BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Track / Autocross / Dragstrip / Driving Techniques
 
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-15-2008, 01:05 AM   #1
Fiebrudo
Private
United_States
1
Rep
52
Posts

 
Drives: M3 Convertible Space Gray E93
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: STL

iTrader: (0)

Track days and M3 e93 vert

BMW CCA believes it is UNSAFE!!!! and won't allow an e93 unless you add a roll cage!!!!!

Unbelievable!

Where can I go, Porsche CCA (apparently they allow Boxters and 911 verts (I guess Porsche does stand behind the safety of their cars!) Any other alternatives?

Thanks
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2008, 08:02 AM   #2
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiebrudo View Post
BMW CCA believes it is UNSAFE!!!! and won't allow an e93 unless you add a roll cage!!!!!

Unbelievable!

Where can I go, Porsche CCA (apparently they allow Boxters and 911 verts (I guess Porsche does stand behind the safety of their cars!) Any other alternatives?

Thanks
Buy a coupe
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2008, 08:04 AM   #3
youyou
Banned
youyou's Avatar
Canada
38
Rep
2,453
Posts

 
Drives: Porsche 997 C4S
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Go cruising and fill the car up with chicks!
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2008, 09:07 AM   #4
Big Windy
Major General
Big Windy's Avatar
United_States
71
Rep
5,118
Posts

 
Drives: audi s4
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: seatac, wa

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
That is a bit surprising. I haven't looked at crash ratings, but I wonder how the vert top holds up against the CF or moonroof tops in a roll over.
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2008, 11:42 AM   #5
kmac1980
Major
16
Rep
1,025
Posts

 
Drives: '11 535xi, (former '08 M3)
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: toronto

iTrader: (1)

its not as strong in a rollover im sure, but the windshield A pillars are reinforced, as well as there are popup roll bars behind each rear seat headrest (the black pieces) that deploy in a roll over....
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2008, 11:51 AM   #6
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Windy View Post
That is a bit surprising. I haven't looked at crash ratings, but I wonder how the vert top holds up against the CF or moonroof tops in a roll over.
I saw a video of a M-B Sl or SLK with the retractable roof rolling on the Autobaun and the roof came off the car in the 1st impact on the roof.I am pretty sure that the coupe would fare much better whether it has the CF or S/R than the cab.I have refused to instruct in open top cars at track days that have permitted them to run at.
Appreciate 0
      01-05-2009, 10:48 PM   #7
guarnibl
Private First Class
4
Rep
155
Posts

 
Drives: Depends on the day.
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Scottsdale, AZ

iTrader: (0)

boo!!!!!!!!!!!
__________________
2014 F12 M6 Cabrio (stock for now)
2013 Boss 302 Mustang - Whipple - 600 rwhp
2014 Ram 2500 Diesel - Edge Tuned on 37's
2009 Jeep Wrangler on 42's, LS7, Custom Baja Cage
2014 Grand Cherokee (wife's dd)

Last edited by guarnibl; 01-08-2009 at 05:37 PM.
Appreciate 0
      01-06-2009, 03:53 AM   #8
FStop7
I like cars
FStop7's Avatar
Vatican City State
98
Rep
5,059
Posts

 
Drives: M6
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Newbury Park, CA

iTrader: (3)

Most HPDEs don't allow convertibles without full roll bars any more. Don't blame the organizers, blame their insurance. If they could have you participate as-is of course they would, they want as many cars as they can get.

Quote:
(I guess Porsche does stand behind the safety of their cars!)
What is that supposed to mean? BMWCCA != BMW

Your best hope is that they'll make an exception for the 3 series since it's a hard top vert.
Appreciate 0
      01-08-2009, 08:42 AM   #9
Feffman
Banned
United_States
3
Rep
337
Posts

 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Gateway To The West

iTrader: (0)

We (www.MVPTrackTime.com) allow some convertibles without roll bars at tracks that allow it, but said convertibles must have the pop-up protection, a hard top or a note in the owners manual describing the front windshield frame as "rollover protection". The only two cars I know of with this note in the owners manual are the Honda S2000 and Porsche Boxster. Of course we highly recommend a roll bar!

This being noted, several tracks are restricting us on this and I think it's only a matter of time before all tracks mandate roll bars in all convertibles. Personally I think it's a good idea to have a roll bar in any convertible you plan to track.

Call me at (314) 249-3770 if you need clarification.

Feff

Last edited by Feffman; 01-31-2009 at 02:12 PM.
Appreciate 0
      01-08-2009, 09:36 AM   #10
consolidated
Lieutenant Colonel
consolidated's Avatar
39
Rep
1,747
Posts

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Texas

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Most DEs will allow verts with integrated hoops at the seat, look at the Boxster, S2000 and other sport verts and they have a hidden steel hoop around the back of each seat. I've seen cars flip on the track, you don't want to risk being pancaked like that, not to mention the instructor in the right seat.
Appreciate 0
      01-08-2009, 09:46 AM   #11
JJM335
Second Lieutenant
United_States
2
Rep
228
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E92 M3
Join Date: May 2007
Location: GA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 E92 M3  [0.00]
The BMWCCA does not allow convertibles of any kind (without specific modifications) due to insurance reasons. They had an incident a while back where an instructor was injured in a vert.
Appreciate 0
      01-29-2009, 11:46 PM   #12
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

I happened to run across that clip of the SL rolling and the roof coming off.

Appreciate 0
      01-30-2009, 12:08 AM   #13
SlammedR8
Brigadier General
SlammedR8's Avatar
Canada
121
Rep
4,937
Posts

 
Drives: 2010 Audi R8 V10 +2013 Audi S4
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (2)

Send a message via MSN to SlammedR8
heres a video to watch
http://www.youtube.com/v/croBCxHmQUc&hl=
Ouch!
__________________
2010 Audi R8 V10 Coupe 6MT-White on Red
GMG Exhaust | H&R Springs | H&R Spacers | Carbonio Intake | UniTronic ECU Upgrade| 15% Tints/50% Windshield|LED License Plate
2013 Range Rover Sport-Black on Black
Stock with 15% Tint & 50% Windshield
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2009, 05:23 PM   #14
aus
Major General
119
Rep
7,423
Posts

 
Drives: Odysse
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seal Beach, CA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by slammedm3 View Post
heres a video to watch
http://www.youtube.com/v/croBCxHmQUc&hl=
Ouch!
Why were people aplauding in that vid?
__________________
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
Appreciate 0
      01-30-2009, 05:25 PM   #15
aus
Major General
119
Rep
7,423
Posts

 
Drives: Odysse
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seal Beach, CA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
I happened to run across that clip of the SL rolling and the roof coming off.

Looks like the dude was able to stumble away on the passenger side.
__________________
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2009, 01:14 PM   #16
Kev
Resident Anesthesiologist
Kev's Avatar
Hong Kong
180
Rep
8,815
Posts

 
Drives: VW bug with a misplaced engine
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (24)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
Looks like the dude was able to stumble away on the passenger side.
Thanks to the auto deploy roll bar in the SL. It's one of the coolest features of the car. It might look big and ugly, but it'll save your head when the car rolls.
__________________
kev { divinum est sedate dolorem }
Appreciate 0
      01-31-2009, 02:14 PM   #17
Feffman
Banned
United_States
3
Rep
337
Posts

 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Gateway To The West

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev View Post
Thanks to the auto deploy roll bar in the SL. It's one of the coolest features of the car. It might look big and ugly, but it'll save your head when the car rolls.
Summit Point just changed its rules on convertibles, BUT they allow convertibles with the pop-up type systems.

Feff
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2009, 02:18 PM   #18
m3larson
First Lieutenant
United_States
9
Rep
301
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 Cayenne S 1997 M3 Track C
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ

iTrader: (0)

Nasa will let you attend HPDE1 with a Vert. There was a 911 with the top down running with me.
__________________
The Verdict: Every other manufacturer should give up on building their own cars and just make M3s instead. -Car and Driver June 2008
Appreciate 0
      02-02-2009, 06:28 PM   #19
signes
Brigadier General
signes's Avatar
United_States
63
Rep
4,214
Posts

 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spinnin at 8k

iTrader: (3)

Hardtop verts are only marginally safer than cloth tops, which is to say you would be nuts to go flat out on a track in a vert without a cage. Yes, its frustrating but it is unsafe any other way.
Appreciate 0
      02-22-2009, 11:18 PM   #20
DBD777
New Member
0
Rep
20
Posts

 
Drives: 2007 328 vert, E36 &46 M3's
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Louisville Ky

iTrader: (0)

I've run at Putnam and VIR with my E46 vert with the hard top installed. Had to run with the PCA since the BMW club will not allow verts. Its fun outrunning all of the 911's (except the highly modded or GT3's) and I have always been welcomed. Get in touch with the local PCA and see what they say. I have seen numerous 911 cabs running with open tops. Of course it is not as safe as a coupe, but don't see many roll overs. I debated getting a bolt in roll bar to pass the broom stick test but have now opted to go with a dedicated E36 M3 track car. Less worry on breakdowns and if the worse should happen and your insurance does not want to pay, you not out as much money. Good luck.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:24 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST