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      10-30-2009, 09:54 AM   #89
STIto335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaypod View Post
Just out of curiousity Michael - what settings were you running - DSC off? (didnt notice that you mentioned or not)
he was running DSC off
When you know how to drive DSC on or MDM is a joke
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      10-30-2009, 09:56 AM   #90
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You're right - age wasn't a complete non-factor. But certainly experience is experience and an accomplished driver is an accomplished driver. The two younger journos did beat Lutz, yes, but presumably they have a good deal of track experience under their belts too (though I'd like to know just how much). But then there's the younger private CTS owner (I am assuming it is a Gen II CTS-V) who got killed by Lutz. Experience > Age.
Werd. It is race car driving and not fighter jet flying at speeds faster than sound. Don't forget the legend Walter Rohrl for Porsche. Aside from product development and testing, Porsche uses Walter to get the fastest laps out of Porsche cars. I have read some impressions by people who frequently go to the tracks and sat beside him, he almost makes these people wet their pants and that is without Walter wearing a helmet. He still has faster reflexes than most people who drive at the race track. He is what 60 something??
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      10-30-2009, 10:01 AM   #91
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Werd. It is race car driving and not fighter jet flying at speeds faster than sound. Don't forget the legend Walter Rohrl for Porsche. Aside from product development and testing, Porsche uses Walter to get the fastest laps out of Porsche cars. I have read some impressions by people who frequently go to the tracks and sat beside him, he almost makes these people wet their pants and that is without Walter wearing a helmet. He still has faster reflexes than most people who drive at the race track. He is what 60 something??

I know a lot of 60+ people that are still very quick on a bike,snowmobile or in a car.The difference is that were quick 30 + years ago when I first knew them.
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      10-30-2009, 10:02 AM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaypod View Post
Just out of curiousity Michael - what settings were you running - DSC off? (didnt notice that you mentioned or not)
Yeah no dsc for me, I ran comfort suspension in the morning when it was wet and then sport suspension on the timed laps when it dried up.
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      10-30-2009, 10:06 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by STIto335 View Post
he was running DSC off
When you know how to drive DSC on or MDM is a joke
You mean you dont crash the moment the DSC is turned off
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      10-30-2009, 10:06 AM   #94
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Quote:
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Great theory - but you are completely speculating and no one knows for sure what would have happened. It's too bad they didn't swap cars and see. But of course that would never happen given that this was a GM run event and Heinricy is GM's driver.
Cooper already hinted that he would have probably easily eclipsed his M3 time in the CTS-V if the car he drove was fitted with a transponder. He hinted this in post #61.
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I can say one thing for sure I got to drive the CTSV and the M3 is NOT the faster car on the track. I am hoping to get some timed laps in the CTSV on monticello in the near future.
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      10-30-2009, 10:07 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STIto335 View Post
he was running DSC off
When you know how to drive DSC on or MDM is a joke
Yep - way too instrusive and heats the brakes up too much!

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Originally Posted by the///Mthree View Post
Yeah no dsc for me, I ran comfort suspension in the morning when it was wet and then sport suspension on the timed laps when it dried up.
Cool thanks
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      10-30-2009, 10:09 AM   #96
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Yeah no dsc for me, I ran comfort suspension in the morning when it was wet and then sport suspension on the timed laps when it dried up.
That also works very well for myself.
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      10-30-2009, 10:43 AM   #97
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Quote:
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Yeah no dsc for me, I ran comfort suspension in the morning when it was wet and then sport suspension on the timed laps when it dried up.
I am surprised you used Sport for suspension as it locks out the adjustable/ adaptive features. It is good for auto-Xing but Normal is technically better on the track. Bernd Limmer told me Comfort on the 'Ring is a few seconds faster because of the increased travel for the rough spots and like Normals ability to self adjust. That being said I would guess normal would be better on Monticello but would it be? I don't know and sure it would not make a world of difference just some more fodder. The same as Sport + on the throttle mapping is too aggressive in most cases. Great job again representing the ///M3!

-M
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      10-30-2009, 10:50 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
I am surprised you used Sport for suspension as it locks out the adjustable/ adaptive features. It is good for auto-Xing but Normal is technically better on the track. Bernd Limmer told me Comfort on the 'Ring is a few seconds faster because of the increased travel for the rough spots and like Normals ability to self adjust. That being said I would guess normal would be better on Monticello but would it be? I don't know and sure it would not make a world of difference just some more fodder. The same as Sport + on the throttle mapping is too aggressive in most cases. Great job again representing the ///M3!

-M
In my experiance the car is much more tied down in the sport mode than using the normal or comfort modes which makes it easier to go quicker.In pictures of my car in the wet where I use the comfort setting you can see more body roll than when I use the sport setting in the dry.
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      10-30-2009, 10:55 AM   #99
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Quote:
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The Jalopnik guy was there in an EVO and well off the pace.
Yep, I see that now. But that wasn't his personal car either though, was it? Edit: According to Edmunds anyway, Jaguar pulled the XF-R loaner car from the Jalopnik guy. Either way, it seems in theory that media-types were free to use whatever car they wish, although you have to wonder since two ended up in CTS-Vs. I guess the other manufacturers didn't want to be involved in GM's little stunt, and I can't blame them even though it seems clear now that they'd likely have done pretty well (I am talking Jag, Porsche, Merc).

Thanks for the URL, ruff, there's some good info there.

And my congrats to Michael also (didn't even realize he posted here until after I'd made my first couple posts earlier).

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Originally Posted by Moth View Post
Cooper already hinted that he would have probably easily eclipsed his M3 time in the CTS-V if the car he drove was fitted with a transponder. He hinted this in post #61.
True enough, and I guess that shows just how good he is, but presumably he'd still be slower than Heinricy if he'd also driven the CTS-V, and at the same time Heinricy would probably beat Cooper had they both drove M3's also. So Heinricy's time in an M3 would likely be in the high 2:4x range and that's still a testament to the M3's abilities vs. the CTS-V. Ok, so that's some assumptions there, but you get what I mean.
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      10-30-2009, 10:58 AM   #100
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Michael, is your car a manual or DCT?
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      10-30-2009, 11:02 AM   #101
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is this s cts-v promo stunt?
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      10-30-2009, 11:03 AM   #102
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Michael, is your car a manual or DCT?
Manual
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      10-30-2009, 11:09 AM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Another thing about the final results of the challenge that struck me is that both the press guys ended up in a CTS-V. I guess that's all they had available perhaps, but I find it a bit fishy that the one press guy who was going to drive an XF-R ended up dropping out prior to the challenge. Were they going to force him to drive a CTS-V? I haven't dug around the internet to find out yet, but I am very curious on the details of these finer points.
The press guy was Wes and he didn't drive the XFR because Jag dropped out of the race: "Stuart Schorr, Jaguar's main product PR man, told us flat out he expected the XFR would lose to the CTS-V, so it's not that he's afraid to lose to "Maximum" Bob Lutz." :
http://jalopnik.com/5391222/jaguar-p...nik-vs-gm-race
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      10-30-2009, 11:15 AM   #104
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Michael Cooper amazing job. Congrats man!
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      10-30-2009, 11:16 AM   #105
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Well done Michael!
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      10-30-2009, 11:21 AM   #106
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As long as this thread is digressing into opinions ...

Sport vs. Normal:
Car behaves consistently in Sport whereas you can get some inconsistencies when the car tries to "help" you in normal mode. I might be a tad slower in sport, but I like the way it feels more.

DSC/MDM vs. DSC off:
A fast driver is no slower with DSC, MDM or DSC off. It might be more fun with DSC off, but it is no faster. If you are sliding the car enough for the DSC to be interupting, then you are overdriving your tires. Tires generate maximum traction at well defined slip angles. Those slip angles are within the acceptable region of the DSC mapping.

I have only had to turn DSC off for one track, ever. Turn 14 at Thunderhill has curbing on the inside that you have to hit for a fast exit. I couldn't get through there without DSC cutting in. However, with DSC on I could throttle steer my e46 through turn 2 at Laguna. In MDM mode I can trail brake deeply into the Chicane and throttle steer in 5 at WGI.

With DSC or MDM on, the car will tell me without too much excitement if I'm doing something wrong. So it is also a tool for telling me if I'm too abrupt entering a corner or getting on the gas on exit. And yet, it still allows enough oversteer or understeer for midcorner corrections. I just don't understand the DSC is bad mentality.
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      10-30-2009, 11:25 AM   #107
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Quote:
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DSC/MDM vs. DSC off:
A fast driver is no slower with DSC, MDM or DSC off. It might be more fun with DSC off, but it is no faster. If you are sliding the car enough for the DSC to be interupting, then you are overdriving your tires. Tires generate maximum traction at well defined slip angles. Those slip angles are within the acceptable region of the DSC mapping.
Man I posted this exact same statement once and I got ripped for it. Glad to know I'm not the only one who believes this.
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      10-30-2009, 11:33 AM   #108
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Congrats! I was keeping track of this Jalopnik! Well Done!
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      10-30-2009, 11:34 AM   #109
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Good publicity for GM, although I'm sure they were hoping for a much wider margin : )

Nice driving Michael!

Competition like this benefits every enthusiast!
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      10-30-2009, 11:39 AM   #110
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Seriously, good job! Modesty aside, thanks for shutting them up.
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