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      01-30-2009, 02:45 AM   #1
JamesClay
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New Moton toys on the way...

Here is a sneak peek. The black is a development set we worked with at Sebring, production set is the normal burnt orange color.
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      01-30-2009, 02:54 AM   #2
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Nice! Let us know how they are on the track
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      01-30-2009, 03:06 AM   #3
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Excellent smithers.
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      01-30-2009, 03:12 AM   #4
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When are they coming out?
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      01-30-2009, 03:23 AM   #5
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Please keep us updated. Thanks.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      01-30-2009, 05:08 AM   #6
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James, is this the new Street Sport Damper from Moton?
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      01-30-2009, 03:29 PM   #7
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One of the guys took snips from my track notes and put them up on the web. They were 2 weeks or so out, but in the test we came up with a few tweaks that will in my opinion perfect the kit, so that got delayed a little.

http://store.bimmerworld.com/Product1156

I am taking the car to VIR and Road Atlanta end of Feb/early March if anyone wants to check it out in person or catch a ride.
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      01-30-2009, 04:31 PM   #8
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'dropping lap times 5 seconds'?

i know Motons are good.. but Cmon..... I assume you changed alignment to a more aggressive setup... or where the specs the exact same?.... and also this was on a different day i guess?...

none the less... Thats a very nice street/track suspension set up....


what event will you be at for Road ATL? dates?
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      01-30-2009, 05:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon@RENNSpec View Post
James, is this the new Street Sport Damper from Moton?
Sorry - yes it is.
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      01-30-2009, 05:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGLEH View Post
'dropping lap times 5 seconds'?

i know Motons are good.. but Cmon..... I assume you changed alignment to a more aggressive setup... or where the specs the exact same?.... and also this was on a different day i guess?...

what event will you be at for Road ATL? dates?
Alignment was set the same. This was done in two consecutive sessions on the same day with our race crew changing suspensions and scaling the car between sessions. I turned lap times within a couple of tenths during the enduro practice the night before, and we used a data system, sectioned into about 13 segments, and I am comparing the eclectic lap to give the most accurate data.

So yes, thats the deal. And not sure why people don't believe this - suspension is by far the best bang for the buck for improving laptimes.

ATL - 3/5-7 I think - Peachtree BMW. We may be doing testing on Friday, but stop by and I am sure there is time for a few laps in between runs.
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      01-30-2009, 05:20 PM   #11
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Hi James - sounds really nice! I look forward to seeing your car at VIR. BTW - pads came today so thanks!

Barry
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      01-30-2009, 05:22 PM   #12
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what kinda tires are you guys running?


did you use the "eclectic lap" function for the stock shocks/H&R springs 'fast lap' also?... or just your best rolling lap....


With Sebring such a long track and so many different surfaces and quality's of pavement/asphalt.. i could see how the eclectic time could be 5 sec faster then your best time from earlier sessions...

at a more 'normal' track.. like Roebling road.... i could see a 1.5 sec improvement being reasonable.. and 2 sec improvement should be possible at a place like Road ATL...
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      01-30-2009, 05:55 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGLEH View Post
what kinda tires are you guys running?


did you use the "eclectic lap" function for the stock shocks/H&R springs 'fast lap' also?... or just your best rolling lap....


With Sebring such a long track and so many different surfaces and quality's of pavement/asphalt.. i could see how the eclectic time could be 5 sec faster then your best time from earlier sessions...

at a more 'normal' track.. like Roebling road.... i could see a 1.5 sec improvement being reasonable.. and 2 sec improvement should be possible at a place like Road ATL...
That was on Hankook Z214, and they weren't getting any faster as they wore. Eclectic was used on all comparisons - otherwise it wouldn't really be a fair comparison and I am not into magical claims.

Laptimes improvement would be close to the same at other tracks. Sebring has "17" turns but it is really more like 13 turns that really affect the car - or that are anything other than flat on the gas. Roebling has more like 8 and having the car supported properly on the last turn alone rather than rolling will be worth a lot of speed on a very long straight. Road ATL is about 13 turns in that car.

That being said, I will be happy to do back to back laps in anyone's car at VIR or ATL to prove that the laptimes are that different - I'll even mount up my tires on your car to keep that variable the same
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      01-30-2009, 06:14 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesC View Post

That being said, I will be happy to do back to back laps in anyone's car at VIR or ATL to prove that the laptimes are that different - I'll even mount up my tires on your car to keep that variable the same
Hey James - want to use my car to prove your point?!?

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      01-30-2009, 08:48 PM   #15
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This is setup I've been waiting for.
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      01-30-2009, 09:37 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesC View Post
That was on Hankook Z214, and they weren't getting any faster as they wore. Eclectic was used on all comparisons - otherwise it wouldn't really be a fair comparison and I am not into magical claims.

Laptimes improvement would be close to the same at other tracks. Sebring has "17" turns but it is really more like 13 turns that really affect the car - or that are anything other than flat on the gas. Roebling has more like 8 and having the car supported properly on the last turn alone rather than rolling will be worth a lot of speed on a very long straight. Road ATL is about 13 turns in that car.

That being said, I will be happy to do back to back laps in anyone's car at VIR or ATL to prove that the laptimes are that different - I'll even mount up my tires on your car to keep that variable the same


you wont be able to get 'same' results at a track like Roebling... when you would already be turning 1:19s.... you will not turn a 1:14 with the added suspension....

the laptime is almost half that then Sebring...

I assume your fastest lap at Sebring (not eclectic) was around a 2:21?


also that tire is a pure race tire.. so i can see now how the Motons would be much better suited for it....


You must have alot of free time to be changing up tires on other peoples cars!!!


can you post pics if the car.. and tire sizes.. ide like to see a well prepped street/track m3.. to see what it looks like.. how it sits.. and such..

you guys using stock calipers still?
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      01-31-2009, 01:36 AM   #17
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James, what's the story with sways for the E9X M3?

BTW I was pretty impressed with EDC even compared to the Moton CS setup I have on my E46. This kit has got to be awesome.
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      01-31-2009, 12:43 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGLEH View Post
...

you guys using stock calipers still?
Since KINGLEH brought it up; When are you going to get the Performance Friction components for regular consumption?

Would a mod like the solid bushing used in previous BMW calipers be applicable/available to the stock calipers in the e9x M3? If so, I'd like to convert over to PF rotors when they become available, assuming PF-01s are available for stock calipers.

Bimmerworld only shows the full PF kit without a date for availability. Give us the full scoop on this stuff, please.

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      02-02-2009, 06:43 PM   #19
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Moton kit - nothing like the CS kit - or not a lot like. The reason it has taken two years to get it on the market is the huge amount of testing and revision they have done on the dampers. They are treating this like another line to a good degree and I think they are a bit more dialed-in than the Club Sport and I don't miss the canisters for most normal use.

A good suspension works for any tire use to a reasonable degree. Slicks have a little different characteristics, but we are talking about a DOT-R radial tire here. We have raced on a Toyo T1-S pure street tire in the past and the same dampers and even similar spring rates were used when we moved to a DOT-R. The performance differential will be there on street or track tires - again, unless you are going a bit out of the box. Doing some testing of Nitto NT-05 for them shortly back-to-back with a Michelin PS-2, then swapping to an NT-01 DOT-R. Unfortunately not doing a suspension swap this time to prove the point, but I expect the street tires to be similar in performance, just less grip.

PFC - you mean these old things? Just verified fitment end of last week. Should have the 4-wheel at VIR and Road Atlanta. As far as delivery date for customers, I assume a couple of weeks later - it is a priority.

The solid brake guides don't fit the E9X calipers and I don't anticipate making anything right now. I am HOPING to see PFC pads in a month or so - again on my high priority list. I know when our car was there they measured it up for the Direct-Drive stock replacement rotors, but no eta on those.

2:21 at Sebring... Keep in mind that a 2700# World Challenge car does a 2:21 and we are typically a little faster than Koni GS cars that are full built racecars. So if 2:21 is possible, it will take a lot better driver than me to get there.

Brakes and car pic. Not really dropping the car too much to keep the geometry reasonable.
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      02-02-2009, 06:49 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jml View Post
James, what's the story with sways for the E9X M3?
Sways - waiting... We have a front from the 335 (Hotchkis), but the rear is a bit bigger on the M.
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      02-02-2009, 07:50 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGLEH View Post
'dropping lap times 5 seconds'?

i know Motons are good.. but Cmon..... I assume you changed alignment to a more aggressive setup... or where the specs the exact same?.... and also this was on a different day i guess?...

none the less... Thats a very nice street/track suspension set up....


what event will you be at for Road ATL? dates?
He is saying that he knocked 5 seconds off of the time with H&Rs. Maybe he only knocked 3 seconds off of the stock spring set up.

What springs are you running again? Oh, yeah.
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      02-05-2009, 01:56 AM   #22
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Cant wait to see a set in person
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