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      01-11-2010, 01:07 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by adc View Post
Which is why I ended up with the M3, it's such a balanced package (well except for the brakes). Truly impossible to beat, especially at my price point of $50k.


I agree, at that price the M3 is king of the hill.




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No, it isn't - faster certainly, but not better in some key categories of mine. For one thing, it costs $30k more than my M3, has less practicality (rear seats, 2 doors), a much harsher ride and extremely questionable warranty policies. Also, there is no manual tranny option which for me is the deal killer.



I guess this is just a subjective call. For me, the GTR is a signicantly more practical car than either the M3 or Black (part of the reason I dumped the Merc). It's all wheel drive is a much better choice in this part of the country.
On top of that, the Nissan will destroy both of them performance wise.



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Basically, I'm just offering a different perspective. It's ok to like another car, be it the Black, the GTR or whatever else. What's good for me may not be good for someone else, and vice-versa.


I can respect that. I have a soft spot for the Merc though. And at $80k used it the Black is a bargain.
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      01-11-2010, 03:40 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
The CLK63 Black Series was a low production one-off car Mercedes built in model year 2008. There were only about 500 built. They listed at $138,500 for a naturally aspirated 6.2 liter AMG engined car with significant performance modifications. I owned one for a year and a half and picked it over a 997 Turbo and an R8 and dumped an M6 for it. That said I dumped the Black for my GTR.
interesting. how is the 997 turbo compare to the gtr. very interest to read your take on these two. what makes you dump turbo, r8, black, m6 for a gtr?
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      01-11-2010, 03:45 PM   #47
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For fun, "Bolt-on" DCT M3 vs CLK Black

the black can make alot of power with some mods also..
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      01-11-2010, 08:04 PM   #48
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interesting. how is the 997 turbo compare to the gtr. very interest to read your take on these two. what makes you dump turbo, r8, black, m6 for a gtr?


I'm sorry that I wasn't clear. I picked the Black over the Turbo and the R8, I only dumped the M6.
I chose the Black over the 997 Turbo because it was better looking, more practical, and more unique. I picked it over the R8 because it was better looking and more powerful. And I dumped the M6 because it was an awful car.
The GTR is such a great vehicle in almost every respect, better than the four mentioned above.
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      01-12-2010, 10:47 AM   #49
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There is nothing to compare! Its like comparing a Ford Fiesta GT to the M3. Pretty certain you can make some sort of convoluted argument where those two cars times are similar to the difference between the CLK adn the M3, but again, nothing really to compare here.
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      01-14-2010, 11:08 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by CATCH_M3 View Post
BMW M3 with Sport Pack
-420 hp
-Michelin Pilot Sport Cup
-280 km/h
-0-100 km/h: 4,8 s
-0-200 km/h: 15,7 s
-80-120 km/h: 7,2 s (6th)

Mercedes-Benz CLK63 AMG Black Series
-507 hp
-Pirelli P Zero Corsa
-300 km/h (limited)
-0-100 km/h: 4,5 s
-0-200 km/h: 14,6 s
-80-120 km/h: 8,9 s (7th)





Very impressed the M3 is only a bit slower around the track considering the power & price discrepency!
What about adding the M3 GTS to the comparison - can't wait to see the track time comparisons once those come out!!

The price of the BMW M3 GTS with the features shown is expected to be EUR 115,000.- for delivery in Germany, including 19% VAT.
The first vehicles are due to be supplied in May 2010.
The first vehicles to be produced will be those for individual registration in Germany
Registrations in other countries will be possible from summer 2010
450 BHP (4.4l V8)
1490 kg / 3278 lbs (DIN standard)
6 / 4 piston brake system
6 point harness
255 35 19 F
285 30 19 R
Rollbar behind the front seats ( only 2 seats )
Front splitter and Spoiler ( adjustable )
Fire hydrant
Racing combo with helmet
Hockenheimring:
1.13,8 min - Mercedes-Benz CLK63 AMG Black Series
1.14,3 min - BMW M3
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      01-15-2010, 02:14 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
I'm sorry that I wasn't clear. I picked the Black over the Turbo and the R8, I only dumped the M6.
I chose the Black over the 997 Turbo because it was better looking, more practical, and more unique. I picked it over the R8 because it was better looking and more powerful. And I dumped the M6 because it was an awful car.
The GTR is such a great vehicle in almost every respect, better than the four mentioned above.
the GTR is a video game i can understand the R8 and the M6, but over the 997? i guess the GTR does have more potential when modifying, but the black series is a looker...i think i would go with the black series over the 997, it wouldnt be a very easy decision though lol definitely over the GTR...but what made you dump the 63 for the GTR?


and by the way i find this thread MUCH MORE interesting than the 335is one...
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      01-15-2010, 02:49 AM   #52
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the GTR is a video game i can understand the R8 and the M6, but over the 997? i guess the GTR does have more potential when modifying, but the black series is a looker...i think i would go with the black series over the 997, it wouldnt be a very easy decision though lol definitely over the GTR...but what made you dump the 63 for the GTR?


and by the way i find this thread MUCH MORE interesting than the 335is one...

I was really talking about the Black over the 997 Turbo, R8, and M6.
I picked the GTR over the Black because I wanted a 997GT3 and need a car for the winter. So I traded my Merc in on the GT3 and kept the GTR for a winter vehicle. But eventually reason jolted me into reality and I decided to bag the GT3 and get a fast truck(hence the X6M).
I do strongly disagree with the GTR slam. It's a great car. I will keep it for another year or so and bide my time on the next purchase(maybe whatever replaces the 997, maybe the next M5, maybe a 458, maybe an SLS, maybe GTR Spec M, etc).
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      01-16-2010, 01:28 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
I was really talking about the Black over the 997 Turbo, R8, and M6.
I picked the GTR over the Black because I wanted a 997GT3 and need a car for the winter. So I traded my Merc in on the GT3 and kept the GTR for a winter vehicle. But eventually reason jolted me into reality and I decided to bag the GT3 and get a fast truck(hence the X6M).
I do strongly disagree with the GTR slam. It's a great car. I will keep it for another year or so and bide my time on the next purchase(maybe whatever replaces the 997, maybe the next M5, maybe a 458, maybe an SLS, maybe GTR Spec M, etc).
458 for sure
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      01-16-2010, 04:07 AM   #54
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You are right! I saw one in Atlanta a few months ago, and it moves!!!
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Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG View Post
Honestly who cares which is faster. CLK63 Black Series will one day be a collectors car. Very rare production. I seen only one once in my life on the road. Talk about a car that will turn heads.
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      01-17-2010, 02:49 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Powerslide View Post
What about adding the M3 GTS to the comparison - can't wait to see the track time comparisons once those come out!!

The price of the BMW M3 GTS with the features shown is expected to be EUR 115,000.- for delivery in Germany, including 19% VAT.
The first vehicles are due to be supplied in May 2010.
The first vehicles to be produced will be those for individual registration in Germany
Registrations in other countries will be possible from summer 2010
450 BHP (4.4l V8)
1490 kg / 3278 lbs (DIN standard)
6 / 4 piston brake system
6 point harness
255 35 19 F
285 30 19 R
Rollbar behind the front seats ( only 2 seats )
Front splitter and Spoiler ( adjustable )
Fire hydrant
Racing combo with helmet
Hockenheimring:
1.13,8 min - Mercedes-Benz CLK63 AMG Black Series
1.14,3 min - BMW M3



The GTS M3 is more of a track oriented car rather than a luxury sports car like both the Black and normal M3.

The reason the CLK black is an awesome is not because its the fastest car in the world or would it lap the nurburgring like GTR. The Black is good cause its a perfect combination of luxury,comfort and sportiness.
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      01-17-2010, 05:48 AM   #56
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The GTS M3 is more of a track oriented car rather than a luxury sports car like both the Black and normal M3.

The reason the CLK black is an awesome is not because its the fastest car in the world or would it lap the nurburgring like GTR. The Black is good cause its a perfect combination of luxury,comfort and sportiness.


I'm not too sure if I agree with that. The Black is fairly harsh and relatively spartan. Luxury doesn't come to mind when you drive it.
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      01-17-2010, 06:59 PM   #57
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aside from the widebody work and carbon brake, I think the black is way overpriced when you can have the c63 amg for less than half the price.

they sounds the same, same engine, etc. the c63 amg is even more pratical and more luxurious.
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      01-17-2010, 07:09 PM   #58
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The only real difference is that the Black does handle extremely well and is a joy to drive by all accounts, not to say that the C63 is bad or anything. The price is dear or cheap depending on how much you value the driving experience, I too feel it's over priced but then I ain't the person with which the Black was developed for.
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      01-17-2010, 11:06 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by CATCH_M3 View Post
Very impressed the M3 is only a bit slower around the track considering the power & price discrepency!
^ +1.

M GmbH provides to the common man, at a modest price, performance that rivals or exceeds $100k+ vehicles. The price difference between these two is ridiculous. Isn't a blk like $136k?
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      01-18-2010, 12:50 AM   #60
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^ +1.

M GmbH provides to the common man, at a modest price, performance that rivals or exceeds $100k+ vehicles. The price difference between these two is ridiculous. Isn't a blk like $136k?
at that price, i see zero reason to not go for an r8 v10, gt3 rs, etc. ton of cars that ar better looking/performing than the black.
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      01-18-2010, 08:32 PM   #61
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I'm not too sure if I agree with that. The Black is fairly harsh and relatively spartan. Luxury doesn't come to mind when you drive it.
compared to M3GTS and 911GT3 the Black is still quite civilized. Afterall Black series is a mercedes therefore when they were designing it comfort and being easy to drive was probably part of their goal. Hence why the Black has a auto gear box. Also I don't think Mercedes has a proper manual gearbox that they can throw in with the M156 anyways since theres just too much torque.
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      01-18-2010, 08:43 PM   #62
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Haha are you the guy (w/o backseats) in the video that took on that CLK-Black.
Yeah, removing the back seats is what did it.
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      01-20-2010, 01:35 PM   #63
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my bro has a black series and we dragged a couple times
lets just say theres a reason its called a black series lol
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      01-20-2010, 07:29 PM   #64
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compared to M3GTS and 911GT3 the Black is still quite civilized. Afterall Black series is a mercedes therefore when they were designing it comfort and being easy to drive was probably part of their goal. Hence why the Black has a auto gear box. Also I don't think Mercedes has a proper manual gearbox that they can throw in with the M156 anyways since theres just too much torque.
Yeah the CLK63 Black Series is definitely more comfy than the M3GTS but it's still a pretty harsh car. A stock M3 is a much better balance of luxury and sportiness.
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      02-20-2010, 05:39 PM   #65
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A good friend has a 63 bs red one of 35 cars made in that color. That in itself is something great. The car is amazing drove it numerous times. A lot harsher with the macpherson suspension STOCK. That is one car that everyone stares at when driven!!!! EVERYONE. Not my cup of tea BUT thats why u buy one of 350 cars made. In all honestly thats about the only car that even makes me think twice about buying an m3 enough said.
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      02-20-2010, 06:35 PM   #66
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I still love the black series as a road going car.. who cares about the track?
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