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      01-08-2009, 08:40 AM   #45
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Cool vid. I wish the audio was more prevalent and he was not flapping his gums so much. Hearing it work would be nice. I don't know that I would like this on. I guess you get used to it but it would be confusing for an ol' shifter like me. I still want to drive one.
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      01-08-2009, 03:12 PM   #46
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if you don't know how to rev match you shouldn't be driving a stick.

it's cool but not necessary like self parking cars....
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      01-08-2009, 05:53 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urbo73 View Post
I don't think of myself as an "extreme purist" - I have driven (and raced) all sorts of cars and transmissions. I simply do not get this or see the point from a driver's point of view. I stated why. I can see Nissan putting it in for the coolness factor, to prevent people from over-revving when downshifting, to protect the tranny/engine in those cases, etc. So it's more of an insurance thing it seems for Nissan + the cool factor. Editors love new things all the time.

My point is that a person who drives a manual, is so used to rev-matching, that this would just get in the way. It would confuse me to NOT hit the gas. I would end up fighting with it. Yes I can turn it OFF, I understand. I just don't get the attraction. Like one guy in the video said though, it's maybe good for learning to drive a manual, but I don't even see that. Because one would be learning the wrong way. So it seems the opposite. So why not just get a DCT or auto? What's next? A manual transmission that also pushes the clutch pedal in and out when it sense your hand on the gear lever? See what I mean? Weird...
I agree with a lot of what your saying but its not a big deal because you dont have to drive with it on. On the track for an inexpirenced driver this would be of great help IMO. I am by no means an expert at heel toe and would just like to try it out before I make a decision on it. I do HATE the Hill assist though. It hate the way it feels its very artificial.

The manual that pushes in the clutch already exists its called SMG/DKG
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      01-08-2009, 07:05 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by Bimmer007 View Post
if you don't know how to rev match you shouldn't be driving a stick.

it's cool but not necessary like self parking cars....
You don't have to know how to heel-and-toe to be able to drive a stick. Rev-matching in everyday driving doesn't require you to simultaneously blip the throttle while braking. It is strictly a racing maneuver. The idea that you can't drive a stick unless you can heel-and-toe is absurd....
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      01-08-2009, 08:54 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majin ssj eric View Post
You don't have to know how to heel-and-toe to be able to drive a stick. Rev-matching in everyday driving doesn't require you to simultaneously blip the throttle while braking. It is strictly a racing maneuver. The idea that you can't drive a stick unless you can heel-and-toe is absurd....
what i said is completely true, i always try to rev match my downshifts and you don't have to do heel toe all the time

this guy even agrees too


it's a nice feature but its just not necessary
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      01-08-2009, 09:07 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majin ssj eric View Post
You don't have to know how to heel-and-toe to be able to drive a stick. Rev-matching in everyday driving doesn't require you to simultaneously blip the throttle while braking. It is strictly a racing maneuver. The idea that you can't drive a stick unless you can heel-and-toe is absurd....
I agree 100%. But you also said this in a previous post:

Quote:
The attraction of the system is that you can always have perfectly rev-matched downshifts without having to even know how to heel-and-toe. I've been driving stick for nearly 13 years and I still can't do it very well. It'd be nice to be able to pull off perfect downshifts every time without worrying about heel-and-toe technique......
So why do you think you can't rev-match correctly w/o heel&toe? Heel&toe or not, you'll rev-match as good as a driver you are. I'm sure you won't do it perhaps as perfectly as a system like this, but who cares? It's STREET driving!!!
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      01-08-2009, 11:28 PM   #51
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A lot of guys slamming SynchroRev on this thread would think this is the greatest thing since the vagina if it was on the M3 or the M5.
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      01-09-2009, 12:23 AM   #52
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A lot of guys slamming SynchroRev on this thread would think this is the greatest thing since the vagina if it was on the M3 or the M5.
If that gimmick was on the M3, I would be driving another car. Period. M3 already has gimmicks like the silly throttle maps, it doesn't need more.
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      01-09-2009, 04:11 AM   #53
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If that gimmick was on the M3, I would be driving another car. Period. M3 already has gimmicks like the silly throttle maps, it doesn't need more.
Tell me you're not being serious. Does the system offend you that much? You would not buy an M3 if it had this feature? Wow, that's somethin.

The system can be defeated with a button. What's not to like about it? That's what I'm trying to figure out. It's simply a convenience, nothing more, nothing less. On the track it's a boon. In daily driving it simplifies things. If you want to have fun, turn it off.

There are zero downsides from what I can see.
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      01-09-2009, 09:41 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by Bimmer Loyalist View Post
Tell me you're not being serious. Does the system offend you that much? You would not buy an M3 if it had this feature? Wow, that's somethin.

The system can be defeated with a button. What's not to like about it? That's what I'm trying to figure out. It's simply a convenience, nothing more, nothing less. On the track it's a boon. In daily driving it simplifies things. If you want to have fun, turn it off.

There are zero downsides from what I can see.
Yes I am serious. I like my cars simple. I got the M3 because I need a 4 door car now for my son, and the Porsche wasn't cutting it. And the M3 is the fastest/sportiest 4 door out there IMO. But it's still a compromise for me. And it still has gimmicks - POWER button with useless throttle maps, Sport SERVOTRONIC which is bad in design and feel, etc. M is changing more to luxury than sport.

The downside is that while YES you can turn it off, it's something that can break and perhaps costly to fix. Simply no need. Learn to drive a manual or don't get one. "On the track it's a boon"?? Why? Because you think you'll be faster since you can't drive properly?
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      01-09-2009, 09:50 AM   #55
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The thing bugging me about this feature is their ad campaign. The game last night was a good example. The spot touted the new Z with "Rev matching technology". What percentage of viewers have a clue what that means? Nissan is needing to move iron, obviously, and they are "reaching" out a bit much for me. Trying to grab boy wanna be racers?

I doubt I would use it but having the option to use or not is fine with me. It just would not be the deciding factor on purchasing the car or not. If it is what the reviews are saying then that's enough for me to want to test it out....the Z that is, not the Rev feature.
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      01-09-2009, 09:55 AM   #56
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The thing bugging me about this feature is their ad campaign. The game last night was a good example. The spot touted the new Z with "Rev matching technology". What percentage of viewers has a clue what that means? Nissan is needing to move iron, obviously, and they are "reaching" out a bit much for me. Trying to grab boy wanna be racers?

I doubt I would use it but having the option to use or not is fine with me. It just would not be the deciding factor on purchasing the car or not. If it is what the reviews are saying then that's enough for me to want to test it out....the Z that is, not the Rev feature.
They must have played that commercial during the BCS game at least 50 damn times. Rev-matching technology..... And you're right. Who is it aimed at? Young people. Wannabe racers is exactly it. All this does IMHO is encourage more street nonsense. If you cannot see this, then you need glasses..
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      01-09-2009, 04:59 PM   #57
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Yes I am serious. I like my cars simple. I got the M3 because I need a 4 door car now for my son, and the Porsche wasn't cutting it. And the M3 is the fastest/sportiest 4 door out there IMO. But it's still a compromise for me. And it still has gimmicks - POWER button with useless throttle maps, Sport SERVOTRONIC which is bad in design and feel, etc. M is changing more to luxury than sport.
Yes, those are unnecessary, but that's not what we're talking about.
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The downside is that while YES you can turn it off, it's something that can break and perhaps costly to fix. Simply no need. Learn to drive a manual or don't get one. "On the track it's a boon"?? Why? Because you think you'll be faster since you can't drive properly?
No, it won't be costly to fix. It's just the ECU blipping the throttle. I guess if the computer breaks you're fucked, but then again, I don't see that happening because Nissan would be screwed big time.

And yes, it's a boon. You can focus on braking, steering, and perfecting your line instead. That's not even arguable. And is that last statement directed at me? I sure as hell can drive a manual. I learned on a 300Z (and 300ZX). Took one afternoon. There's nothing hard about driving a manual. It doesn't make you a better driver. You're just retarded if you can't drive one.
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      01-09-2009, 05:00 PM   #58
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And wow, I'm surprised that you wouldn't buy an M3 if it had this feature.
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      01-09-2009, 05:38 PM   #59
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And wow, I'm surprised that you wouldn't buy an M3 if it had this feature.
If you read my post you wouldn't be. The less electronics the better, unless they serve a useful purpose for me. This doesn't. So it would add. I prefer cars that don't just use technology for the sake of technology or to promote street racing - because face it, that's where most buyers of this car will be - on the street trying out the cool auto rev-matching on downshifts.

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Yes, those are unnecessary, but that's not what we're talking about.
It's what I'm talking about. Enough gimmicks that do nothing to really help driving but enforce people to want to perhaps engage in street nonsense. "Look I can get into Sport+ with my M button and have a really useless throttle map that will make driving really jerky and noisy." "Look I can press this button and get perfect rev-matching on downshifts, which will sound totally cool, but I'll have to remember to forget that I need to blip the throttle myself when in this mode.."

Quote:
No, it won't be costly to fix. It's just the ECU blipping the throttle. I guess if the computer breaks you're fucked, but then again, I don't see that happening because Nissan would be screwed big time.
Not sure about this one. This is like a really poor man's DCT..Half-way there..DCT is one thing, 6MT another, this....marketing.

Quote:
And yes, it's a boon. You can focus on braking, steering, and perfecting your line instead. That's not even arguable. And is that last statement directed at me? I sure as hell can drive a manual. I learned on a 300Z (and 300ZX). Took one afternoon. There's nothing hard about driving a manual. It doesn't make you a better driver. You're just retarded if you can't drive one.
It's not directed at you - just in general. Who is the target audience for this car - see the comments regarding the commercial during the BCS game last night? How many of these customers will be really racing their cars on the track to possibly even take advantage of this and how many will just be loud and obnoxious on the street? And if so, how many will easily have to forget how a manual is driven once this mode is engaged (which is a reflex at that point and not easy to do - tell yourself NOT to blip when downshifting that is)? This is what I'm talking about.
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      01-09-2009, 05:55 PM   #60
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Cool

urbo73, are you a big fan of Lotus cars then?
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      01-09-2009, 06:03 PM   #61
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My question is... what's the point?

So lame douche-bags that can't heel-toe for themselves can pretend they can?


Don't get me wrong.... This is coming from a Nissan Z Car guy.
i think it's a very cool technology and i would totally dig it. on top of that, you can turn it off for those "pure racers (or wannabe's)" to do your own.

unless you are a pro, i dont think most can rev match (or shift or anything) better than a computer so why not? and calling people who can't heel-toe douche-bags just make you look like one.

i drive a manual, i'm a big z car fan, but i also dig new/useful technologies like this. no need to hate.. if u dont like it dont buy it or turn it off if it's in your car.
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      01-09-2009, 06:20 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urbo73 View Post
If you read my post you wouldn't be. The less electronics the better, unless they serve a useful purpose for me. This doesn't. So it would add. I prefer cars that don't just use technology for the sake of technology or to promote street racing - because face it, that's where most buyers of this car will be - on the street trying out the cool auto rev-matching on downshifts.



It's what I'm talking about. Enough gimmicks that do nothing to really help driving but enforce people to want to perhaps engage in street nonsense. "Look I can get into Sport+ with my M button and have a really useless throttle map that will make driving really jerky and noisy." "Look I can press this button and get perfect rev-matching on downshifts, which will sound totally cool, but I'll have to remember to forget that I need to blip the throttle myself when in this mode.."



Not sure about this one. This is like a really poor man's DCT..Half-way there..DCT is one thing, 6MT another, this....marketing.



It's not directed at you - just in general. Who is the target audience for this car - see the comments regarding the commercial during the BCS game last night? How many of these customers will be really racing their cars on the track to possibly even take advantage of this and how many will just be loud and obnoxious on the street? And if so, how many will easily have to forget how a manual is driven once this mode is engaged (which is a reflex at that point and not easy to do - tell yourself NOT to blip when downshifting that is)? This is what I'm talking about.
Ok, I see your points, but all I'm saying is that there's really no downside to the system, and it's entirely unobtrusive. It could be a button that you would never have to touch. It doesn't add weight. It doesn't really do anything except ease things. Even then, if you don't want the assistance, don't mess with it.

If there are people out there that don't know how to or don't want to match revs during daily driving, then this is perfect for them.

Matching revs doesn't mean every guy who gets this is gonna be doing rapid succession downshifts or 5th-2nd downshifts every second. It could be as simple as letting you use your right foot solely for braking in normal traffic while the system manages the revs. I think it's brilliant.

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unless you are a pro, i dont think most can rev match (or shift or anything) better than a computer so why not?
Nobody can rev match as well as the computer. At best, a throttle blip is an educated guess by the driver. This computer matches the revs perfectly and consistently.
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      01-09-2009, 06:53 PM   #63
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urbo73, are you a big fan of Lotus cars then?
I like the Exige a lot, but it's not practical at all outside the track. And since I don't have enough money to own 2 cars (one for DD and one for fun), I have to make a compromise. For now I have the M3 sedan, which IMO is the best there is in its class. I need it for my son, as I refuse to drive my wife's Acura RDX when we travel. I grew up driving light cars, then racing Formula Fords in SCCA, etc. So that's just what I like - light, simple, etc. But those days are over, I'm married with a 16 month old now. I'll keep the M3 until he's about 4, at which point I'll most likely get a Porsche again (I had 2 before), since I can drive them all year round on streets, and on the track, and fit him in the back seat since he'll be a bit older and getting in/out won't require 4 doors anymore. If I was very rich, I'd get the Turbo, but I'm not. I'll probably get the C2S. Mid-engine, RWD cars (that are in my price range) like the Exige, Cayman, just have no room for more than 2. 911 is the only solution and I like them (with all their quirks, etc.). Life is always some sort of compromise, no?
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      01-09-2009, 07:03 PM   #64
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Ok, I see your points, but all I'm saying is that there's really no downside to the system, and it's entirely unobtrusive. It could be a button that you would never have to touch. It doesn't add weight. It doesn't really do anything except ease things. Even then, if you don't want the assistance, don't mess with it.
I understand what you say, I just don't like how Nissan is pushing/promoting this thing, that's all. If BMW was doing the same, I'd not like it either. Maybe I'm weird, don't know. Keep things simple. As you said too, it's not rocket science to learn to drive a manual if you want to. And you certainly don't need perfectly rev-matched downshifts in DD driving on the streets.
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      01-09-2009, 07:17 PM   #65
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It blips when you disengage the clutch.
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      01-09-2009, 07:25 PM   #66
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It blips when you disengage the clutch.
lol, the answer to a question nobody asked?
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