BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Track / Autocross / Dragstrip / Driving Techniques
 
House Motorsports
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-09-2014, 12:55 PM   #1
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

VIR Lap times

Hey everyone,
I am considering purchasing a loaded E92 M3. It has almost every option including the competition package. I track my cars a few times a year. I am trying to find what a stock M3 will do on the VIR full course. I currently run an s2000 in intermediate level. I am getting tired of being passed in that vehicle and have somewhat outgrown it. I have searched and can't seem to get a good idea of what a stock M3 will do. In my s2000 I am running about 2:18-2:20 with occasional 2:16 mixed in. The S2000 is modified to run those times. My hope is that I will be faster in the stock M3 than in the modified S2000. If that is not the case then I am not sure I want to spend the 50K to upgrade.
Thanks in advance!!
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2014, 04:44 PM   #2
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

come on guys. this is an easy one to answer
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2014, 05:17 PM   #3
dcgolfdr
Wheelsucker
dcgolfdr's Avatar
United_States
20
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: M3 and a truck
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Arlington, VA

iTrader: (11)

All comes down to driver, I have run anywhere from 2:13-2:18 on the new surface but that was with 888's, stock power, 6MT and track pads and fluid.
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2014, 05:42 PM   #4
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

Yeah I know it's driver dependent. Just looking for a range on street tires.
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2014, 10:11 PM   #5
Sleeper519
Captain
Sleeper519's Avatar
United_States
21
Rep
773
Posts

Drives: 08 E92 M3 DCT
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA

iTrader: (0)

You should get the M3 because it is an awesome car and superior to the Honda in every way, NOT because its a few seconds faster around a track. Why not just put a blower on the s2k and save your 50k. just sayin.
__________________

2008 M3 Coupe / DCT // StopTech BBK 380/355 / Pagid RS29 / Motul / Apex Arc-8 / BFG R1S / Ground Control / MS filter / Performance spoiler / BPM tune // Road Atlanta 1:39.80 / VIR Full 2:10.87 / Barber 1:42.20
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 10:51 AM   #6
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

Don't get me wrong. I loved the M3 that I test drove. Its just hard to take it to the track and be slower than in the Honda. It will feel like a waste of money. There is no doubt that the car overall is better than the Honda. I have thought about a supercharger for the Honda but I don't want to mess with the reliability. My other concern is the falling value of the E92 with the f8x now being out there.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 11:48 AM   #7
dcgolfdr
Wheelsucker
dcgolfdr's Avatar
United_States
20
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: M3 and a truck
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Arlington, VA

iTrader: (11)

If all that you are chasing is a lap time then I wouldn't bother with the e9x M3. Brakes, tires, gas, wear and tear are probably higher than the Honda and you may not be any faster. If you want a fast track car then you need to buy a fast track car, not an all around good car that can also go to the track. I would sell the Honda and get an e46 M3 track car.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 12:01 PM   #8
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

im not really chasing lap times. the purpose of the M3 would be that I can drive it on the street and take it to the track plus it will be an upgrade lap time wise from the Honda. I know the consumables will be more cost. The Honda is at the point where it is too uncomfortable to drive to work or around town. Also, I was hoping that a street e92 would be better to the point that I don't have to run race tires and upgrade the suspension, sway bars etc as I have done on the Honda.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 12:44 PM   #9
Richbot
Colonel
38
Rep
2,192
Posts

Drives: Jerez Black E90
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: STL

iTrader: (2)

There's a dozen or so VIR laptimes posted in the laptimes thread, with mods to the car etc. Leh Keen ran a 2:08 before the repave in his E92 on PS2's with coilovers and a Stoptech brake kit. You probably can't do that, but Leh is a semi-pro driver. Anyway if you're worried about the capabilities of the car, the M3 is undoubtedly more capable at big tracks like VIR with three very fast sections and straightaways.
__________________

Last edited by Richbot; 12-10-2014 at 12:54 PM.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 12:47 PM   #10
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

Yes! I saw the ones for modified cars. I was looking for stock lap times on street tires.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 01:00 PM   #11
Richbot
Colonel
38
Rep
2,192
Posts

Drives: Jerez Black E90
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: STL

iTrader: (2)

Sounds like you need to take a lap yourself and find out! Nobody can tell you what you will run in the car until you run it and that seems like the level of certainty you're looking for. KW's aren't worth seconds per lap, maybe a second *maybe* two at a big track, a BBK adds very little to the outright speed capability over one lap of a car, just consistency, and Leh ran his 2:08 on PS2's, which aren't even a good street tire by current standards.

Or, put it this way, an E92 M3 was about 9 seconds a lap faster than the S2000 CR around Grand in C/D's lightning lap. Do you think your mods to your S2000 are worth 6 seconds a lap (Grand is a 3-minute lap, Full is a 2-minute lap, so 2/3 the difference?)
__________________
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 01:17 PM   #12
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

I ran 2:27 pre modifications to the s2k. I now run 2:18 consistently. Part of that I am sure is modification and part is the fact that I have become a better driver. The reason I am looking at lap times is because I wanted to get into a street car that will allow me to somewhat keep up in DE. Getting passed all the time gets tiring and the S is getting on in years and will likely become unreliable as I continue to track it.
I understand that its driver dependent. I was just trying to get an idea from people that are familiar with the car. Not trying to start an debate on which car is better. Just didn't want to get to the track in Feb and run 2:25's and be really upset.
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 02:39 PM   #13
lutfy
Second Lieutenant
lutfy's Avatar
13
Rep
285
Posts

Drives: 2009 E90 M3 DCT, 2005 997 C2S
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Washington DC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by e92noob View Post
Yes! I saw the ones for modified cars. I was looking for stock lap times on street tires.
My guesstimate would be 2:12s this is based on evidence that when my M3 was stock (street rubber and just pagid yellows), it ran almost identical laptimes as the 911C2S (1st gen). 911 does that with Pilot Sport 2 and Pagid yellows on repaved VIR and I would assume the same for the stock M3.

Very capable car, you will have to get used to the heavier weight. Like others have said, its a great all around capable car which you can track and still be plenty fast.

Lutfy
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 03:35 PM   #14
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

thanks Lufty. that's the best answer I got so far
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2014, 04:23 PM   #15
LiM3y
Major
LiM3y's Avatar
United Kingdom
20
Rep
1,259
Posts

Drives: 2008 E90 M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CT

iTrader: (3)

"I must go flat out"
__________________
Appreciate 0
      12-13-2014, 10:02 AM   #16
M3SQRD
Colonel
M3SQRD's Avatar
United_States
26
Rep
2,492
Posts

Drives: E92 M3s,R56 CooperS,F22 228iX
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: EC

iTrader: (2)

A stock e9x M3 with an experienced driver will run sub 2:18 lap times on the full course at VIR. Mod'ed e9x M3s are closer to 2:10 (+/- 2-3 sec depending on driver and mods).
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2014, 07:36 PM   #17
SpiralOut
Captain
SpiralOut's Avatar
United_States
13
Rep
789
Posts

Drives: 2013 M3
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NC

iTrader: (9)

Lufty is about right with the 2:12 estimate. I think i was around 2:10 with hfc's, ess tune, nitto nt01 square, stoptech with pagids, swift spec-r springs and dinan camber plates with stock EDC.

Last time up i ran 2:07.6 with above mods, but was fully catless and was on bfg r1's (and weather was perfect). I could maybe get into 2:06's according to harry's lap timer but that would prob be about the lowest i could go without more power or coilovers.

E92 is a pretty capable track car, but is heavy. You really have to manage the weight transfer and keep the momentum up.
Appreciate 0
      12-17-2014, 10:03 AM   #18
e92noob
New Member
0
Rep
9
Posts

Drives: e92m3
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: NC

iTrader: (0)

well at least I know how to drive a momentum car so keeping momentum should not be too difficult.
Appreciate 0
      12-17-2014, 05:24 PM   #19
lutfy
Second Lieutenant
lutfy's Avatar
13
Rep
285
Posts

Drives: 2009 E90 M3 DCT, 2005 997 C2S
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Washington DC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiralOut View Post
Lufty is about right with the 2:12 estimate. I think i was around 2:10 with hfc's, ess tune, nitto nt01 square, stoptech with pagids, swift spec-r springs and dinan camber plates with stock EDC.

Last time up i ran 2:07.6 with above mods, but was fully catless and was on bfg r1's (and weather was perfect). I could maybe get into 2:06's according to harry's lap timer but that would prob be about the lowest i could go without more power or coilovers.

E92 is a pretty capable track car, but is heavy. You really have to manage the weight transfer and keep the momentum up.
You and sleeper519 seriously shatter my ego

2:10 is spot on with the mods. I ran a flat 2:10:00 flat with RA1 square, Bilstein EDC, Eibach springs, Pagid yellows (stock caliper with PFC 2 piece rotors), GC camber and HR front bar. Stock motor no tune except for 240E flash.

But 207s with stock EDC shocks Jesus!! I'll blame the perfect weather Brilliant time mate!

Lutfy
Appreciate 0
      01-04-2015, 07:46 PM   #20
turbo8765
Captain
8
Rep
610
Posts

Drives: very fast
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: US

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richbot View Post
Sounds like you need to take a lap yourself and find out! Nobody can tell you what you will run in the car until you run it and that seems like the level of certainty you're looking for. KW's aren't worth seconds per lap, maybe a second *maybe* two at a big track, a BBK adds very little to the outright speed capability over one lap of a car, just consistency, and Leh ran his 2:08 on PS2's, which aren't even a good street tire by current standards.

Or, put it this way, an E92 M3 was about 9 seconds a lap faster than the S2000 CR around Grand in C/D's lightning lap. Do you think your mods to your S2000 are worth 6 seconds a lap (Grand is a 3-minute lap, Full is a 2-minute lap, so 2/3 the difference?)
IIRC Leh was on sport cups cups when he ran an :08 at VIR full.

KW's likely are worth seconds per lap on an e9x M3. Look at Leh's times at RRR on stock suspension vs aftermarket. E92's seem to respond well to a bit more roll resistance.

OP.... my supercharged s2000 runs a :08 at VIR full on 255 square NT01's. I'm roughly even on the back straight with a bolt on e92 DCT m3. As noted, no one can tell you what you'll be able to do with an e9x M3 but my guess is you'll be several seconds faster AT VIR than your s2000.
Appreciate 0
      02-27-2015, 05:36 PM   #21
snowmants
Captain
snowmants's Avatar
United_States
20
Rep
633
Posts

Drives: '06S2K,'11EVO,'11Jeep,'13GL450
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Charlottesville, VA

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2008 BMW E90 M3  [5.00]
In my stock 2008 e90 m3 (DCT) I hit 145mph on the back straight at VIR. I was entering the uphill esses at about 112. I have no idea on lap times, but I will say this, the m3 is much heavier than the s2000 and you can really feel it on the track. You don't notice it so much on the street but when you get on the track in low speed turns such as left hook or turn 1 you really feel its heft. My stock m3 weighed at least 3600 lbs. My s2000 track car weighs just over 2400 lbs(seats harnesses, roll-bar, weight reduction, carbon hardtop, big brakes, CR springs, upgraded swaybars, exhaust, intake, stock tune, Hankook RS3 ~200 treadwear). The m3 runs faster lap times, but the s2000 is a lot more fun to drive on the track. This is an important distinction. I don't worry much about the Viper ACR or c6 z06 that passes me on the straight...
__________________
'08 Alpine White E90 M3 DCT

"In the NASA 2012 rules just released, double clutch transmissions are officially +6 points."
Appreciate 0
      Yesterday, 03:12 PM   #22
WarrantyTracker
Track? What Track? I was just riding along . . .
United_States
10
Rep
585
Posts

Drives: Alpine White E92 M3
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: An Undisclosed Location

iTrader: (0)

This.

The track experience driving my e92 M3 is totally, totally different from my 2400# 323i. The additional power doesn't just "make up" for the immediacy of the light car.

Then again, the experience making the 6-hour drive to VIR in my e92 M3 is totally, totally different from my 2400# 323i.

I expect you will need to re-learn the track after the switch, and that you will give up and put front camber plates on it pretty soon, because you will miss the turn-in you have in your Honda.

I'm a terrible "big track" track driver (really) and I can do 2:30s at VIR on 18in 265 square set budget street tires (like Sumitomo HTZ) and StopTech street performance brake pads, without much trouble. I break into the 2:15s from time to time but that often eludes me on street tires.

If you're looking for a new ride, the e92 is a great car to own, no doubt about it. I'm sure you would enjoy it, off track and on.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:41 PM.




m3post
m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST