Nm/l -> 440 Nm

I do not remember who's M3 E92 it is, but it is AW with 18 "OZ Superleggera rims. It has Akrapovic full exhaust, Brembo brakes or maybe just uprgraded stock brakes, ECU tune and KW V3 CS, but is not stripped out, it has navi and so, and it ran Hockenheim slightly faster than M3 CSL, and the N-Ring also in 7:50 min. So for the M3 GTS 7:40 min is sure, if not better. But we'll see. As the the M3 ZCP I think the 8:00 min N-Ring is with is with stock tires.
8:13 min: M3 6MT with 18" rims and stock tires
8:05 min: M3 6MT with 18" rims and sport tires
8:00 min: M3 ZCP 7DCT with 19" rims and I think stock tires

Last edited by Levi; 08-04-2010 at 12:44 PM.
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      08-04-2010, 10:35 AM   #14
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CAR magazine just ran main articles on the M3 GTS and 911 GT2 RS - very good articles and photos. The GT2 RS crushes the M3 performance-wise, but they actually liked (and bought!) the GTS because it's a better tool for the common man, and for learning/improving at the track.

They said the GTS has everything on the repertoire - understeer, oversteer, drift - just like the regular M3 but at the higher level, and it's all accessible and clearly indicated, so you can learn, play, improve and generally come out of it with a huge grin.

By contrast, the 611HP GT2 RS is totally unforgiving and will literally kill you if you aren't supremely good.


So my dream retirement now would be a condo near the Ring, with a 1 car garage and a GTS in it.
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Last edited by adc; 08-04-2010 at 12:59 PM.
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      08-04-2010, 12:46 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
M3 GTS and 911 GT RS
911 GT3 or GT2 RS?

You live near the N-Ring right?
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      08-04-2010, 12:59 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
911 GT3 or GT2 RS?
GT2 RS, sorry for the typo.

Quote:
You live near the N-Ring right?
No, near Washington DC. But I bought the M3 via Euro Delivery, drove the Ring etc.
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      08-04-2010, 01:17 PM   #17
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Ok, because on you sig I see your M3 with german temporary licence plate.

Well, I would take M3 GTS over 911 GT2 RS, but 911 GT3 RS over M3 GTS. NA > FI. But 911 GT2 RS is a monster. If I wanted to suicide, I'd drive it.
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      08-04-2010, 01:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
Well, I would take M3 GTS over 911 GT2 RS, but 911 GT3 RS over M3 GTS. NA > FI. But 911 GT2 RS is a monster. If I wanted to suicide, I'd drive it.
Yes well, I don't have as much time as I'd like for track driving, and using a car like the 911 GT3 (any 911, really) requires a steep learning curve, plus constant practice - due to the special handling characteristics.

The M3 - any M3 - is a pussycat by comparison, and I have no fear. I think it's also a better car for learning (and I'm definitely still in the learning process, no doubt about that).
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      08-04-2010, 03:35 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
Thanks.

N-Ring:
M3: 8.05 min
M3 ZCP: 8.00 min
M3 GTS: 7.40 min
M3 GT4: ??? 7.30 min?
The best lap time in qualifying session in 2009 VLN for BMW M3 GT4 was 9:03. You subtract 1:40 for VLN GT Nurburgring course (my telemetry data) and we have full Nordschlife lap 7:23. If we take some traffic in consideration, it might be 7:20 or even faster
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      08-05-2010, 03:17 AM   #20
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Thanks. I want an M3 GT4 to beat the 911 GT2 RS!
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      08-05-2010, 12:56 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
Thanks. I want an M3 GT4 to beat the 911 GT2 RS!
Levi,

Yo post allot of speculation of ring times where do you get your data?

Do you even own an M3? By reading several of your posts or is just me you have very little practicable knowledge. This only comes if you actually drive one on the track and actually own an M3.

So what is it you drive? Or you are getting ready to purchase?
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      08-05-2010, 02:45 PM   #22
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No. I have no M3. I have Lexus IS200. I am 20, can't afford an M, I am not working, I am yet studing.
My dream car always was M3. It started wiht M3 E36, then M3 E46 and now M3 E92. I have a track close to where I live, and just can't see how Lotus, M3, 911 GT3 and Ferrari owners have fun there. I cannot imrpove my driving skills on the road anymore, without being dangerous for others.
I do not want to miss the NA M cars. Hope I'll yet get an M3 E92 before the next M3 comes out. I have two years before it stops productin. I going to do my best.

Last edited by Levi; 08-05-2010 at 02:50 PM.
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