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      11-01-2007, 08:45 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
I appreciate your effort, but a 6.9% rate is laughable. My last BMW I had 2.9%

I did say financially resposnible people. Whom, might have already invested in the stock market at an early age, could have their house payed off and their disposable income is greater than people making alot more.

I'm just saying it's hard to "generalize" who can afford a $30k car. BTW, my payments for a $49,ooo BMW 330ci, was only $560/month... so there is more that goes into "owning" and "affording" than just your figures.
6.5% on a new model with no incentives is reasonable....i'll concede to 6%, but if you think 2.9% financing will be available on this car, youre nuts.....it's not hard at all to pinpoint specifically who cant afford a 30k car....you crunch the numbers and there it is....ok Garrett, how are your payments on a 49k car $560.....??...did you put down 25k.....is it used?....did you lease and put down 5k.....cmon garrett, youre a smart, savvy right winger, give me some facts....Garrett, how many folks earning 45k-60k have invested in the stock market, and have paid off their homes?do you know both of them?....also, in your post you didnt qualify that level of financial acumen as a prerequisite at the 45-60k income level to own the 128....
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      11-01-2007, 08:49 PM   #112
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Yes, every person in this country has hospitalization. How can you not know this. Walk into any emegency room with no wallet and amnesia... By Federal law, they have to treat you!
BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR IT GARRETT......THATS NOT HOSPITALIZATION, THAT'S A LOAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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      11-01-2007, 09:00 PM   #113
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Again.. I have not turned my back on little children, I give weekly out of my paycheck to several charities. Secondly, if those children are that destitute, then the people who failed them are their PARENTS! Not the Government. More and more people are relying on the Government. Michigan cut out our weflare programe 10 years ago, guess what.... some 30,000 people got jobs or took advantage of free schooling. If you learn not to hunt for your food, you become reliant on hand-outs.

The government dos not exsist to suckle, nest and feed their citizens.


Yes, every person in this country has hospitalization. How can you not know this. Walk into any emegency room with no wallet and amnesia... By Federal law, they have to treat you!
come on Garrett, stop with the stereotyping...I'm referring to lower middle class and middle class working families with no health insurance who live paycheck to paycheck:wink:guess what Garrett, these are not welfare mamas......these are people who, if they have a health crisis, or an illness like childrens chickenpox, results in financial ruin.....
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      11-01-2007, 09:00 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by TESLAASTRO View Post
6.5% on a new model with no incentives is reasonable....i'll concede to 6%, but if you think 2.9% financing will be available on this car, youre nuts.....it's not hard at all to pinpoint specifically who cant afford a 30k car....you crunch the numbers and there it is....ok Garrett, how are your payments on a 49k car $560.....??...did you put down 25k.....is it used?....did you lease and put down 5k.....cmon garrett, youre a smart, savvy right winger, give me some facts....Garrett, how many folks earning 45k-60k have invested in the stock market, and have paid off their homes?do you know both of them?....also, in your post you didnt qualify that level of financial acumen as a prerequisite at the 45-60k income level to own the 128....

I can tell you this, your assumption that a $30k car has to be bought by a nubile is wrong. If you 50 and don't have a $1,300/month house payment, then your DISPOSIBLE income is alot more..!

Secondly, who says you have to finance through BMW?

I'm not going to discuss my finances with anyone. But it's not hard to be reserve and save money, then borrow it when you can't contain yourself and buy everything you see or want.

Yes, we said a $30k car. Since that was your argeument I just took the 128 out of the picture, because it didn't matter the type of car, just the price! I personally am interested in the 135i, but what does that have to do with this debate?
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      11-01-2007, 09:08 PM   #115
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If you learn not to hunt for your food, you become reliant on hand-outs.
Oh. I'm sorry I didnt read your whole post....it's crystal clear now that you and Ted Nugent have mind melded....youre from Michigan, and hes the former Motor City Madman.....now I get it.....I saw Nugent in 79 at the Garden when I was 12 on a double bill with Aerosmith- great show....too bad he sucks now

BTW.....Jack White is the greatest person to ever come from Michigan.......he left though and lives in Nashville now.....
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      11-01-2007, 09:11 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by TESLAASTRO View Post
come on Garrett, stop with the stereotyping...I'm referring to lower middle class and middle class working families with no health insurance who live paycheck to paycheck:wink:guess what Garrett, these are not welfare mamas......these are people who, if they have a health crisis, or an illness like childrens chickenpox, results in financial ruin.....

My aunt and uncle are in that exact situation. They sent their kids to private schools and struggled to provide the best for their children. My aunt is really sick now and qaulifies for medicare, but my uncle does not.

He recently got kidney stones. Cant afford the surgery and opted not to get healthcare threw work.

Why is this the governments fault..? We as a family helped them and made their house payments, etc. But I asked my UNcle why he just dosn't get a second job, so he doesn't have to worry about such things. Healthcare is $500/month.

He said it never occured to him!



I can tell you this.. it nevered occured to him, because he spends countless hours with pita, and some other liberal orgs and just assumed when it got worse, big brother would step in and help him. He's been trained to let othwers be responsible for his wellbeing.

I gave him a a Best Buy application and told him Pita won't pay the bills, but 20/hours a week here will! He now has healthcare and recently took me out to dinner!
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      11-01-2007, 09:17 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
I can tell you this, your assumption that a $30k car has to be bought by a nubile is wrong. If you 50 and don't have a $1,300/month house payment, then your DISPOSIBLE income is alot more..!

Secondly, who says you have to finance through BMW?

I'm not going to discuss my finances with anyone. But it's not hard to be reserve and save money, then borrow it when you can't contain yourself and buy everything you see or want.

Yes, we said a $30k car. Since that was your argeument I just took the 128 out of the picture, because it didn't matter the type of car, just the price! I personally am interested in the 135i, but what does that have to do with this debate?
Garrett, where are you going to get a 2.9% auto loan from a financial institution?.....the best out there now is about 5.5% for a great FICO.....I dont care about your finances Garrett, but unless you put down a shitload of $, youre not getting a 49k car for $560......if you did save up the $ and put it down to keep your payments low, bravo.....but if you saved that money at the expense contributing to an IRA, or contributions to a 401k, or an emergency fund, IMO

Garrett, what makes you "need" a 49k car so bad?....I'm curious......
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      11-01-2007, 09:20 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by TESLAASTRO View Post
Oh. I'm sorry I didnt read your whole post....it's crystal clear now that you and Ted Nugent have mind melded....youre from Michigan, and hes the former Motor City Madman.....now I get it.....I saw Nugent in 79 at the Garden when I was 12 on a double bill with Aerosmith- great show....too bad he sucks now

BTW.....Jack White is the greatest person to ever come from Michigan.......he left though and lives in Nashville now.....

I knew Jack and his wife. It's kinda surreal to be in a small local bar seeing them play, and then come and sit down next to you while the next band set's up. Then 6 months later see them on the cover of rolling stones

They were married then, but Meg is HOT!
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      11-01-2007, 09:23 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
My aunt and uncle are in that exact situation. They sent their kids to private schools and struggled to provide the best for their children. My aunt is really sick now and qaulifies for medicare, but my uncle does not.

He recently got kidney stones. Cant afford the surgery and opted not to get healthcare threw work.

Why is this the governments fault..? We as a family helped them and made their house payments, etc. But I asked my UNcle why he just dosn't get a second job, so he doesn't have to worry about such things. Healthcare is $500/month.

He said it never occured to him!



I can tell you this.. it nevered occured to him, because he spends countless hours with pita, and some other liberal orgs and just assumed when it got worse, big brother would step in and help him. He's been trained to let othwers be responsible for his wellbeing.

I gave him a a Best Buy application and told him Pita won't pay the bills, but 20/hours a week here will! He now has healthcare and recently took me out to dinner!
the Americans I'm referring to do not have the luxury of having employer sponsored healthcare Garrett....or, it's offered but their wages are too low to afford it......

I hope your Aunt and Uncle get well soon....they sound like nice people that deserve good health.....good health trumps everything Garrett.....when I'm sick, or as I've recently endured the illness of my 2 yr old, a BMW is meaningless.....
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      11-01-2007, 09:25 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
I knew Jack and his wife. It's kinda surreal to be in a small local bar seeing them play, and then come and sit down next to you while the next band set's up. Then 6 months later see them on the cover of rolling stones

They were married then, but Meg is HOT!
Jack and Meg share my views Garrett.....they are as liberal as the sun is hot.....

theyve come a long way since the Gold Dollar......
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      11-01-2007, 09:25 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by TESLAASTRO View Post
Garrett, where are you going to get a 2.9% auto loan from a financial institution?.....the best out there now is about 5.5% for a great FICO.....I dont care about your finances Garrett, but unless you put down a shitload of $, youre not getting a 49k car for $560......if you did save up the $ and put it down to keep your payments low, bravo.....but if you saved that money at the expense contributing to an IRA, or contributions to a 401k, or an emergency fund, IMO

Garrett, what makes you "need" a 49k car so bad?....I'm curious......

Your confusing two things, our debate and my finances. I do not fall within the $45 ~ $60k a year income bracket.

But I fail to see why people wouldn't seek other avenues for a lower interest rate. GM and others finance their cars for little... you just have to use that against BMW or other institutions.
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      11-01-2007, 09:34 PM   #122
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the Americans I'm referring to do not have the luxury of having employer sponsored healthcare Garrett....or, it's offered but their wages are too low to afford it......

I hope your Aunt and Uncle get well soon....they sound like nice people that deserve good health.....good health trumps everything Garrett.....when I'm sick, or as I've recently endured the illness of my 2 yr old, a BMW is meaningless.....

/understood.

We both want the same thing, I just want less government in my life so I have more money to spend where I see fit. Churches go a long way to helping the community, and so does 1st hand charity.

People have to learn they need to do it themselves... less, why even get a job? Or think about healthcare... more and more people are becomming to reliant on the government, and their babies will be brought up helpless and thinking "why isn't the government taking care of me..?"

Our taxes will keep going up and up to pay for the increasing reliance of socialized care in thsi country. 100 years from now Hillary Care woud've have created a Socialized country... people will not want to work, just to take care of those who don't work.

Barring medical conditions and wounded... you can aonly help the destitute so long before they need to help thmeselves. How is providing anything free for them a good set of training wheels..?
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      11-01-2007, 09:34 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
Your confusing two things, our debate and my finances. I do not fall within the $45 ~ $60k a year income bracket.

But I fail to see why people wouldn't seek other avenues for a lower interest rate. GM and others finance their cars for little... you just have to use that against BMW or other intitutions.
I suspect that in 3 years, there will be incentives for the 1 series for low interest.....it's just not going to happen yet....our debate was not about you Garrett, as my assumption was not about your income....rather, it was your post that someone earning 45-60k can afford a 30k car.....i will concede that if purchaser lives with mommy and daddy, then yes, it would be affordable with that income......but again, if i was in my 20s living with the folks, I'd have more to worry about than buying a 30k car.....I'd ride a bicycle until i was able to move out.....
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      11-01-2007, 09:38 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
/understood.

We both want the same thing, I just want less government in my life so I have more money to spend where I see fit. Churches go a long way to helping the community, and so does 1st hand charity.

People have to learn they need to do it themselves... less, why even get a job? Or think about healthcare... more and more people are becomming to reliant on the government, and their babies will be brought up helpless and thinking "why isn't the government taking care of me..?"

Our taxes will keep going up and up to pay for the increasing reliance of socialized care in thsi country. 100 years from now Hilary care woud've have created a Socialized country... people will not want to work, just to take care of those who don't work.

Barring medical conditions and wounded... you can aonly help the destitute so long before they need to help thmeselves. How is providing anything free for them a good set of training wheels..?
I'm referring to middle class working Americans who dont have healthcare.....this is an alarming epidemic....these are people caught in the middle.....they earn too much to get help through traditional avenues, but cant afford basic medical.....Garrett, we have the lowest income taxes of all G8 nations....
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      11-01-2007, 10:17 PM   #125
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I just want to pop in and say that this thread has been a thrill to read...I am a political science minor and love to read other peoples opinions on things in the world and specifically in America. Just remember, when the dust settles and the smoke clears, we are all Americans fighting every day to survive.
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      11-01-2007, 10:27 PM   #126
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I dont live with Mom and Dad anymore, I moved in with Uncle Sam. He is a great guy and I would do anything for him, I would go as far to say that I may give my life for the guy. TRUST ME HE IS WORTH IT! I'll be buying (probably leasing it, I will buy one when I am over playin in the sandbox that Uncle Sam likes to take me to) my 135i on 45-60k/yr.

But I am hoping to become a DINK soon and maybe jump a bracket. Man she needs to learn to drive a stick.
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      11-01-2007, 11:09 PM   #127
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But I am hoping to become a DINK soon and maybe jump a bracket. Man she needs to learn to drive a stick.
I too hope to get in this bracket sometime soon. But my girl needs to learn how to drive a stick too. Since the Suby is a lease, why not teach her on that...haha sorry Subaru...I guess I should be saying sorry to her cus learning to drive stick on an AWD Impreza is going to suck. I learned on a Miata, talk about short shifts and nice clutch feel, I miss Miatas! I also think quietly to myself, maybe I should keep the Impreza as a cheap, safe, and capable daily driver and buy a used Miata and build it up, but that would be instead of my 135i :frown:
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      11-01-2007, 11:13 PM   #128
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Yeah I think she will learn the basics on a friends stick, but my 135 will be a lease at first so if she tears it up so be it. She originally was pulling for an auto, but I convinced her it is just sexier to drive a manual.
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      11-01-2007, 11:23 PM   #129
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Hahahaha yes it is. My girlfriend likes to drive trucks so she will have to know how to drive my 135 when I need her truck so thats where the need comes in. And since i have never driven a car with an automatic, there is no question that the 135 will follow suit and require some manual labor to make it move!:wink:
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      11-02-2007, 08:11 AM   #130
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Here's where the argument on how much money you should have to make to buy a BMW moved. How did I miss it?
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      11-02-2007, 08:59 AM   #131
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I too hope to get in this bracket sometime soon. But my girl needs to learn how to drive a stick too. Since the Suby is a lease, why not teach her on that...haha sorry Subaru...I guess I should be saying sorry to her cus learning to drive stick on an AWD Impreza is going to suck. I learned on a Miata, talk about short shifts and nice clutch feel, I miss Miatas! I also think quietly to myself, maybe I should keep the Impreza as a cheap, safe, and capable daily driver and buy a used Miata and build it up, but that would be instead of my 135i :frown:
my wife could barely drive our Pathy, much less a stick.....one more reason why I'm getting auto...the odds of her needing to drive my 135 are slim, but you never know....
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      11-02-2007, 09:01 AM   #132
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I too hope to get in this bracket sometime soon. But my girl needs to learn how to drive a stick too. Since the Suby is a lease, why not teach her on that...haha sorry Subaru...I guess I should be saying sorry to her cus learning to drive stick on an AWD Impreza is going to suck. I learned on a Miata, talk about short shifts and nice clutch feel, I miss Miatas! I also think quietly to myself, maybe I should keep the Impreza as a cheap, safe, and capable daily driver and buy a used Miata and build it up, but that would be instead of my 135i :frown:
theres nothing like that 2nd income.....i remember those days fondly....
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