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      06-17-2009, 04:02 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by M3 Montreal View Post
Im talking about the difference in price. Of course I would pick the P-car as well but if money is no option then I wouldnt even pick the P-car...well I would the GT !

Yea true, in Mexico a 997tt with tip trans is US$170,500; GT2 a whopping US$247,500!! Uber expensive vehicles.
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      06-18-2009, 11:44 AM   #24
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Well there is a vid floating around with a Bolt on M3 running a 911 s, and the 911 walked him similar to how you walked the one you ran, so that works against your claims. If and only if the performance of the M3 you ran is similar to the one that ran against the 911.

But on that note if you were able to pull on a Ford GT by 1-2 car lengths, then you my friend, have one fast car, a stock ZO6 will not pull on a GT, and a GTR will get dusted by one on a roll.
Well, it seems to me that all this is plausible provided that the GPower SKII M3 pushes 580hp/420tq. The GP M3 would have the best power to weight ratio, albeit not toque, of all of these even after considering the extra weight of the SC kit. This may be where the high speed high reving engine makes some difference as absolutely none of the others can hang in there for so long.

____________________________________________Power to Weight Ratios_______
Car:............... Power hp/torque......Vehicle Weight......Weight/hp.........Weight/Torque
GPower M3:.....580bhp/420tq e.......3,760lb e.............6.5 lb/hp e...........9.0 lb/tq e
Ford GT:..........500bhp/500tq..........3,350lb...............6.7 lb/hp..............6.7 lb/tq
Z06:...............505bhp/470tq..........3,132lb...............6.2 lb/hp..............6.7 lb/tq
P 997tt:..........480bhp/460tq...........3,495lb...............7.6 lb/hp.............7.6 lb/tq

e = estimated
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      06-18-2009, 11:54 AM   #25
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i love m's..

however...

a nice m3 is 65k
add s/c 20k
brakes 7k
lip, trunk , diffusor- 4000
wheels- 5000-6000
suspension- 3000
exhaust-2500

thats a 107,500 dollars....

i would go buy a used turbo for an 08 model for 95k, put a chip and call it a day......and save the money for other shit...

or go buy a gt3 and save the money...

A buddy at work has a 08 997 turbo with a giac tune(I THINK) with his cats removed, and exhaust with piping, and ill guarantee itll rip these s/c m3's apart...

The thing pulls like a fucking jet itll snap your head off...

i believe its got 640hp and 600+ torque..
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      06-18-2009, 12:08 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Boosted335 View Post
i love m's..

however...

a nice m3 is 65k
add s/c 20k
brakes 7k
lip, trunk , diffusor- 4000
wheels- 5000-6000
suspension- 3000
exhaust-2500

thats a 107,500 dollars....

i would go buy a used turbo for an 08 model for 95k, put a chip and call it a day......and save the money for other shit...

or go buy a gt3 and save the money...

A buddy at work has a 08 997 turbo with a giac tune(I THINK) with his cats removed, and exhaust with piping, and ill guarantee itll rip these s/c m3's apart...

The thing pulls like a fucking jet itll snap your head off...

i believe its got 640hp and 600+ torque..
Don´t think it would rip these S/C Ms apart, but it is fair if you think it is so. Some of us don´t want a used car and some others maybe done´t want the attention of a P and yes others may think an M3 with clean mods looks better than the used P (or new) plus more flexible. I´d say to each his own. Anyway, that used P with those mods you mention would also cost you an arm and a leg. I also bet he changed wheels. lol!! Anyway, I challenge your friends P to Willow springs vs. my Stroker M3. I shit you not, my M is there and any one that wishes to challenge it is welcome. Might be a fun day!
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      06-18-2009, 12:55 PM   #27
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I'm not sure I seen any posts that answered this question so let me ask. But what is the reliability of an S/C G Power car. How much research and development has been done that shows a M3 once this conversion is made can be just as reliable as the car when it was N/A. What about those who have M-DCT? Obviously anyone who goes ahead with this modification as arguably forfeited the warranty on the whole drive train. This is just my assumption but I doubt the folks over at G Power put nearly as much research into the whole drive train after this modification as the ///M engineers did with the S65B40.
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      06-18-2009, 02:15 PM   #28
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I'm not sure I seen any posts that answered this question so let me ask. But what is the reliability of an S/C G Power car. How much research and development has been done that shows a M3 once this conversion is made can be just as reliable as the car when it was N/A. What about those who have M-DCT? Obviously anyone who goes ahead with this modification as arguably forfeited the warranty on the whole drive train. This is just my assumption but I doubt the folks over at G Power put nearly as much research into the whole drive train after this modification as the ///M engineers did with the S65B40.
This certainly is a good question. I think GPower has done sufficient research as per their reputation. However, it still perplexes me that they do not offer a warranty on the engine etc... So it is really at your risk. Increasing boost beyond 6 PSI in a 12:1 NA compression engine is intuitively beyond what the engine is designed for, no matter what anyone says. Those that do, I am fairly certain will blow engines every once in a while. In fact, I´ve heard someone already did blow one, although this is entirely based upon hear say and would take it only as that. Also, it would be greatly desirable to us higher octane fuel that 91 even for 6 PSI IMO and certainly anything above that. Just my 5%.
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      06-18-2009, 02:46 PM   #29
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you cannot buy a M3 for a commuter. it is only to be used on the tract. It drives horrible on the freeway, and is very uncomfortable for any longer then 20 minutes.
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      06-18-2009, 02:57 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by spearfisher View Post
Well there is a vid floating around with a Bolt on M3 running a 911 s, and the 911 walked him similar to how you walked the one you ran, so that works against your claims. If and only if the performance of the M3 you ran is similar to the one that ran against the 911.



But on that note if you were able to pull on a Ford GT by 1-2 car lengths, then you my friend, have one fast car, a stock ZO6 will not pull on a GT, and a GTR will get dusted by one on a roll.

That may have been true but You have to remember the weight difference and I dunno what else I think I've seen the vid you're talking about I don't remember it being that great of a pull for the Porsche. Either way This vid was also cut short at the end of the run the people watching at the end said I was at least 10CL ahead so what that said I wouldn't be worried about the 997 PDK.

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Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG View Post
I'm not sure I seen any posts that answered this question so let me ask. But what is the reliability of an S/C G Power car. How much research and development has been done that shows a M3 once this conversion is made can be just as reliable as the car when it was N/A. What about those who have M-DCT? Obviously anyone who goes ahead with this modification as arguably forfeited the warranty on the whole drive train. This is just my assumption but I doubt the folks over at G Power put nearly as much research into the whole drive train after this modification as the ///M engineers did with the S65B40.
I'd say the G-power kit is very reliable if installed properly. I think that's why G-power is being conservative with the boost as opposed to others. in Germany they even offer a 3-year Powertrain warranty with the kit like Dinan does. I'm not sure exactly why its not offered here in the US but I think it has to do with them not personally having control of the installation like they do in Germany where people send their M's to G-power Headquarters to have the install done. G-power has been tuning BMW's for 25 years and have a few world records/first so I'm sure they're putting alot of constant development in the kit to make it better and better.
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      06-18-2009, 03:14 PM   #31
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G-power has been tuning BMW's for 25 years
Not necessarily true; G-Power itself is only a few years old, I believe it was established in 2003 or 2004. It was formed as a separate entity from three other companies, the oldest of which was 20-something years old.
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      06-18-2009, 03:39 PM   #32
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Not necessarily true; G-Power itself is only a few years old, I believe it was established in 2003 or 2004. It was formed as a separate entity from three other companies, the oldest of which was 20-something years old.
Almost correct.

here is a sample of their achievments starting from G-power was formed in 1983.The eighties…………, from this time one strike was following another

- In 1979 we already started a career as equipper of racing cars in the aero- and engine parts area.

- In 1980 then the first plastic parts for the legendary BMW 02. And a light-construction version of the G1.
- In 1983 start of own label G-POWER – and as a matter of fact – abandonment of the ALPINA representation. We very much like to think back to this partnership!

…………. and what did we do as G-POWER?

- In 1983, in the year of our foundation the 3series Sports Wagon with M3 4cyl. engine conversion 230 hp

- In 1984, cooperation partner KONI for the suspension development 02- and 03 types
- In 1985, G-POWER invents the DTM exhaust, the v-formation suspension
- In 1986, participation at a British exhaust manufacturer, start of production of own sport silencers.
- In 1987, development and production of headers for 6-cyl. engines

- In 1988, extension of distribution to USA, Australia

The nineties .......

- In 1994, first compressor kit for BMW M3 3.0l with an output of 400 hp
- In 1995, compressor development to M50 6cyl. engine with 270hp
- In 1995 , 3series E30 with engine conversion to M3 3.0l, technology and compressor system to 415hp
- In 1998, 3series Convertible with 4.4l engine conversion and 315 hp output
- In 1998, large project M5 wide version - special production for a Russian customer
- In 1999, displacement engines V8 5.0l with 350 and 400 hp

- In 2000, exhaust- and header production "made in Germany"
- In 2000, worldwide complete car distribution of G-POWER G3 5.0SV8 Coupé
- In 2000, own racing team on G-POWER M3 in long distance cup and 24h Nürburgring

- In 2001, Tuner-Grandprix Hockenheim – class victory with Z3 M Coupe 450 hp / total 7. grade under 70 starters
- In 2001, first Wiesmann MF3 Roadster with compressor engine 400 hp

- In 2002, M3 heart transplant – M5 V8 5.0l with performance upgrade 460 hp
- In 2002, customized individual project: Z8 exclusive optic design & compressor power plant 500 hp

- In 2004, displacement engine V8, extension to 5.2l and 420 hp
- In 2004, M3 – Airboxsystem- special development of racing use

- In 2005, development of compressor V8 Valvetronic 5.2l and 550hp
- In 2005, exclusive-LM-Rad SIII PRO, limited individual production, wheel star milled from one piece and much more
- In 2005, company extension - house-own GFK production
- In 2005, AERO – Program HIGHLINE for all BMW models, the particular design

- In 2006, introduction of performance kit M5 / M6 V10 with 620 hp

- In 2007 Prototype HURRICANE, M5 5.0 V10 with ASA Bi-compressor, 730PS achieved in Nardo, Italy "only" 321 km / h –

-2007 G-POWER and ASA, one of world`s most famous supercharger producer, decided both for their future close cooperation. 2 specialists looking for the challenges of the future!

-2008 Because of that G-POWER relocates with the whole company to Autenzell / Upper Bavaria, near Munich

-2008 World Record – The G-POWER M5 V10 HURRICANE with a top speed of 360km/h is the fastest street legal BMW sedan in the world

-2008 Supercharger system and aerodynamic body kit for the BMW X5 E70

-2008 Weltrekord - Schnellste Straßenzugelassene BMW Limousine
der G-POWER M5 V10 HURRICANE RS mit 367,4 km/h

-2009 M5/M6 V10 Bi-Kompressor als HURRICANE RS Variante mit 750PS
-2009 M3 E90/E92/E93 V8 Kompressoraufladung mit über 600 PS
-2009 X5 E70 M Version kommt von G-POWER mit über 600PS

……..and the story continues!
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      06-18-2009, 03:58 PM   #33
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Nice copy and paste job. Poor English and vague, misleading statements aside, pretty much everything you've listed was not done by G-Power, but by the other companies (ASA and Infinitas) with which it later merged. Even look on their site, any E46/E39 cars, and earlier models, are fully decked out in Alpina gear, as Alpina and ASA were technical partners.

I'm not trying to criticize, but it's well known that G-Power was almost non existent before a few years ago. There is zero information available for their supposed older cars. They may be a great company, I've never dealt with them, but it's very misleading to say they've been around for 25 years.
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      06-18-2009, 04:46 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Don´t think it would rip these S/C Ms apart, but it is fair if you think it is so. Some of us don´t want a used car and some others maybe done´t want the attention of a P and yes others may think an M3 with clean mods looks better than the used P (or new) plus more flexible. I´d say to each his own. Anyway, that used P with those mods you mention would also cost you an arm and a leg. I also bet he changed wheels. lol!! Anyway, I challenge your friends P to Willow springs vs. my Stroker M3. I shit you not, my M is there and any one that wishes to challenge it is welcome. Might be a fun day!
but then that goes against your power to weight ratio theory, I have friends that push out 600 hp with minor mods and ecu tweaks on 997's and that said the 997 TT will have a power to weight ratio of 5.82 lbs per HP.
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      06-18-2009, 06:07 PM   #35
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but then that goes against your power to weight ratio theory, I have friends that push out 600 hp with minor mods and ecu tweaks on 997's and that said the 997 TT will have a power to weight ratio of 5.82 lbs per HP.
how does the z06 do against the tweaked tt's?...

Ya my co-workers tt is so extremely fast, and i dont think hes b/s ing when he says 640hp hes very knowledgable about porsche's. I think hes even on 6speed.

From what he said he got the tuning for 1200 dollars, cat off for 200 bucks, and the exhaust for 3000 bux(i dont know what kind ill ask). He says exhaust really doesnt make that much of a difference though. I also forgot to add that he has an air filter.
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      06-18-2009, 06:53 PM   #36
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Keep the M3, I traded in my 997 TT Cab for an M3 E92 and couldn't be happier. My 997 was chipped and even stock was much faster than the M but the M is amazing. The M has much more interior goods and is so much more comfortable to drive. Supercharge your M3 and save your money, the M3 is amazing. I believe there was also a road and track or car and driver article where they compared the M3 vs the Porsche and the GT-R and they enjoyed the BMW more also.
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      06-18-2009, 07:25 PM   #37
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but then that goes against your power to weight ratio theory, I have friends that push out 600 hp with minor mods and ecu tweaks on 997's and that said the 997 TT will have a power to weight ratio of 5.82 lbs per HP.
Agreed, the SC will add a bit of weight for sure on the M3 while the mods on a 997tt will not, so yes, you would have the advantage in the P car for sure in this case. Reason why I have kept my M NA and put it though a diet. lol.
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      06-18-2009, 07:33 PM   #38
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how does the z06 do against the tweaked tt's?...

Ya my co-workers tt is so extremely fast, and i dont think hes b/s ing when he says 640hp hes very knowledgable about porsche's. I think hes even on 6speed.

From what he said he got the tuning for 1200 dollars, cat off for 200 bucks, and the exhaust for 3000 bux(i dont know what kind ill ask). He says exhaust really doesnt make that much of a difference though. I also forgot to add that he has an air filter.
Z06 has a high displacement 7L NA engine. It should be able to pull off significant additional power with intake, ECU, header and exhaust mods alone, I’d say perhaps another 80hp depending on how sophisticated stock is. Given the huge displacement, I am not at all impressed with how much power per L this engine delivers. Though honestly I am just guessing and not familiar enough with this engine to say. Z06 is also a really light car with low centre of gravity so it should kill any of these cars with proper suspension etc... Perhaps a tad too front heavy. Again, not familiar to opine with any degree of accuracy but I am not a Corvette fan.

As for your friends P car, I am rather familiar with these and yes you can get 600+ hp but not with just a couple of changes. I feel it would take more than filters, ECU and exhaust to get to that power level. Anyway, my feeling is that you are a Porsche fan, so you just ought to go that route. It is certainly a fun and fantastic vehicle.
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      06-18-2009, 07:48 PM   #39
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What about the ESS supercharger? They have a good rep and their thread boasts 560 WHP which is about 640hp at the crank . If Im not mistaken they offer a warranty on their supercharger and its expected to be priced around 11.5k.

Going back up to the power to weight thread... If Im not mistaken there was a thread about people putting their stock M3s on weight stations and all came in around 3450 give or take if it was DCT.

I had heard BMWs weight figures are based on the car plus a 180 pound driver and 20 pounds of luggage. If thats so then it makes sense that it actually weighs in around 200 pounds less.
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      06-18-2009, 08:10 PM   #40
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What about the ESS supercharger? They have a good rep and their thread boasts 560 WHP which is about 640hp at the crank . If Im not mistaken they offer a warranty on their supercharger and its expected to be priced around 11.5k.

Going back up to the power to weight thread... If Im not mistaken there was a thread about people putting their stock M3s on weight stations and all came in around 3450 give or take if it was DCT.

I had heard BMWs weight figures are based on the car plus a 180 pound driver and 20 pounds of luggage. If thats so then it makes sense that it actually weighs in around 200 pounds less.
I think that all SC kit suppilers offer a warranty on their SC, but just that, that is, if the SC blows the engine, you alone will have to pay for it.

Standard weight I think always include a driver of 180lbs, 90% gas tank, etc... but it is clear that you have to read the fine print in order to determine how each is measuring weight. So, best way to reduce weight, is to lose it yourself. Hahaha¡
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      06-19-2009, 07:33 AM   #41
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Straight line
S/C M3 or Stroker M3?
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      06-19-2009, 07:37 AM   #42
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Straight line
S/C M3 or Stroker M3?
SC car in a straight line almost always, regardless of car model.
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      06-19-2009, 07:46 AM   #43
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I def wanna see the G-Power M3 vs a 997 Turbo. I think the G-power would edge it slightly...maybe not.

Take a look at all these videos:
G-power pulls hard on bolt-on M3
M5 pulls pretty hard on stock M3
Turbo pulls pretty hard on M6





Also take into consideration M6>M5 touring
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      06-19-2009, 01:34 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Z06 has a high displacement 7L NA engine. It should be able to pull off significant additional power with intake, ECU, header and exhaust mods alone, I’d say perhaps another 80hp depending on how sophisticated stock is. Given the huge displacement, I am not at all impressed with how much power per L this engine delivers. Though honestly I am just guessing and not familiar enough with this engine to say. Z06 is also a really light car with low centre of gravity so it should kill any of these cars with proper suspension etc... Perhaps a tad too front heavy. Again, not familiar to opine with any degree of accuracy but I am not a Corvette fan.

As for your friends P car, I am rather familiar with these and yes you can get 600+ hp but not with just a couple of changes. I feel it would take more than filters, ECU and exhaust to get to that power level. Anyway, my feeling is that you are a Porsche fan, so you just ought to go that route. It is certainly a fun and fantastic vehicle.
Im definately a porsche fan. However dont get me wrong i love m3's also! I use to own a modded e46 m3 and loved it. Definately a very nice car. As far as porsche, there are pretty rep. companies making over 600hp with a couple bolt ones.

My car next car will definately be a porsche gt3 or tt. For the other guy waiting for his tt, definately go with sherkwerks...
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