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      10-05-2009, 08:10 PM   #1
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e92 m3 vs b9 s4

[u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/6ge84DQzqD8&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&featur e=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/6ge84DQzqD8&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&featur e=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b]

the s4 looks promisingound

this is mtm's s4 with ecu upgrade. around 400awhp i think
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      10-05-2009, 09:18 PM   #2
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In all honesty anytime you compare a stock car to a modified car its a ridiculous argument. I'm sure no one isn't surprised basic mods to a FI car equal big gains. With that being said the B9 S4 will certainly appeal to many tuners like the B5 S4 so expect many mods available for this car in the future.
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      10-05-2009, 09:24 PM   #3
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Wow, nearing the end the M pulled even and passed it nicely. It didn't look like the Audi let off.
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      10-05-2009, 09:29 PM   #4
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The two things I like best about this vid are.

A. They raced a DCT S4 vs a Manual giving an already modified car even further advantage.

B. The S4 even though is rated at a higher output hp/torque still got pulled in the end by an M3 driver that sucks at shifting.
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      10-05-2009, 09:47 PM   #5
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Dramatic finish by the M3!
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      10-05-2009, 09:53 PM   #6
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The way the M pulled at the end was soo sick!


-Vin
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      10-05-2009, 09:55 PM   #7
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I'm so tired of these Mboard vids, I didn't bother watching it because I'm sure the M3 lost again as always. I can't wait for the M3 superchargers to put an end to these videos. 600whp FTW
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      10-05-2009, 10:33 PM   #8
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another mod vs stock car vid....

oh boy.....I'm gonna go make some popcorn.
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      10-05-2009, 10:34 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 96OCTNE View Post
I'm so tired of these Mboard vids, I didn't bother watching it because I'm sure the M3 lost again as always. I can't wait for the M3 superchargers to put an end to these videos. 600whp FTW
nah bro...the M pulls like a mother at the end and passes it quite comfortably!
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      10-05-2009, 11:30 PM   #10
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people that cant shift for shit need to stop making videos...and what is the point of this thread?...like everyone already stated stock vs modifed....loved the end though
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      10-05-2009, 11:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
The two things I like best about this vid are.

A. They raced a DCT S4 vs a Manual giving an already modified car even further advantage.

B. The S4 even though is rated at a higher output hp/torque still got pulled in the end by an M3 driver that sucks at shifting.
I agree comparing a modified car to a stock car is pointless but i'm sure this video was just meant to show the S4's tuning capabilities, similar to the N54 IMO. M3 could also use a driver mod.

The S4 according to MTM is producing 430hp (crank) and when you subtract the 15%-20% lets say 18% drivetrain loss it equates to 350ish awp which is similar to what stock M3's put down on the dyno IIRC.

The outcome is totally expected seeing the M cars usually have very strong top end. On the other hand, I think it's safe to say that the MTM S4 would beat a stock M3 in the 1/4. Obviously a tuned S4 shouldn't be compared to the M3 on the track but it will definitely give the M3 a run for it's money in the straights just like a tuned 335i.
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      10-06-2009, 12:14 AM   #12
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I don't really like using GTBoard video as proof that what I have said in other post about the S4 with a chip and exhaust would be a match for than M3 and it appears that my gut feeling was indeed correct. Also given the additional technology that the S4 has over the 335i and knowing how well it handling the MTM S4 is probably the best sleeper ever if you don't want the visual attention an RS4 or M3 gives.

Plus it's cheaper than both of them.
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      10-06-2009, 12:26 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
I don't really like using GTBoard video as proof that what I have said in other post about the S4 with a chip and exhaust would be a match for than M3 and it appears that my gut feeling was indeed correct. Also given the additional technology that the S4 has over the 335i and knowing how well it handling the MTM S4 is probably the best sleeper ever if you don't want the visual attention an RS4 or M3 gives.

Plus it's cheaper than both of them.
Uh it still lost...Do the same mods to the M3 (which would be cheaper) And the S4 would be put back in its place easily. Just because my supercharged M3 is faster then an F430 doesn't make it better because its cheaper....
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      10-06-2009, 12:32 AM   #14
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not a big deal..but this generation is the B8 ..not B9 yet... i'd like to see how a stock DCT M match up against a chippped car....
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      10-06-2009, 12:48 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnn View Post
not a big deal..but this generation is the B8 ..not B9 yet... i'd like to see how a stock DCT M match up against a chippped car....
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      10-06-2009, 12:50 AM   #16
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Thats just a ECU upgrade? No pulley change?

FWIW, I've driven both and I will take the e90 m3 over it anyday of the week. The S4 has gobs of torque anywhere on the bandwidth and is very uninspiring to drive. The MMI Navi. however, is an absolute gem.
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      10-06-2009, 02:08 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
Uh it still lost...Do the same mods to the M3 (which would be cheaper) And the S4 would be put back in its place easily. Just because my supercharged M3 is faster then an F430 doesn't make it better because its cheaper....
Chase me over as many threads as you want but you as always miss the point of my comments, probably the red mist as your problem.

Sure an M3 can be made much, much quicker. But the fact remains that to do so and expect the same kind of % gains in output will cost considerably more and greatly effect the reliability of the engine. The whole point of the S4 is to be a sleeper, not to shout about it potential, adding the MTM kit only heightens this fact even further. Spending only a couple of grand and you have something that believe it or not corners remarkably well, closer to an M3 than you would believe, is even more comfortable and yet will beat it to 60mph, beat it to 100mph, heck it will beat it to 130mph and only over the 150mph mark will the M3 regain control of the race. That in my opinion is a result for the underdog.

In fact given the choice of either an M3/RS4 and an MTM S4 I would pick the sleeper every time, just think of the shock on the faces of all those M3/RS4 drivers and the smile you would have putting them in their place. Shit man, my cheek bones would be sore from all that smiling.

P.S.
Just imagine if BMW had given the 335i the same sort of hardware that Audi gave the S4, it too would have to kind of handling to back up the acceleration that is so easily unlock.
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      10-06-2009, 02:21 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
Chase me over as many threads as you want but you as always miss the point of my comments, probably the red mist as your problem.

Sure an M3 can be made much, much quicker. But the fact remains that to do so and expect the same kind of % gains in output will cost considerably more and greatly effect the reliability of the engine. The whole point of the S4 is to be a sleeper, not to shout about it potential, adding the MTM kit only heightens this fact even further. Spending only a couple of grand and you have something that believe it or not corners remarkably well, closer to an M3 than you would believe, is even more comfortable and yet will beat it to 60mph, beat it to 100mph, heck it will beat it to 130mph and only over the 150mph mark will the M3 regain control of the race. That in my opinion is a result for the underdog.

In fact given the choice of either an M3/RS4 and an MTM S4 I would pick the sleeper every time, just think of the shock on the faces of all those M3/RS4 drivers and the smile you would have putting them in their place. Shit man, my cheek bones would be sore from all that smiling.

P.S.
Just imagine if BMW had given the 335i the same sort of hardware that Audi gave the S4, it too would have to kind of handling to back up the acceleration that is so easily unlock.
Sorry that your delusional bud. I like how you say its cheaper to mod the S4. doesn't that MTM ECU tune cost like $3,500? I got my tune , rear section and pulley for that much. My car was making around 490-500hp crank and that was more then enough to squash any Audi I've encounted except Monster B5's with more then 450whp/wtq On race fuel and meth injection or upgraded turbos. So sorry if I dont see a threat not even for the 335 much less the M3 no matter what you post.

BTW I'm not chasing you, You're just the only one spreading nonsense as fact all over the board so I have to respond.
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      10-06-2009, 02:48 AM   #19
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I'm sure that APR (US) will bring out something similar at a fraction of the price MTM charge. You have to understand MTM and what they offer is see why they charge so much more.

The fact still remains that if you want a sleeper with the potential to work with the M3 and RS4 on the track and on the road then your best option is something like the MTM or similarly tuned S4.
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      10-06-2009, 04:31 AM   #20
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Footie I can see what you are saying about the S4 and its effectiveness to get it up to power but you can't be serious in comparing even a MTM B9 S4 to a stock M3. There just really is not comparison. The M3 has a hell of a chassis and the S4 can't even compare to the fun factor in a AWD Subi or a Evo ("fun factor" is subjective of course). I do see that the S4 is fast OFTB and like I said before there is torque EVERYWHERE in that car but it just doesn't make up for how much it really can't turn.
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      10-06-2009, 04:33 AM   #21
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Have you guys seen all the 335 vs M3 videos on M5board? In fact that very same M3 got a sever beating by basically all the 335's at that airfield. I think it lost every single race it had by quite a margin. I find that pretty weird. When I had my 335 with all my mods, (3" catless DP's, full exhaust, Spearco cooler, forge DVs, Aquamist meth injection, DCI), I ran a few M3's. It was ugly. I probably gave them like 6-7 length beating to 125mph.

And I vboxed my 335 in all its states of tune & the same test track.

Now I have an M3, with chip & exhaust. On the Vbox is is faster than my 335 ever was on the test track. Especially on the longer distances & on the 60-130mph, etc.

And I have run quite a few modded 335's & walked them. I have lost a race or 2 when the car was still being tuned or was still stock, but the way it is running now it will be hard for a 335 with stock turbos to beat me on a longish distance, even at my elevation.


I found that the M3 needs to revved to the limiter & the gear changes must be sharp enough that the car does not fall out of powerband for the following gear. The driver must ensure that he stays above 6000rpm following every shift or else he will fall into a slight "hole" out of powerband & will labour to get back in the band. That will have a knock on effect through that gear & the following gears making a significant difference to performance. It could end up making a 4-5 car difference on a long run.

That rolling start 2nd gear is smack bang into the Achilles heel of an M3. It will be on the back foot from the get go & lose significant momentum from which it can never recover. The M3 has zero torque rolling in 2nd gear at that rpm.

If that were me, I would have gone into 1st even if I were buzzing the engine. One has to get up into the powerband to extract any kind of performance from an M3.

Rolling in 2nd gear at 50mph with a forced induction car like the S4 is just plain dumb. I'm actually surprised the M3 even caught up at the end with such a sabotaged setup. That just proves that a stock M3 is significantly faster thana modded S4 to make up such a deficit at the start.
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      10-06-2009, 04:49 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M View Post
Have you guys seen all the 335 vs M3 videos on M5board? In fact that very same M3 got a sever beating by basically all the 335's at that airfield. I think it lost every single race it had by quite a margin. I find that pretty weird. When I had my 335 with all my mods, (3" catless DP's, full exhaust, Spearco cooler, forge DVs, Aquamist meth injection, DCI), I ran a few M3's. It was ugly. I probably gave them like 6-7 length beating to 125mph.

And I vboxed my 335 in all its states of tune & the same test track.

Now I have an M3, with chip & exhaust. On the Vbox is is faster than my 335 ever was on the test track. Especially on the longer distances & on the 60-130mph, etc.

And I have run quite a few modded 335's & walked them. I have lost a race or 2 when the car was still being tuned or was still stock, but the way it is running now it will be hard for a 335 with stock turbos to beat me on a longish distance, even at my elevation.


I found that the M3 needs to revved to the limiter & the gear changes must be sharp enough that the car does not fall out of powerband for the following gear. The driver must ensure that he stays above 6000rpm following every shift or else he will fall into a slight "hole" out of powerband & will labour to get back in the band. That will have a knock on effect through that gear & the following gears making a significant difference to performance. It could end up making a 4-5 car difference on a long run.

That rolling start 2nd gear is smack bang into the Achilles heel of an M3. It will be on the back foot from the get go & lose significant momentum from which it can never recover. The M3 has zero torque rolling in 2nd gear at that rpm.

If that were me, I would have gone into 1st even if I were buzzing the engine. One has to get up into the powerband to extract any kind of performance from an M3.

Rolling in 2nd gear at 50mph with a forced induction car like the S4 is just plain dumb. I'm actually surprised the M3 even caught up at the end with such a sabotaged setup. That just proves that a stock M3 is significantly faster thana modded S4 to make up such a deficit at the start.
I know exactly what you mean. I see alot of M3 drivers dont know how to drive their cars and therfore run people and either lose or come close to losing to cars that they shouldnt lose too and when I run the same cars they all think I jump the gun the thing is you have to be in the right gear especially for roll ons. I know people that start in 3rd when they should be in 2nd with the revs up there waiting to be launched forward. Once you know how to drive it the M3 is surprising.
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