BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos
 
ESS Tuning
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-20-2008, 03:03 PM   #1
Jack in Jax
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: Pearson 424 Ketch
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Jacksonville FL

Posts: 226
iTrader: (0)

BMW beats Prius on Mileage

Just thought I'd add a bit of news for fun: A BMW 520d recently went against a Toyota Prius on a 565-mile real-world London-to-Geneva mileage challenge...with 100 miles of city driving thrown in at the end (supposedly, Prius' meat & potatoes). The 520d got 41.9 mpg, the Prius (500# lighter) got 40.1 mpg (U.S. gals). This was sponsored by the Times of London after it got numerous complaint letters from Prius owners about poor mileage on their 'green' cars.

Last laugh: The Prius ran out of gas near the finish line. The 520d arrived with 1/3 of a tank remaining.

Jack
Jack in Jax is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 03:15 PM   #2
adam135aoc
adam_txGarage
 
adam135aoc's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 850CSi
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Dallas Tx

Posts: 87
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to adam135aoc
old news... but you are correct... there are a lot of diesel vehicles that out do the prius in gas mileage...
__________________
txGarage Texas Car Enthusiast! BMW 850CSi
twitter _
adam135aoc is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 03:28 PM   #3
adam135aoc
adam_txGarage
 
adam135aoc's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 850CSi
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Dallas Tx

Posts: 87
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to adam135aoc
suzuki swift 1.3l diesel get 65mpg lets see a prius do that
__________________
txGarage Texas Car Enthusiast! BMW 850CSi
twitter _
adam135aoc is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 03:46 PM   #4
BMW Dreamer
Colonel
 
BMW Dreamer's Avatar
 
Drives: Modded 06 TL Manual
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Northern IL.

Posts: 2,387
iTrader: (0)

Can these cars be purchased in the U.S.A. ??? Thats the question.
BMW Dreamer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 04:05 PM   #5
cracka
Captain
 
cracka's Avatar
 
Drives: VO 1M
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: DFW

Posts: 777
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to cracka
In mixed city & urban highway driving, we get about 44 MPG without trying in our Prius. When applying some conservative techniques (feathering the accelerator, no more than 65 MPH, easy starts, no A/C or heat) it's not a problem to get 51-52 MPG.

My point being what the hell were they doing to eek out 40 MPG in theirs?

As a point of reference, I'm averaging about 22 MPG in my 135i on the same routes. My driving style is a bit different in the 1er. :biggrin:
cracka is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 04:41 PM   #6
BMW Dreamer
Colonel
 
BMW Dreamer's Avatar
 
Drives: Modded 06 TL Manual
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Northern IL.

Posts: 2,387
iTrader: (0)

I have also read alot about the Prius getting great MPG. It depends how you drive it. Thats part of the reason all the info on your driving habits are right in front of you on the Prius screen. It keeps you aware of your driving habits, after awhile it becomes 2nd nature. Then the car gets great MPG. Plus the Prius gets some of the HIGHEST ratings for reliability. They also brought out a new Prius thats stripped and cheaper to buy.
BMW Dreamer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 05:16 PM   #7
Nixon
Banned
 
Drives: :
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: :

Posts: 1,396
iTrader: (0)

There are SO many cars built around the world that will match or beat the Prius in fuel consumption that it isn't even funny. Gas powered, diesel powered, propane powered, you name it.

They just aren't sold in the US.

Just about every car maker, including the Big 2.5 american car companies, have more fuel efficient cars for sell in the rest of the world besides the US. Even Toyota has more fuel efficient cars they sell in other parts of the world then what they sell in the US.

The question is, what is it going to take to get some of these sold in the US?
Nixon is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 05:55 PM   #8
canlefty
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2015 F82 M4 MW/SO on the way
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Calgary

Posts: 118
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nixon View Post
The question is, what is it going to take to get some of these sold in the US?
About 200 million brain transplants (I'll give 100 million the benefit of the doubt), and the public execution of everyone involved in marketing from the "big 4" or however few there are now.
canlefty is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 06:28 PM   #9
PA135i
Major
 
PA135i's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 SGM 135i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pennsylvania

Posts: 1,185
iTrader: (0)

I asked this in another post, have kidding. But, what can a Prius do 0 -60?

I'll take my 135i. During the work week I'll drive efficiently and get 20 -22 mpg. On the weekends or when the need is there to pass someone, I'll leave them so far in the rear view that they'll look like a nat in 4 seconds. That thrill and fun factor is worth it to me.

This wait is killing me. Not even a production number yet.
PA135i is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 06:46 PM   #10
Russo
Commander
 
Russo's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 Dodge Dakota Big Horn
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Raceland, LA

Posts: 321
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via Yahoo to Russo
VW GTI D does some 45+ mpg... priced lower too i think...
__________________
FS: CT9A parts and Enkei Wheels!!! PST

BLUEFAKES.COM ARE SCAMMERS, LIERS, AND CHEATERS! DO NOT BUY FROM THEM!!!
Russo is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 07:14 PM   #11
Nixon
Banned
 
Drives: :
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: :

Posts: 1,396
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kja325ci View Post
I asked this in another post, half kidding. But, what can a Prius do 0 -60?
That's my point, actually, for why BMW should be importing the 123d today.

Why drive a FWD Prius with 0-60 in about 10 seconds, when a chipped 123d gets around the same mpg, has RWD, rock solid handling, and will burn off the tires doing 0-60 somewhere in the 6-second range? That's around the same as the early 2000's 330i. Nobody confused the 330i for being Prius-like dog slow.

I'll take 330i-like performance with Prius-like mpg over the Prius any day.
Nixon is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 07:24 PM   #12
ARES45
Major
 
Drives:
Join Date: Oct 2007

Posts: 1,002
iTrader: (0)

Ditto Nixon
__________________
"Don't run, you'll only die tired" ~ Gunship Pilot
ARES45 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 07:29 PM   #13
PA135i
Major
 
PA135i's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 SGM 135i
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pennsylvania

Posts: 1,185
iTrader: (0)

Your right. Not to mention the Prius is VERY odd looking.
PA135i is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 10:27 PM   #14
jeremyc74
Banned
 
Drives: '08 135i Montego/Terra
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Evansville, IN

Posts: 5,972
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cracka View Post
In mixed city & urban highway driving, we get about 44 MPG without trying in our Prius. When applying some conservative techniques (feathering the accelerator, no more than 65 MPH, easy starts, no A/C or heat) it's not a problem to get 51-52 MPG.

My point being what the hell were they doing to eek out 40 MPG in theirs?

I get about exactly the same results in our Prius, and I have the exact same question. I ran the living hell out of ours just to see what would happen and I wound up with 39MPG.

My guess is they averaged over 80MPH on the entire highway portion to stack the deck against the Prius. In the real world it's rare to ever see anything below 43MPG, even on road trips that are nearly all highway.
jeremyc74 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 10:31 PM   #15
jeremyc74
Banned
 
Drives: '08 135i Montego/Terra
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Evansville, IN

Posts: 5,972
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nixon View Post
The question is, what is it going to take to get some of these sold in the US?

The answer is very simple. All they have to do is meet the emissions standards in the US. By the time they pile on the equipment to do that, in most cases the mileage has suffered and the price has gone up. People can say what they want about diesel emissions, but I'd rather be locked in a garage with a running Prius over a TDI any day of the week.
jeremyc74 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-20-2008, 10:54 PM   #16
ihatepostmodernism
Private
 
Drives:
Join Date: Oct 2007

Posts: 96
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by canlefty View Post
About 200 million brain transplants (I'll give 100 million the benefit of the doubt), and the public execution of everyone involved in marketing from the "big 4" or however few there are now.
good answer
ihatepostmodernism is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-22-2008, 04:52 AM   #17
Kayne
New Member
 
Drives:
Join Date: Apr 2008

Posts: 23
iTrader: (0)

Bring diesels to the USA!
Kayne is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-22-2008, 10:40 AM   #18
canlefty
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2015 F82 M4 MW/SO on the way
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Calgary

Posts: 118
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kayne View Post
Bring diesels to the USA!
I agree, but better bring some refineries to go along with :wink:
canlefty is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-22-2008, 11:19 AM   #19
oneaabe
Private First Class
 
Drives:
Join Date: Nov 2007

Posts: 139
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremyc74 View Post
The answer is very simple. All they have to do is meet the emissions standards in the US.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that the emissions standards in Europe were tougher !?:iono:
__________________
135i 6 speed, Sapphire black, Coral Red, Gloss black trim, ZSP, ZPP, ipod/6FL, Hi-Fi
Timeline: Ordered (got prod. #): April 12 '08; Scheduled for production: July 10 '08; DoB: July 18 '08; ED Pickup: 1st Aug '08; ED Dropoff: 4th Aug '08; Arrived at Port Hueneme: 5th Oct '08; At VPC: 10th Oct '08; Pickup at local dealer: 14th Oct'08;
Current Status:
oneaabe is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-22-2008, 02:13 PM   #20
Jack in Jax
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: Pearson 424 Ketch
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Jacksonville FL

Posts: 226
iTrader: (0)

What "standards" actually apply thru-out the EU is a very complicated reality. Bottom line: Don't think of the EU as a single, Federal system like the USA or Canada...but rather as a Confederation such as the USA started with. "States" rule, and the overarching (EU) govt. can only call the shots on the edges.

For many decades, European motorists have paid highly for fuel because it's heavily taxed - ergo, the popularity of diesel cars of all sizes (better mileage, no fuel price penalty). For many decades, N American drivers have enjoyed cheap fuel - ergo, the popularity of gas engines (poorer mileage but more power). We still pay less than half the amount Europeans do for a liter or gallon of gasoline; e.g. last time I bought gas in London (9/07) it was $8 USD/gallon.

I've been looking...but so far found no business rationale offered by any oil company why U.S. diesel has a +$.60/gal price point. Sure, perhaps a $.05 add'l cost for distribution - assuming the goal is to punish diesel fuel buyers for buying diesel. But $.60/gallon or 15% more cost for a less refined product that's still distributed widely? Come on...

Jack
Jack in Jax is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-23-2008, 10:34 AM   #21
jeremyc74
Banned
 
Drives: '08 135i Montego/Terra
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Evansville, IN

Posts: 5,972
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by oneaabe View Post
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that the emissions standards in Europe were tougher !?:iono:

Nope. CA has the toughest vehicle emissions standards in the world, with the rest of the US not too far behind. The difference is in the levels in which various components of exhaust gasses are regulated.

I'm not an expert on the subject, but the way I understand it the US is much tougher on particulates than most other places, and the reduction of those particulates has proven to be difficult and expensive for diesels. Europe is tougher on overall CO2 I think, which gives diesels an edge there.
jeremyc74 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-23-2008, 04:14 PM   #22
Nixon
Banned
 
Drives: :
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: :

Posts: 1,396
iTrader: (0)

Tier 2 Bin 5 currently is the toughest diesel standard in the world. But the "Euro 5" emissions standard goes into effect in 2009 in Europe. So any changes that manufacturers would have to make for their cars to meet this standard by 2009 would have to be made to their 2009 model year cars that go on sale at the end of this summer. Otherwise they would have to do a mid-model year change in production.

Seriously, the Europeans should be able to pass at least some of these Euro 5 compliant cars through Tier 2 Bin 5 testing standards. Euro 5 and Tier 2 Bin 5 just aren't that far apart. And the 2014 Euro 6 standard is even slightly tougher than California's Tier 2 Bin 5.
Nixon is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:14 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST