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      02-09-2009, 09:30 AM   #23
Notion-Za
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On a serious note i would suggest Animal Cuts! I dont believe in these weight loss pills though. They're full of caffine and f*** you up properly.!

On a funny note heres a great way to loose weight. Get a new GF and let her screw you over! happened to me and i lost 14kg's.
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      02-09-2009, 04:59 PM   #24
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hey use lipo 6x it works...it has for me and plenty of people i know...

Im back on my diet and trying to get fit for summer...

Ive been on a diet since jan 27th and ive lost 7.5 pounds so far eating right(1800-1900 calorie diet a day)<perfect for my weight and what i want to see, been doing cardio 5 days a week burning about 400 calories a day with it.

I am down to 229.5 pounds and im not stopping until i hit about 200.

Im down 15.5 pounds since Nov 14th.
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      02-09-2009, 05:09 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suareezay View Post
ephedrine + caffeine > all.
+10000000000000000

you can get it at Walgreens for 20 bucks a month if you know what to buy
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      02-09-2009, 05:26 PM   #26
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Beverly International Lean Out. No caffeine.
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      02-10-2009, 01:35 PM   #27
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Hotrox extreme... works so good.....
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      02-10-2009, 10:49 PM   #28
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maybe you should reconsider..
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/10/bu...tml?ref=health

Just drink protein shakes, there are ones that help you loose weight.
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      02-11-2009, 12:31 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asdflkijd View Post

Just drink protein shakes, there are ones that help you loose weight.
i dont want loose weight, i want tight weight.
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      02-13-2009, 12:10 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wj4 View Post
If you haven't changed your diet, that's the problem. I know people who go to the gym 4-5 times a week, but the only things that show are bigger arms and chest. Everything else remains the same due to their poor diet.

3 times a week, assuming each session is a good work out, should yield some result after 2 months. Not much, but you should be able to see the change.
I have been working on my diet, still no where near perfect and I have an even harder time following it
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      02-13-2009, 01:26 AM   #31
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drink green tea.
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      02-13-2009, 01:28 AM   #32
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drink green tea.
+1

It's good for you anyhow.
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      02-13-2009, 04:14 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greeney View Post
I have been working on my diet, still no where near perfect and I have an even harder time following it
You mind posting up your daily food intake? I'm no fitness guru, but I'm just curious.

Markoni-I agree with a lot of things you said, but damn bro, no need to be so aggressive.
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      02-13-2009, 08:34 AM   #34
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Drink a cup of coffee an hour before workout and you're good to go.
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      02-13-2009, 09:31 AM   #35
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All i can say it must be difficult especially in America.

When i was over there i was happy as pig in shit . Cheap food and lots of it. I know if i lived there i would be seriously overweight.
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      02-13-2009, 09:51 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markoni View Post
Wow, I'm amazed at some of the BS info that's being thrown around here. No wonder most people are out of shape and unhealthy.

For starters, muscle does NOT turn into fat. Under extreme circumstances, the body starts to burn muscle for energy. This doesn't happen from one skipped lunch or whatever. Believe me, you'll know it when it happens. It's not an "I need something to eat" feeling. It's an "I need immediate medical attention" feeling.

That aside, what DOES happen when you don't eat for a while is that your body starts producing more cortisol to cope. This leads to greater fat retention. In other words, you get fatter. Hardly muscle turning into fat.

Now as far as diet pills go, they're dangerous and they're for chicks. Seriously, man up. You ate like shit for years and spent hours and hours at the dinner table gorging yourself. Now when it's time to pay your dues and work it off you're taking the cowards way out and looking for a pill to solve all your problems. It doesn't work that way.

Diet pills can only work by two principals. Either they mask your appetite, which isn't helping you one bit, only screwing you up even more (see cortisol comment above) or they increase your heart rate with caffeine and whatnot to make you burn more calories. I don't have to tell you what increasing your heartrate for extended periods of time like that will get you. Having a heart attack and fucking yourself up for life just to look good at the beach isn't worth it.

You want to lose weight? Own up to the shithole you put yourself into and work your way out of it. Don't go looking for some pill to wipe it all away. In addition, getting yourself fit the old-fashioned way - with hard work and dedication - will build some much needed character that it seems a lot of you looking for the easy road are lacking.
So, should I take Lipo 6x or Hydroxycut Hardcore?

BTW, I agree with you.
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      02-13-2009, 12:53 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markoni View Post
Diet pills can only work by two principals. Either they mask your appetite, which isn't helping you one bit, only screwing you up even more (see cortisol comment above) or they increase your heart rate with caffeine and whatnot to make you burn more calories. I don't have to tell you what increasing your heartrate for extended periods of time like that will get you. Having a heart attack and fucking yourself up for life just to look good at the beach isn't worth it.

You want to lose weight? Own up to the shithole you put yourself into and work your way out of it. Don't go looking for some pill to wipe it all away. In addition, getting yourself fit the old-fashioned way - with hard work and dedication - will build some much needed character that it seems a lot of you looking for the easy road are lacking.
This is utter nonsense. Ephedrine hcl and yohimbine hcl are two safe and effective diet aids, and neither work soley by way of appetite suppression or increased heart rate.
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      02-13-2009, 02:08 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewyjr15 View Post
aside from my diet and exercise are there any pills i can take that are healthy and will help with wight loss. I am exercising 7 days a week and have been put on a diet by a nutritionist that i am sticking to. Would just rather loose the fat so i can start building muscle.

thanks
OP, There are a number of things you could be doing wrong. First, exercising 7 days a week is a big no no. Your body needs to recover in between. Muscle builds during recovery, NOT during the act of exercising. Second, lean muscle burns more calories at rest than does fat. What you should do is tailor a work out plan to progressively increase difficulty. Mix cardio with weights (one by itself wouldn't be enough to shed pounds the way you want). You really need to muster up some discipline to do those extra five minutes on the elliptical or those 5 extra reps. That being said, interval training works wonders on the cardio machines or even on a run, and power sets really help in building lean muscle. You must change your routine every so often and make it more difficult, otherwise your body will adapt and you'll stop seeing gains.
As for your diet, it's OK to allow yourself a cheat day, or even a few (and I must emphasize a FEW) bites of your favorite dessert. Studies have shown that people who try to quit their favorite foods cold turkey fail miserably. If you allow yourself a bite every so often, you won't miss the food and give in to temptation. You should STOP eating when you begin feeling full. If you can, eat slowly, as it takes your stomach about 20 minutes to tell your brain that it's full. By then, you've probably overeaten already. One last note, to see effective weight loss, you should be burning more calories a day than you consume. If you can't spend more than am hour at the gym, consider taking the stairs instead of the elevator, walk more or ride a bike to work on occasion (if work is not too far, of course) and ride that bike or run to the gym.
Overall, discipline is what will get you through this. Once you find that right balance of nutrition and exercise, you should be able to maintain no problem.

And lastly, for the poster who said that diet pills are for chicks, you should really consider not generalizing and putting every "chick" in that category. Many men struggle with weight gain and opt for the same easy out as females.

Last edited by Shadow_Phantom12; 02-13-2009 at 02:25 PM.
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      02-13-2009, 02:13 PM   #39
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stay away from the pills - once you are off of them, you will get back to where you were before - - - all you need is proper diet and exercise.
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      02-13-2009, 03:12 PM   #40
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This may be a off track but I think it is good advice.

Get a personal trainer. Why? Because if you calculate the money you're going to be spending on high quality GNC pills ($200 a month or more) you can probably find a young college student or trainee at your local gym (who will work a deal out) that will get you going. If you have a motivated friend - even better. Just make sure the routine you plan is a solid one that tones and shapes evenly and doesn't kill you.

Granted the gym membership costs aren't factored in but nothing moves you to push yourself like a trainer. Once you have one, you'll know what I'm talking about.
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      02-13-2009, 03:58 PM   #41
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if you are going to use a quick fix like drugs . . . just go get some lypo. I know girls who have gotten it, and are on their way back up in the LBs because they never changed their habits. . . .
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      02-13-2009, 04:11 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markoni View Post
You mean the same Ephedrine that causes hypertension and numerous heart attacks in young people? If you honestly think that ANY chemical concoction mixed up in a lab is safe or healthy then I feel sorry for you.
please feel free to post any data showing that ephedrine caused hypertension or heart attacks in healthy adults.

what about 'chemical concoctions' that certain patients require in order to live or lead a normal life? i guess those people shouldnt take them, since since they are all unhealthy and unsafe.

Quote:
BTW, you know what the BEST diet aid is? Shutting your damn mouth. Learn self-control and you won't need countless pills and unnecessary risks. Of course, self-control is rare in this day and age.
holy fuck, doctor. you solved the problem. here i was thinking this thread was about 'weight loss pills' i.e. diet aids, but apparently its really about the best dieting method. thanks for clearing that up.

Last edited by oldaccount; 02-13-2009 at 04:53 PM.
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      02-13-2009, 04:14 PM   #43
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Women always tell me that celebrities DON'T EAT to stay so fucking thin. No joke.
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      02-13-2009, 04:34 PM   #44
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ill actually go ahead and post the data for you, just to nip your ridiculous, dogmatic idea in the bud early.

Quote:
The acute and chronic effects of ephedrine/caffeine mixtures on energy expenditure and glucose metabolism in humans.

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord. 1993 Dec;17 Suppl 3:S73-7; discussion S82.
Toubro S, Astrup A, Breum L, Quaade F.

Research Department of Human Nutrition, Royal Veterinary and Agricultural University, Fredriksberg, Copenhagen, Denmark.

This paper describes a 24-week open follow-up trial with reduced obese patients all receiving an ephedrine/caffeine combination (20 mg/200 mg) three times a day. The study was a continuation of a previous 24-week double-blind placebo-controlled study where the ephedrine/caffeine mixture had shown superior weight-reducing properties when compared with either ephedrine alone (20 mg) or caffeine alone (200 mg) three times a day. The medication was stopped between weeks 24-26 in order to evaluate withdrawal symptoms. The follow-up period was from weeks 26 to 50. Of 127 patients included, 99 completed the follow-up treatment, which resulted in an additional weight loss of 1.1 kg (P = 0.02). Adverse drug reactions were all minor and temporary. We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is safe and effective in long-term treatment in improving and maintaining weight loss. The side-effects are minor and transient and no clinically relevant withdrawal symptoms have been observed.
Quote:
Multinutrient supplement containing ephedra and caffeine causes weight loss and improves metabolic risk factors in obese women: a randomized controlled trial.

Int J Obes (Lond). 2006 Mar 21; [Epub ahead of print] Related Articles, Links
Hackman RM, Havel PJ, Schwartz HJ, Rutledge JC, Watnik MR, Noceti EM, Stohs SJ, Stern JS, Keen CL.

Department of Nutrition, University of California, Davis, CA, USA.

Objective:To determine the safety and efficacy of a dietary supplement with a low dose of ephedra and caffeine in overweight/obese premenopausal female subjects.Design:A 9-month, double-blind, randomized control study compared the efficacy and safety of a dietary supplement with ephedra and caffeine to a control supplement.Subjects:Sixty-one healthy, premenopausal women with body mass index (BMI) from 27 to 39 kg/m(2) were randomly assigned and received a dietary supplement (40 mg/day ephedra alkaloids, 100 mg/day caffeine, high potency mixture of vitamins, minerals, omega-3 fatty acids) or a control supplement for 9 months.Measurements:Efficacy: changes in body weight, body composition, lipids, insulin, leptin, adiponectin, ghrelin, and self-reports of physical activity, diet and quality of life indices. Safety: blood pressure, heart rate, electrocardiograms, urinalysis, blood histology, serum chemistry measures and self-reported symptoms.Results:Forty-one women completed the study. The treatment group lost significantly more body weight (-7.18 kg) and body fat (-5.33 kg) than the control group (-2.25 and -0.99 kg, respectively), and showed significant declines in heart rate, serum cholesterol, triglycerides, cholesterol to high-density lipoprotein ratio, glucose, fasting insulin, and leptin. Blood pressure, electrocardiograms, other clinical chemistry measures, blood histology, urinalysis, and self-reported physical activity were similar in the groups. Minor symptoms included dry mouth, insomnia, nervousness and palpitations. The treatment group reported more energy and decreased appetite compared to controls and scored higher on a quality of life domain assessing vitality.Conclusion:A dietary supplement containing a low potency ephedra/caffeine mixture appeared safe and effective in causing loss of weight and body fat, and improving several metabolic parameters, including insulin sensitivity and lipid profiles when tested under physician supervision. Such supplements could be a useful tool to assist with weight loss.International Journal of Obesity advance online publication, 21 March 2006; doi:10.1038/sj.ijo.0803283.
Quote:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord. 2002 May;26(5):593-604. Related Articles, Links
Herbal ephedra/caffeine for weight loss: a 6-month randomized safety and efficacy trial.

Boozer CN, Daly PA, Homel P, Solomon JL, Blanchard D, Nasser JA, Strauss R, Meredith T.

New York Obesity Research Center, St Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital and Columbia University, New York 10025, USA.


OBJECTIVE: To examine long-term safety and efficacy for weight loss of an herbal Ma Huang and Kola nut supplement (90/192 mg/day ephedrine alkaloids/caffeine). DESIGN: Six-month randomized, double-blind placebo controlled trial. SUBJECTS: A total of 167 subjects (body mass index (BMI) 31.8+/-4.1 kg/m(2)) randomized to placebo (n=84) or herbal treatment (n=83) at two outpatient weight control research units. MEASUREMENTS: Primary outcome measurements were changes in blood pressure, heart function and body weight. Secondary variables included body composition and metabolic changes. RESULTS: By last observation carried forward analysis, herbal vs placebo treatment decreased body weight (-5.3+/-5.0 vs. -2.6+/-3.2 kg, P<0.001), body fat (-4.3+/-3.3 vs. -2.7+/-2.8 kg, P=0.020) and LDL-cholesterol (-8+/-20 vs. 0+/-17 mg/dl, P=0.013), and increased HDL-cholesterol (+2.7+/-5.7 vs. -0.3+/-6.7 mg/dl, P=0.004). Herbal treatment produced small changes in blood pressure variables (+3 to -5 mm Hg, P< or =0.05), and increased heart rate (4+/-9 vs. -3+/-9 bpm, P<0.001), but cardiac arrhythmias were not increased (P>0.05). By self-report, dry mouth (P<0.01), heartburn (P<0.05), and insomnia (P<0.01) were increased and diarrhea decreased (P<0.05). Irritability, nausea, chest pain and palpitations did not differ, nor did numbers of subjects who withdrew. CONCLUSIONS: In this 6-month placebo-controlled trial, herbal ephedra/caffeine (90/192 mg/day) promoted body weight and body fat reduction and improved blood lipids without significant adverse events.
Quote:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...?dopt=Abstract
The effect of ephedrine/caffeine mixture on energy expenditure and body composition in obese women.

Astrup A, Buemann B, Christensen NJ, Toubro S, Thorbek G, Victor OJ, Quaade F.

Research Department of Human Nutrition, Royal Veterinary and Agricultural University, Copenhagen, Denmark.

Treatment with beta 2-agonists promotes fat loss and muscle growth in numerous species, but human studies are lacking. We studied the effect of a compound with beta 2-agonistic properties (ephedrine 20 mg/caffeine 200 mg [E + C]). Fourteen obese women were treated with a 4.2-MJ/d diet and either E + C or placebo (P) three times per day for 8 weeks in a double-blind study. Weight-loss was not different in the groups, but the E + C group lost 4.5 kg more body fat and 2.8 kg less fat-free mass (FFM). The decrease in 24-hour energy expenditure (EE) seen in the P group was 10% at day 1 and 13% at day 56, but was only 7% and 8% in the treated group (P = .044). The higher EE in the E +C group was entirely covered by fat oxidation. These findings provide evidence that promotion of fat loss and preservation of FFM during weight reduction may also be achieved pharmacologically in humans.
Quote:
Safety and efficacy of long-term treatment with ephedrine, caffeine and an ephedrine/caffeine mixture.

Toubro S, Astrup AV, Breum L, Quaade F.

Research Department of Human Nutrition, Royal Veterinary and Agricultural University, Fredriksberg, Copenhagen, Denmark.

In a randomized, placebo-controlled, double blind study, 180 obese patients were treated by diet (4.2 MJ/day) and either an ephedrine/caffeine combination (20mg/200mg), ephedrine (20mg), caffeine (200mg) or placebo 3 times a day for 24 weeks. 141 patients completed this part of the study. All medication was stopped between week 24-26 in order to catch any withdrawal symptoms. From week 26 to 50, 99 patients completed treatment with the ephedrine/caffeine compound in an open trial design, resulting in a statistically significant (p = 0.02) weight loss of 1.1kg. In another randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled 8 week study on obese subjects we found the mentioned compound showed lean body mass conserving properties. We conclude that the ephedrine/caffeine combination is effective in improving and maintaining weight loss, further it has lean body mass saving properties. The side effects are minor and transient and no withdrawal symptoms have been found.
Quote:
Title: Ephedrine, caffeine and aspirin: safety and efficacy for treatment of human obesity.
Author: Daly PA; Krieger DR; Dulloo AG; Young JB; Landsberg L
Source: Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord, 17 Suppl 1():S73-8 1993 Feb

Abstract
The safety and efficacy of a mixture of ephedrine (75-150mg), caffeine (150mg) and aspirin (330mg), in divided premeal doses, were investigated in 24 obese humans (mean BMI 37.0) in a randomized double blind placebo-controlled trial. Energy intake was not restricted. Overall weight loss over 8 weeks was 2.2kg for ECA vs. 0.7 kg for placebo (p < 0.05). 8 of 13 placebo subjects returned 5 months later and received ECA in an unblinded crossover. After 8 weeks, mean weight loss with ECA was 3.2 kg vs 1.3 kg for placebo (p = 0.036). 6 subjects continued on ECA for 7 to 26 months. After 5 months on ECA, average weight loss in 5 of these was 5.2 kg compared to 0.03 kg gained during 5 months between studies with no intervention (p = 0.03). The sixth subject lost 66 kg over 13 months by self-imposed caloric restriction. In all studies, no significant changes in heart rate, blood pressure, blood glucose, insulin, and cholesterol levels, and no differences in the frequency of side effects were found. ECA in these doses is thus well tolerated in otherwise healthy obese subjects, and supports modest, sustained weight loss even without prescribed caloric restriction, and may be more effective in conjunction with restriction of energy intake.
So not only is EC safe in healthy adults, it makes dieting while preserving fat free mass more effective.
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