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      06-11-2009, 10:24 AM   #1
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Macht Schnell Filter adds almost 6hp, dyno

While at the dyno yesterday I installed Macht Schnell's Performance Air Filter in my E92 M3. We ran four pulls before adding the filter, until the power peaked out. (It usually takes about 3-runs with the car at normal operating temperature when we start the pulls). Peak hp without the Schnell was 333.43 and it jumped to 339.05 when we dropped in the Schnell. That's 5.9 hp. I couldn't find a difference higher, but they ran from like 5.44 to the 5.94 difference. There's a small difference at low rpm and you can see that the gains really come in at high rpm. Torque increase is nominal.

My car has Dinan throttle bodies and a Dinan ECU flash, which is included in both runs shown here, using 91 octane, corrected from about 5400 ft altitude.

FYI, I'm going back today to see what a roughly 70/30 blend of 91/100 octane (about 93.5-equivalent octane) does for the M3. I know that 105=octane loses at this altitude and 100 only gains about 3 hp. I'm hoping to find a target mix that will gain me somewhere between 10 and 20 hp. (You guys at sea level report 30 or so hp with 100-octane).

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 12:19 PM   #2
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BTW, I purchased online through European Auto Source in a flawless transaction. There were alternatives, but EAS didn't try to rip me a new one with outrageous shipping and handling charges. At $99, plus S&H, it wasn't "cheap", but with 6hp gained it's a good "value."

BTW2, at WOT, above 4000 rpm, I hear a little more induction noise. Nothing to worry about, I'm just reporting a fact that I forgot to mention.

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 12:25 PM   #3
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Glad you are happy with the newfound power.

Thanks for taking the time to post your results for others to see.
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      06-11-2009, 01:45 PM   #4
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Thanks for the info!
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      06-11-2009, 02:16 PM   #5
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I also have dyno proof of the MS filter making 5+ hp on my car. I just havent posted the results yet. We also swapped it out on the dyno and did runs till it didnt make more power. Definitely a worthwhile mod.
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      06-11-2009, 02:22 PM   #6
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Thats a great power gain from just an air filter! Looks like I'll be adding one of these.


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      06-11-2009, 02:25 PM   #7
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Thanks for the post Dave!

I'm interested in getting the Dinan Software and the MS filter. I wonder if my numbers would be better since i am at sea level living in SD?
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      06-11-2009, 02:53 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by rbk1115 View Post
Thanks for the post Dave!

I'm interested in getting the Dinan Software and the MS filter. I wonder if my numbers would be better since i am at sea level living in SD?
You and the others are welcome. It was my pleasure.

The Dinan chip will probably give you no more power than the MS, so I'd start with the MS for much less. It's logical that you might gain a little more, but Tut is in FL and only reports about 5 hp also from the MS. I think you can be sure about 5 hp, with is pretty cheap at $99.

As for the Dinan, they only claim about 6 hp and I think I'm getting way less. I would only recommend it for the increased rpm and removal of the speed governor. Since I autocross and have a 4.10 final drive, that was worthwhile for me. I think there are other chips that can give you returns in the mid-teens (claimed 30 hp, but I don't believe it). You may have a slight worry about your warranty, which is not an issue.

Don't forget, at sea level, 100-octane gasoline is good for around 30-hp. At between seven and eight dollars per gallon, that's real cheap hp. At altitude the octane works against me, but at sea level, a filter and a tank of gas gives you almost 10% rear wheel hp increase. Add a final drive on top of that and your adding hp and torque significantly.

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 03:43 PM   #9
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hmmm good to know. I installed a MS filter too, but I couldn't tell my car was anymore powerful. Good to know I gained a few HP. The sound is noticeable though
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      06-11-2009, 03:58 PM   #10
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hmmm good to know. I installed a MS filter too, but I couldn't tell my car was anymore powerful. Good to know I gained a few HP. The sound is noticeable though
Yeah, 5 or 6 hp won't even gain you a tenth in 0-60, so feeling it with the butt is going to be hard. However, I DO think this is one of those kinds of changes that will be cummulative, adding on top of other mods that you may do. So, do this and add 100-octane gas and you may be sitting at a solid 10% gain, which you will feel and will shorten your times.

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 04:20 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by dcstep View Post
You and the others are welcome. It was my pleasure.

The Dinan chip will probably give you no more power than the MS, so I'd start with the MS for much less. It's logical that you might gain a little more, but Tut is in FL and only reports about 5 hp also from the MS. I think you can be sure about 5 hp, with is pretty cheap at $99.

As for the Dinan, they only claim about 6 hp and I think I'm getting way less. I would only recommend it for the increased rpm and removal of the speed governor. Since I autocross and have a 4.10 final drive, that was worthwhile for me. I think there are other chips that can give you returns in the mid-teens (claimed 30 hp, but I don't believe it). You may have a slight worry about your warranty, which is not an issue.

Don't forget, at sea level, 100-octane gasoline is good for around 30-hp. At between seven and eight dollars per gallon, that's real cheap hp. At altitude the octane works against me, but at sea level, a filter and a tank of gas gives you almost 10% rear wheel hp increase. Add a final drive on top of that and your adding hp and torque significantly.

Dave
Thanks again for even more information.

If there are other vendors out there that have better gains, why did you decide to stick with Dinan since the gains seem to be minimal? You might be able to extract more power from other software combined with your 4.10 final drive. Was warranty a concern of yours? I am concerned about warranty and want to keep mine in place as long as possible that is why the Dinan route seems the best for those of us who want some kind of warranty with mods to our cars. I had a lot of Dinan products on my old M3 and was quite happy with them. Just getting the MS filter from EAS sounds tempting right now...

Did you notice any adverse affects to your gas mileage with the 4.10 final drive? I don't autocross so would the Dinan 4.10 final drive be fine for a street driven car? Thanks.
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      06-11-2009, 04:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbk1115 View Post
Thanks again for even more information.

If there are other vendors out there that have better gains, why did you decide to stick with Dinan since the gains seem to be minimal? You might be able to extract more power from other software combined with your 4.10 final drive. Was warranty a concern of yours? I am concerned about warranty and want to keep mine in place as long as possible that is why the Dinan route seems the best for those of us who want some kind of warranty with mods to our cars. I had a lot of Dinan products on my old M3 and was quite happy with them. Just getting the MS filter from EAS sounds tempting right now...

Did you notice any adverse affects to your gas mileage with the 4.10 final drive? I don't autocross so would the Dinan 4.10 final drive be fine for a street driven car? Thanks.
Of course, when you change the FD by over 6% you'll experience a comparable change in gas mileage, which partially might explain why BMW selected 3.85 in the first place. It's a mechanical change, so the engine rotates more per mile. There is a slight noise penalty, particularly on the overrun, but it's small enough that my wife doesn't notice it. First gear is so short on the M3 that I wouldn't do the 4.10 unless I was going to autocross or had another performance need. You DO feel it in all gears, so you gain acceleration in every gear and that's real. It's like taking the rear wheel torque from 245 to over 260 ft lbs.

Regarding the Dinan chip, my selection was part warranty and part because it upped the redline and removed the governor. So of the flashes don't do that and I consider essential for my AX because I'm often up against the limiter for a second or so. I may never use the max speed, but if I get a chance...

Also, with every product I'm really worried about what I'll get at 5400 ft above sea level. All these ECU tunes are put together at sea level in places like FL, CA, NJ, etc.. If they're too aggressive will they be too lean for me at my altitude, or just not make the advertise hp? With Dinan I don't have to worry about my warranty. Still, if a dyno-tuner in my area got ahold of software to dyno-tune my M3, I'd be on it in a flash. With my throttle bodies and exhaust I think I've got maybe 30 hp of potential bottled up by my ECU.

Start with the MS. It's pretty painless and you can be assured that there's a gain, commensurate with investment. Then...

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 08:50 PM   #13
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Quote:
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BTW, I purchased online through European Auto Source in a flawless transaction. There were alternatives, but EAS didn't try to rip me a new one with outrageous shipping and handling charges. At $99, plus S&H, it wasn't "cheap", but with 6hp gained it's a good "value."

BTW2, at WOT, above 4000 rpm, I hear a little more induction noise. Nothing to worry about, I'm just reporting a fact that I forgot to mention.

Dave
I don't know if it matters to anyone, but I found that Renn-Spec is charging the same $99 but with FREE SHIPPING. That's where I plan to order when I'm finally ready. Here's the link: http://www.renn-spec.com/product_p/ms-s65b40.htm
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      06-11-2009, 10:36 PM   #14
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dcstep aka Dave,

Thanks for the information man. I am going to stew over the MS filter purchase over the weekend and possibly pull the trigger on the purchase early next week.
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      06-11-2009, 10:53 PM   #15
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dcstep aka Dave,

Thanks for the information man. I am going to stew over the MS filter purchase over the weekend and possibly pull the trigger on the purchase early next week.
You're welcome rbk. With this much evidence supporting positive results and the low cost, you'll never pull the trigger on a performance mod if you don't do this one.

Of course, that might be a good answer. Once you get hooked, then...

Dave
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      06-11-2009, 10:55 PM   #16
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You're welcome rbk. With this much evidence supporting positive results and the low cost, you'll never pull the trigger on a performance mod if you don't do this one.

Of course, that might be a good answer. Once you get hooked, then...

Dave
dcstep,

I seriously thought I would stop modding after the E36... HAHAHA!!!

Is the MS filter a dry or wet one? I could not find the answer on the EAS site, unless I missed it somewhere. Thanks.
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      06-11-2009, 11:01 PM   #17
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It is an oiled filter just like a K&N.
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      06-11-2009, 11:01 PM   #18
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dcstep,

I seriously thought I would stop modding after the E36... HAHAHA!!!

Is the MS filter a dry or wet one? I could not find the answer on the EAS site, unless I missed it somewhere. Thanks.
Welcome back in the pool, the more the merrier.

It's a dry filter.

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      06-11-2009, 11:04 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Welcome back in the pool, the more the merrier.

It's a dry filter.

Dave
wat? It is a washable reuseable cotton gauze. I wouldn't call it a dry filter.
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      06-11-2009, 11:11 PM   #20
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wat? It is a washable reuseable cotton gauze. I wouldn't call it a dry filter.
Does the MS filter need to be cleaned/oiled like the K&N ones then?
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      06-11-2009, 11:12 PM   #21
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wat? It is a washable reuseable cotton gauze. I wouldn't call it a dry filter.

Washable doesn't mean oiled. I looked dry to me. If it's oiled, Schnell did a great job of keeping that secret. There's no mention in packaging.

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      06-11-2009, 11:17 PM   #22
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It is an oiled filter just like a K&N.
Where do you get that? It just wasn't apparent on inspection. I've used K&N in for decades in the past and those were clearly oiled.

Just curious. Obviously, if it was oiled, I would expect some mention of care in the packaging. Mine arrived simply wrapped in cellophane.

How do you plan to wash it? Is there a kit that we can buy for that, like with K&N?

Dave
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