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      03-13-2010, 03:06 AM   #89
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its 22k plus i believe 25 core which you get back, you also need to send back a good engine so i dont think if you lock your up you can send it back
read the website or call them for more info, im not much on dinan because of there price but they seem to be pretty good on the e92, i wouldnt mind buying it
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      03-13-2010, 05:26 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
Those numbers will be released soon...

A detailed feature story on the Dinan S3-R package is coming out in Car & Driver magazine in a few months.

oh nice can't wait to read up on it... dinan is solid but bank!!!
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      03-13-2010, 10:35 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studntloan View Post
its 22k plus i believe 25 core which you get back, you also need to send back a good engine so i dont think if you lock your up you can send it back
read the website or call them for more info, im not much on dinan because of there price but they seem to be pretty good on the e92, i wouldnt mind buying it
That is not bad actually....for NA power.
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      03-13-2010, 11:17 AM   #92
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does it work with the DCT trans?

I think this is a well rounded package which allows everyday drivability which is what I believe what's Dinan's goals are.
you are still getting ass raped but whatchya gonna do.....
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      03-13-2010, 12:22 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Loseit View Post
does it work with the DCT trans?

I think this is a well rounded package which allows everyday drivability which is what I believe what's Dinan's goals are.
you are still getting ass raped but whatchya gonna do.....
YES.

I have to say something here...

Based on some of the 'snide' comments made in this thread, it's clear to me that some of you are in desperate need of a little perspective...

A replacement 4.0 liter S65B40 V8 engine purchased directly from your local BMW dealership is $24,500 USD, and that price does not include installation!

Now keep in mind, that 24k is for a RE-MANUFACTURED S65 V8 engine. A 'brand new' S65 V8 from the factory would set you back $33,000 plus installation.

All Dinan stroker engines are actually built in house. (no third-party work is done outside the engine shop)

Dinan will match your factory new car warranty coverage up to 4yrs/50,000 miles. Even the BMW factory re-manufactured engines won't offer you that kind of coverage. (only 2yrs, unlimited miles)

So Dinan is actually offering you a BUILT MOTOR that has stronger internals than the stock 4.0 liter factory engine, has larger displacement (4.6 liters), features a forged steel nitrided crankshaft, Carillo forged steel connecting rods, and Mahle forged aluminum pistons...

And you guys are complaining about the 23k price tag? Geez...

The $19,995 sale price is actually a steal for what you're getting.

You guys really need to start doing your homework. Seriously...

The lack of simple (basic) mechnanical knowledge about engine related performance parts on this board is astounding.
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      03-13-2010, 12:33 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
YES.

I have to say something here...

Based on some of the 'snide' comments made in this thread, it's clear to me that some of you are in desperate need of a little perspective...

A replacement 4.0 liter S65B40 V8 engine purchased directly from your local BMW dealership is $24,500 USD, and that price does not include installation!

Now keep in mind, that 24k is for a RE-MANUFACTURED S65 V8 engine. A 'brand new' S65 V8 from the factory would set you back $33,000 plus installation.

All Dinan stroker engines are actually built in house. (no third-party work is done outside the engine shop)

Dinan will match your factory new car warranty coverage up to 4yrs/50,000 miles. Even the BMW factory re-manufactured engines won't offer you that kind of coverage. (only 2yrs, unlimited miles)

So Dinan is actually offering you a BUILT MOTOR that has stronger internals than the stock 4.0 liter factory engine, has larger displacement (4.6 liters), features a forged steel nitrided crankshaft, Carillo forged steel connecting rods, and Mahle forged aluminum pistons...

And you guys are complaining about the 23k price tag? Geez...

The $19,995 sale price is actually a steal for what you're getting.

You guys really need to start doing your homework. Seriously...

The lack of simple (basic) mechnanical knowledge about engine related performance parts on this board is astounding.
it really is a good deal i hate hearing people cry over the price on something like this, 20k? for a fully built motor!, a good amount of people here are spending atleast 5g on an exhaust system, by the time your done getting some more bolt on and wheel your close to 15gs,.... hmmm i know where id rather spend my money and thats why im waiting for this not a 5g exhaust and 5g rims so my car looks pretty, although i would like some new rims, ill do some major performance first!
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      03-13-2010, 01:16 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
YES.

I have to say something here...

Based on some of the 'snide' comments made in this thread, it's clear to me that some of you are in desperate need of a little perspective...

A replacement 4.0 liter S65B40 V8 engine purchased directly from your local BMW dealership is $24,500 USD, and that price does not include installation!

Now keep in mind, that 24k is for a RE-MANUFACTURED S65 V8 engine. A 'brand new' S65 V8 from the factory would set you back $33,000 plus installation.

All Dinan stroker engines are actually built in house. (no third-party work is done outside the engine shop)

Dinan will match your factory new car warranty coverage up to 4yrs/50,000 miles. Even the BMW factory re-manufactured engines won't offer you that kind of coverage. (only 2yrs, unlimited miles)

So Dinan is actually offering you a BUILT MOTOR that has stronger internals than the stock 4.0 liter factory engine, has larger displacement (4.6 liters), features a forged steel nitrided crankshaft, Carillo forged steel connecting rods, and Mahle forged aluminum pistons...

And you guys are complaining about the 23k price tag? Geez...

The $19,995 sale price is actually a steal for what you're getting.

You guys really need to start doing your homework. Seriously...

The lack of simple (basic) mechnanical knowledge about engine related performance parts on this board is astounding.
I have to say something as well .

The Dinan price is not that bad but there are some more things to consider.

The Dinan engine is a rebuilt engine. You have to send your engine to Dinan to get the price mentioned here.

The Dinan 4.6 delivers full power only with a series of additional Dinan mods, which will raise the price.

I'd love to be able to get a stroker kit:

- crankshaft & bearings
- rods & bearings
- OEM cast ( +0.20mm ) or forged pistons with user-definable compression ratio for NA or FI applications
- ECU flash

For such an application honing the cylinders only might be a better option, even when you would get less displacement out of it ( maybe 4.4 L ? ). Optional cylinder head rebuild only. This would be very cost-effective and a solid base for further enhancements. Should be good for 460-480 bhp and not more than $8k-$9k for the parts depending on the pistons you use. Plus engine out & in procedure, honing cylinders and rebuilding the engine. Another $8k, my guess. BTW, pricing is on the higher side.

Eugen
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      03-13-2010, 01:42 PM   #96
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its a matter of getting those parts at that point and how much for them if you an find them, ive considered it as im in the process of this with another car, parts are roughly 5k and 2k in labor plus plus pulling the motor
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      03-13-2010, 02:00 PM   #97
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To be fair I think some of the pricing issue was down to the fact that you are bringing the car into a price range where you could just get straight into something like a GT3 etc but no question for the engine it's not a bad price at all.
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      03-13-2010, 02:01 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
YES.

I have to say something here...

Based on some of the 'snide' comments made in this thread, it's clear to me that some of you are in desperate need of a little perspective...

A replacement 4.0 liter S65B40 V8 engine purchased directly from your local BMW dealership is $24,500 USD, and that price does not include installation!

Now keep in mind, that 24k is for a RE-MANUFACTURED S65 V8 engine. A 'brand new' S65 V8 from the factory would set you back $33,000 plus installation.

All Dinan stroker engines are actually built in house. (no third-party work is done outside the engine shop)

Dinan will match your factory new car warranty coverage up to 4yrs/50,000 miles. Even the BMW factory re-manufactured engines won't offer you that kind of coverage. (only 2yrs, unlimited miles)

So Dinan is actually offering you a BUILT MOTOR that has stronger internals than the stock 4.0 liter factory engine, has larger displacement (4.6 liters), features a forged steel nitrided crankshaft, Carillo forged steel connecting rods, and Mahle forged aluminum pistons...

And you guys are complaining about the 23k price tag? Geez...

The $19,995 sale price is actually a steal for what you're getting.

You guys really need to start doing your homework. Seriously...

The lack of simple (basic) mechnanical knowledge about engine related performance parts on this board is astounding.

There's no arguing with these facts. However myself and I'm sure many people on this forum still cannot justify spending that type of money for 100+hp on this car. Yes a new engine from BMW is more expensive, but I would never buy one of those either. If mine went bad it would be replaced free under warranty. If warranty is up and for some reason I needed a new engine, I would not buy it. I'd sell the car and choose to buy a new car using that money as a down payment. So yes, Dinan offers a better option than buying a new factory motor, but it's still not worth the money to sink into this car.
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      03-13-2010, 02:44 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e.n335 View Post
I have to say something as well .

The Dinan price is not that bad but there are some more things to consider.

The Dinan engine is a rebuilt engine. You have to send your engine to Dinan to get the price mentioned here.

The Dinan 4.6 delivers full power only with a series of additional Dinan mods, which will raise the price.

I'd love to be able to get a stroker kit:

- crankshaft & bearings
- rods & bearings
- forged pistons with user-definable compression ratio ( for NA or FI applications )
- flash

For such an application honing the cylinders might be a better option, even when you would get less displacement out of it ( maybe 4.4 L ? ). Optional cylinder head rebuild. This would be very cost-effective and a solid base for further enhancements. Should be good for 470-480 bhp and not more than $9k for the parts.

Eugen
Good points Eugen, but let me clarify a few things for you.

a) Yes, the Dinan stroker is a rebuilt engine...but so are the re-manufactured engines you get from BMW for 24k, unless you opt for the more expensive "virgin" V8 motor option from BMW. (which is much more expensive)

b) Also, I need to clear up a common misconception about how the Dinan stroker engine swap is made...

Yes, you can opt to have your stock engine removed and sent to Dinan to get the 4.6 liter stroker rebuild done on the existing motor. (which means your car will be down for about 10-14 days)

or...

You can purchase the Dinan 4.6 liter stroker engine upfront (plus the core charge), and have your engine pulled at the local BMW dealership while the stroker engine is in route. After the stroker engine arrives, the dealer installs it, and your existing engine is shipped back to Dinan. (and your core charge is refunded back to you)

c) All stroker engines rely upon additional naturally aspirated engine performance parts, to achieve the horsepower and torque number they claim. (even RD Sport) In the case of RD Sport's 4.6 liter stroker, those additional parts are included in the purchase price. But...their price reflects that, since the cost for that stroker engine package is ~ $34,000.

d) You can get 4.4 liters of displacement out of the S65B40 engine if you don't line bore the engine out to 93-94mm. (stock is 92.0mm) By increasing just the stroke alone (to 83.0mm) that will get you to 4.4 liters of displacement on this engine. (stock is 75.2mm) I suspect that's exactly what BMW did with the 4.4 liter engine in the limited-edition M3 GTS.

Cylinder honing is going to be a necessity to get a proper seal on the piston rings, if you do bore out the cylinders on this aluminum block, since the S65's cylinder walls do not have a thermal/friction coating like Nikasil or a Plasma spray coating like the GTR engine does. If you don't get the cylinder honing process done properly, cylinder ring blow by, and increased oil consumption will result. (guaranteed)

The cylinder honing process you mentioned must be very precise with no cylinder taper present. Keep in mind, that the piston rings in our 8400rpm engines are subject to more wear as they move up and down inside the cylinder bore. (due to the inherent engine loads created by such high piston speeds and the gas loads acting on the ring)

Also, to minimize friction, Dinan has selected a piston ring material that is very wear-resistant, and the piston skirts are also coated to improve the wear resistance of these reciprocating parts.

Typically, top piston rings in high revving engines (and oil control rings) will be Nitrided, or have a PVD (physical vapor deposit) ceramic coating. The lower oil control ring is designed to leave a lubricating oil film (which is only a few millimeters thick on the bore), as the piston descends on the down stroke. Proper piston ring metallurgy is also very important to insure proper expansion and contraction under all operating conditions. (to promote a proper seal over a very wide temperature range)
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      03-13-2010, 02:46 PM   #100
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I'm curious about the claims of Dinan being rip off merchants. I looked at their exhaust options and they don't seem to be much different to other options?

What parts are much cheaper? I'm interested for future reference.
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      03-13-2010, 02:46 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J08M3 View Post
There's no arguing with these facts. However myself and I'm sure many people on this forum still cannot justify spending that type of money for 100+hp on this car. Yes a new engine from BMW is more expensive, but I would never buy one of those either. If mine went bad it would be replaced free under warranty. If warranty is up and for some reason I needed a new engine, I would not buy it. I'd sell the car and choose to buy a new car using that money as a down payment. So yes, Dinan offers a better option than buying a new factory motor, but it's still not worth the money to sink into this car.
Fair enough, I can't argue with that logic.
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      03-13-2010, 04:23 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
I'm curious about the claims of Dinan being rip off merchants. I looked at their exhaust options and they don't seem to be much different to other options?

What parts are much cheaper? I'm interested for future reference.
I think pulley is one very very competitive priced product form Dinan for our cars.
Exhaust (when it was 2k) was very competitive too but not anymore.

I do agree that Dinan costs a bit too high but I see it as "peace of mind" warranty/insurance price in my head.
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      03-13-2010, 04:32 PM   #103
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People would be far better off buying a different car... believe me.
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      03-13-2010, 05:12 PM   #104
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IMO, a stock M3 has more than enough power to challenge the driver, if you like to, bolt on + 50bhp. As with my former tuned 335i and now the M3, power is nothing without traction. I like the M3 way over the tuned 335i. Of course, 1/4 miles and a lot of hp will be fun but not more. The stock engine fits very well the M3.
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      03-13-2010, 05:20 PM   #105
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      03-13-2010, 05:26 PM   #106
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Quote:
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If you use Dinan - be shure that there will be no money left for dinner
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      03-13-2010, 11:59 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J08M3 View Post
There's no arguing with these facts. However myself and I'm sure many people on this forum still cannot justify spending that type of money for 100+hp on this car. Yes a new engine from BMW is more expensive, but I would never buy one of those either. If mine went bad it would be replaced free under warranty. If warranty is up and for some reason I needed a new engine, I would not buy it. I'd sell the car and choose to buy a new car using that money as a down payment. So yes, Dinan offers a better option than buying a new factory motor, but it's still not worth the money to sink into this car.
I could not agree more. Most people interested in increasing the performance of their M3 will probably not replace their entire engine to accomplish that. This is why it makes no sense spending this type of money for a slight increase in power. I understand that Dinan offers an improved engine for less than a new one from BMW but does not justify the price tag, especially if there is nothing wrong with your current engine. This does not have anything to do with the lack of basic mechanical knowledge as some might put it.

Good point...
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      03-14-2010, 02:11 AM   #108
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20k is a lot of cheese, but the warranty does have value. I am very pleased the with the performance from my M3. When I wanna go for those 1/4mi blasts that's what the race car is for.
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      03-14-2010, 03:25 AM   #109
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all the bitching lmao, either buy it or don't nobody is forcing you. seems like the people bitching either really want it and can't afford it or are to cheap to splurge. if its not for you which in 90% of the people it won't be then move on to your GT3 real simple

and the SC camp who save about maybe 5k and want all that more power when your car blows up lets see how well that company takes care of you and your blown up car
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      03-14-2010, 09:56 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H Bomb View Post
all the bitching lmao, either buy it or don't nobody is forcing you. seems like the people bitching either really want it and can't afford it or are to cheap to splurge. if its not for you which in 90% of the people it won't be then move on to your GT3 real simple

and the SC camp who save about maybe 5k and want all that more power when your car blows up lets see how well that company takes care of you and your blown up car
A couple of things here. I think that for an engine it's actually quite cheap but I'm in the camp of rather selling the car and making a step up rather than creating a GT3 priced M3. Just my preference.

The SC option is considerable cheaper than the new engine plan. Right now you can get the G-Power option for about $11k plus fitting. All told you would probably end up spending half the total of the Dinan engine option and no one I've read about have had a blown up car problem so scare mongering with no facts is just as silly as people bitching about Dinan pricing.

They are different options for different tastes. Some people don't like Forced Induction in a car and some do. It's preference. Both are good solutions to the same question. If I was going to bother I'd go the S/C route as it would be just inside what I would consider to the most I would spend on an M3. And in case you say it, I can well afford either but spend on things I believe are worth it in a given situation.
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