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      11-22-2008, 06:32 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serven7 View Post
Absolutely agree.



Look at the S85 stroker Dinans produces much less hp/tq, also go over to M5board and see how many of them are still running problem free. Dinan has so many broken ones there is a waiting list to have it sent back there



do tell more.



Bankrupt! Dinans fighting for its life right now.
I check M5board all the time, I saw a dyno of the Dinan motor and it put down very solid numbers. I have not seen an RDsport V10 stroker dyno so we have no idea which one makes more power. Crank figures don't matter, all I know is the majority of those guys go the Dinan route.

The RDsport 335 tune was not impressive at all, very weak. That is not to say it is not a good tune, it just does not make big power. I would want to see dyno numbers before buying into claimed figures.

Bankrupt? Strong claim, considering how much money they make on their overpriced parts, I don't think that is the case.
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      11-22-2008, 07:41 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
I check M5board all the time, I saw a dyno of the Dinan motor and it put down very solid numbers. I have not seen an RDsport V10 stroker dyno so we have no idea which one makes more power. Crank figures don't matter, all I know is the majority of those guys go the Dinan route..
Then you know Dallas and the others that are having stock M5s beat them and you also know he had to send his car back to Dinan where it is now(i think)

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Darren Dallas Starting a few days after the video in the beginning of this thread I started having sluggish performance again.

I have dyno'd the car and it's very much down on power. I ran against a friend of mine in a stock SL65 and lost to him in the same manner as my modded 2006 M5 with bolt-ons.

In addition, I ran against the same stock M5 in the video at the beginning of this thread and now I'm only 1-1.5 car lengths ahead of him. Looks like I'm back to square "1" again.

I dyno'd the car last week and only put out 457 rwhp on a dynojet and the next day tried a dynodynamics with the result of only 399 rwhp.

I've recorded numerous data logs using Autoenginuity software and capturing ODB-II data and passed it along to Dinan. They don't have any answers or possible solutions for me yet. Their first response was "ship the car to us in California".

Not really an acceptable answer in my book as I would hope they would provide some basic troubleshooting steps to my dealer (i.e. - replace MAF sensors, replace throttle bodies, etc.).

Ironically, I called another Dinan installer on the east coast and they thought it sounded like a MAF sensor issue so I had both replaced today and all the adaptations cleared. It has not made a difference at all.

This is why you've not seen much from me over the past 2 weeks as I've been trying to figure out what's going on with my car. Sorry for not keeping up with the requests for dyno info and videos, but I've not had very much good results here lately.

I fully believe, and expect, Dinan will come through with flying colors. I just hope they provide some basic troubleshooting steps before we jump to the most radical next step...such as shipping my car (of course then we'll need to discuss who's responsible for shipping costs at that point).

I'll let everyone know of my progress. Keep your fingers crossed for me.

Regards,
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The RDsport 335 tune was not impressive at all, very weak. That is not to say it is not a good tune, it just does not make big power. I would want to see dyno numbers before buying into claimed figures..
I have never seen one so I cant comment.

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Bankrupt? Strong claim, considering how much money they make on their overpriced parts, I don't think that is the case.
overpriced parts haha thats funny. We will just have to wait to see but ND54 is right about their finance guy pulling chalks.
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      11-22-2008, 08:33 PM   #25
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http://ca.news.finance.yahoo.com/s/1...ire-dinan.html
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      11-22-2008, 09:47 PM   #26
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Interesting for sure, I wonder what changed or is it just the economy overall

Dec 10th maybe we'll know more
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      11-24-2008, 01:07 AM   #27
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I am not sure where you guys get the gossip but Dinan is still going public next year when the financial climate gets better.
Hahahahah
That has to be the most optimistic economic forecasting I've heard since January. Good luck on that tho...
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      11-24-2008, 09:01 AM   #28
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      11-24-2008, 11:49 AM   #29
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Hahahahah
That has to be the most optimistic economic forecasting I've heard since January. Good luck on that tho...
Hahaha!! Agreed!! But whatever the case, I think everyone is struggling now and also don´t think Dinan (or some of the other major tunners) are going to disappear anytime soon. I choose between these tunners by analyzing what they provide and at what price as I am convinced both will deliver quality products (Dallas I think is an exception, these things happen and am sure Dinan will fix it). I´ve seen a number of review´s and Bimmer Magazin, Eurocar Magazine and MLE magazine and they all love the Dinan M6 V10 project and have also read reviews on RDSport and find no complaints!!

IMO opinion I chose to go with the RDSport rebuild because I think they offer a package that is a tad more powerful (which is the norm), more value for the $$$ and just as reliable. I also own a 380bhp Dinan 335 that I find very pleasing and have tested the RDSport 335 and found it just as pleasing but with a tad more power as well.

Chose who you like and think will suit you best!!!!
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      11-24-2008, 01:25 PM   #30
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Any mention of a supercharger for the E9x?
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      11-24-2008, 01:31 PM   #31
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Any mention of a supercharger for the E9x?
Nop, not from either of Dinan or RDSport. But we do know a number of other tunners are working on SC kits! They also mostly said they would have them out by now and have fallen behind considerably. GPower of course has there´s out but is uber $$$$!
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      11-24-2008, 02:38 PM   #32
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Being first to market might not be the ultimate goal for a tuner. It is possible that some tuners would rather spend the extra time testing their product before releasing it. I am not saying that Dinan does or does not do that as I don't know the details of how much testing these tuners do exactly with significant drivetrain mods before releasing them for purchase.

Having said that, has RDSport performed this mod on their own car first? There was mention of a car running in Italy with the kit, but it wasn't clear if it was their or a customer's car.
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      11-24-2008, 04:13 PM   #33
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Being first to market might not be the ultimate goal for a tuner. It is possible that some tuners would rather spend the extra time testing their product before releasing it. I am not saying that Dinan does or does not do that as I don't know the details of how much testing these tuners do exactly with significant drivetrain mods before releasing them for purchase.

Having said that, has RDSport performed this mod on their own car first? There was mention of a car running in Italy with the kit, but it wasn't clear if it was their or a customer's car.
Very true, most do test their cars however in this case, both Dinan and RDSport completed 90% of the real R&D when developing the stoker kit for the S85 V10 that is an identical engine in all respects other than the throw that is 90 degrees for the V8 rather than 72 degrees for the V10 (and of course two less cylinders). Clearly crank has to be a tad different but boring of the cylinders with technology that does not damage the silicone crystal wall, pistons, rings, con rods, bearings, valve changes, knife edging of the crank/piston assembly, reciprocating mass issues and the like are identical. Some work must be performed on headers (RDSport only) and thing one might want to add this time around.
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      11-24-2008, 07:59 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Very true, most do test their cars however in this case, both Dinan and RDSport completed 90% of the real R&D when developing the stoker kit for the S85 V10 that is an identical engine in all respects other than the throw that is 90 degrees for the V8 rather than 72 degrees for the V10 (and of course two less cylinders). Clearly crank has to be a tad different but boring of the cylinders with technology that does not damage the silicone crystal wall, pistons, rings, con rods, bearings, valve changes, knife edging of the crank/piston assembly, reciprocating mass issues and the like are identical. Some work must be performed on headers (RDSport only) and thing one might want to add this time around.
72 degrees is traditional for v10's but not for the M5's S85, it is 90 degrees, the same as the v8.

"To achieve this in the E60 M5, M Division opted to use the same displacement but fitted into a 90* aluminum V10, which yields a more optimal per cylinder displacement and piston dimensions. A 90* design was chosen over a 72* V angle because of its more favorable vibration characteristics."
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      11-24-2008, 08:43 PM   #35
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72 degrees is traditional for v10's but not for the M5's S85, it is 90 degrees, the same as the v8.

"To achieve this in the E60 M5, M Division opted to use the same displacement but fitted into a 90* aluminum V10, which yields a more optimal per cylinder displacement and piston dimensions. A 90* design was chosen over a 72* V angle because of its more favorable vibration characteristics."
My bad, it is 90 degrees on both S85 V10 and S65 V8, only two cylinders less.
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      11-25-2008, 02:15 AM   #36
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Quote:
Darren Dallas on M5Post regarding his Dinan M5 Hey folks, here's a quick update. The car is at Dinan's facility still. They've had it for 2 weeks so far. They'll probably have it for a 2-3 more weeks, hopefully not much more. The root cause of the lack of power is unknown at this point and Dinan has assured me they are working on it.

I wish I had more, but I haven't received my email update from Steve Dinan yet on what has been completed to-date. I hope to receive that soon, but he has been traveling and is very busy.

In addition to the power loss, there was a cat failure which ended up depositing tiny pieces into the engine (during the scavenging phase of the duty cycle) cylinder and valve seat. The cause of the cat breakdown is unknown at this time as well.

More questions than answers right now. Now you're in the same boat as me . Stay tuned...

SBM6's car does not have a cat failure, but is still down on power. We believe once we figure out the cause of the power loss on my car, we'll have it figured out for both, therefore Dinan is focusing on my car first at this point. SBM6 removed the headers (we both had the same headers from a tuner/shop in Atlanta) and now has stock headers on his car but is still down on power.

Regards,

Darren
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Tiny pieces deposited into the engine probably means engine damage? Damn! Sorry to hear this. Keep us updated.

Darren Dallas
Yes it does. Already been identified. The engine will now be a 5.8L because of the deposits.
For those of you who dont follow M5Post this is one of two Dinan S85 stroked motors on the site. The other isnt working either

Yea hes got a warranty but he doesnt have a car.
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      11-25-2008, 04:18 AM   #37
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For those of you who dont follow M5Post this is one of two Dinan S85 stroked motors on the site. The other isnt working either

Yea hes got a warranty but he doesnt have a car.
That is what happen when you are the first to line up and get it. Can't wait until we have more answers.
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      11-25-2008, 08:39 AM   #38
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That is what happen when you are the first to line up and get it. Can't wait until we have more answers.
So you then ought to be pleased you are not one of the first to get this stroker engine, but some of us clearly do not have those issues. I think you´ve made your point Sticky, no problem!! But again, we obviously feel comfortable doing these modifications today.
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      11-25-2008, 11:16 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Very true, most do test their cars however in this case, both Dinan and RDSport completed 90% of the real R&D when developing the stoker kit for the S85 V10 that is an identical engine in all respects other than the throw that is 90 degrees for the V8 rather than 72 degrees for the V10 (and of course two less cylinders). Clearly crank has to be a tad different but boring of the cylinders with technology that does not damage the silicone crystal wall, pistons, rings, con rods, bearings, valve changes, knife edging of the crank/piston assembly, reciprocating mass issues and the like are identical. Some work must be performed on headers (RDSport only) and thing one might want to add this time around.
I'd be rather cautious with buying a significant drivetrain mod without seeing it run on the vendor's test car first. If the vendor does not have a test car and/or cannot articulate what kind of testing has been performed, I'd much rather wait to see how things fall out with customer cars in the mid-term. But that's just the skeptic in me, and I understand others might think differently.

The fact that most of the R&D has been done on a similar mod for another car sure helps, but the thing is not working until it's really working.
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      11-25-2008, 11:26 AM   #40
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I'd be rather cautious with buying a significant drivetrain mod without seeing it run on the vendor's test car first. If the vendor does not have a test car and/or cannot articulate what kind of testing has been performed, I'd much rather wait to see how things fall out with customer cars in the mid-term. But that's just the skeptic in me, and I understand others might think differently.

The fact that most of the R&D has been done on a similar mod for another car sure helps, but the thing is not working until it's really working.
Yea agreed, only thing here is that I just can´t wait several more months to get the product. Its way too long for me!!! Hahaha!! Also, this is not the first time I do a "first time" mod of this nature on a vehicle/engine and enjoy the hell out of the process particularly when you can have some input on the development and where things go. There are of course some risks such as delays and maybe even having to send the car back as happend with the Dinan V10 and has happend to me on other occasions. What I can say is that the risk of the mod not working is zero, they will make it work (Dinan will figure out what happened to that V10 and resolve it entirely). Hell I´d be doing this stuff myself if I had the time and the facility!!!!!
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      11-25-2008, 11:32 AM   #41
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Yea agreed, only thing here is that I just can´t wait several more months to get the product. Its way too long for me!!!
Yeah, that's why you are the mod king of the forum!
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      11-25-2008, 12:13 PM   #42
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A day late and a buck short, Dinan is far behind the power curve. All the above listed have been done.
Thanks for the helpful post.
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      11-25-2008, 12:28 PM   #43
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My bad, it is 90 degrees on both S85 V10 and S65 V8, only two cylinders less.
Not bad. You were right. The crank throws on the V10 are 72 degrees apart. The cylinder bank angle is 90 degrees.
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      11-25-2008, 12:56 PM   #44
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Not bad. You were right. The crank throws on the V10 are 72 degrees apart. The cylinder bank angle is 90 degrees.
Yea I thought that was the case, did say throws! Thanks!!

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Yeah, that's why you are the mod king of the forum!
Hahaha!! There you go!!
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