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      09-23-2008, 09:50 AM   #45
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Competition?
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      09-23-2008, 12:46 PM   #46
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It is in comparison to the M3. The 335i just happens to perform better than expected. The new S4 will only be 3 tenths slower to 60 on paper than the M3, not to mention the quattro AWD system is phenomenal, especially here in the Northeast.

Audi is positioning this car perfectly, as a Sedan alternative to the S5, just like the E90 M3 to the E92. IMO, you fanboys who think that the S4 will be no match for the M3 need to open your eyes.
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      09-23-2008, 12:52 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgorman13 View Post
It is in comparison to the M3. The 335i just happens to perform better than expected. The new S4 will only be 3 tenths slower to 60 on paper than the M3, not to mention the quattro AWD system is phenomenal, especially here in the Northeast.

Audi is positioning this car perfectly, as a Sedan alternative to the S5, just like the E90 M3 to the E92. IMO, you fanboys who think that the S4 will be no match for the M3 need to open your eyes.
i rarely agree with the fanboys of this site but i will have to admit i doubt the new s4 will give the m3 a hard time, now the new rs4 will have a better chance
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      09-23-2008, 02:10 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgorman13 View Post
It is in comparison to the M3. The 335i just happens to perform better than expected. The new S4 will only be 3 tenths slower to 60 on paper than the M3, not to mention the quattro AWD system is phenomenal, especially here in the Northeast.

Audi is positioning this car perfectly, as a Sedan alternative to the S5, just like the E90 M3 to the E92. IMO, you fanboys who think that the S4 will be no match for the M3 need to open your eyes.
I just don't see the people paying that price, that's all.
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      09-23-2008, 04:32 PM   #49
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Hmmm. I would have expected more power.

I like the car otherwise, but I think it should come packing 380 or so from the factory. In my mind, it needs to be able to soundly outperform the 335i, and at least hold a candle to the C63 and M3 to be priced in the 50s.

It'll be cheaper than the M3, or C63, so I can see it being a bit down on power to those, but it looks like its Power/Weight will be worse than the 335i? And this is before BMW releases the 355hp unit for the M135i and 335tii.
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      09-23-2008, 09:14 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgorman13 View Post
It is in comparison to the M3. The 335i just happens to perform better than expected. The new S4 will only be 3 tenths slower to 60 on paper than the M3, not to mention the quattro AWD system is phenomenal, especially here in the Northeast.

Audi is positioning this car perfectly, as a Sedan alternative to the S5, just like the E90 M3 to the E92. IMO, you fanboys who think that the S4 will be no match for the M3 need to open your eyes.
I love the s4, but it really can not compare performance wise to the m3 or is-f or the c63 amg. As you said this is the alternative to the s5, and the s5 traps at ~105mph in the 1/4mile. The power figures from the s4 (333hp,325t) and s5 (354hp,325t) are very close, but the new s4 has the advantage of getting 25mpg. The m3, c63, is-f traps at ~114. Thats a BIG difference.

Also, the price with the upgraded DSG, which is something I am really looking forward to, will price this s4 close to the starting price of around 50-55k. The same as the starting msrp of M3, c63, is-f. I would love to get this car, but I don't want to be paying m3 prices while getting a stock to slightly modded 335i's performance.

I hope I am wrong and this car can trap around 108 and I will be happy paying more for the DSG, interior, and styling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iatacs19 View Post
Very nice car, but the corporate/marketing execution is out of touch with reality.

If the S4 sedan will start @ $49k then it's doomed before it even starts selling.

S4 seems more of a direct competitor to the 335i than M3...

The supposed RS4 is priced even above the M3...

WTF is Audi thinking???
I agree with you. Audi stop overpricing your vehicles or make them perform to similar competitor's vehicles
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      09-23-2008, 09:25 PM   #51
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One big question mark in the bang/buck department is tunability.
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      09-23-2008, 09:34 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by late_boomer View Post
I love the s4, but it really can not compare performance wise to the m3 or is-f or the c63 amg. As you said this is the alternative to the s5, and the s5 traps at ~105mph in the 1/4mile. The power figures from the s4 (333hp,325t) and s5 (354hp,325t) are very close, but the new s4 has the advantage of getting 25mpg. The m3, c63, is-f traps at ~114. Thats a BIG difference.

Also, the price with the upgraded DSG, which is something I am really looking forward to, will price this s4 close to the starting price of around 50-55k. The same as the starting msrp of M3, c63, is-f. I would love to get this car, but I don't want to be paying m3 prices while getting a stock to slightly modded 335i's performance.

I hope I am wrong and this car can trap around 108 and I will be happy paying more for the DSG, interior, and styling.



I agree with you. Audi stop overpricing your vehicles or make them perform to similar competitor's vehicles
It seems like this new turbo'd S4 will still be too slow and too expensive. Unless Audi also underrates their cars (but I doubt is since they're AWD) like BMW, 0-60mph in 5.1 sec. (and 1/4 mi. in what? ~ 13.7sec. @ 104mph???) is still slower than a stock 335i; never mind a tuned 335i. So, you're paying a lot more for the high performance version...so, exactly what is the "S" (in S4, S5, etc.) for again?
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      09-23-2008, 11:01 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by late_boomer View Post
I love the s4, but it really can not compare performance wise to the m3 or is-f or the c63 amg. As you said this is the alternative to the s5, and the s5 traps at ~105mph in the 1/4mile. The power figures from the s4 (333hp,325t) and s5 (354hp,325t) are very close, but the new s4 has the advantage of getting 25mpg. The m3, c63, is-f traps at ~114. Thats a BIG difference.

Also, the price with the upgraded DSG, which is something I am really looking forward to, will price this s4 close to the starting price of around 50-55k. The same as the starting msrp of M3, c63, is-f. I would love to get this car, but I don't want to be paying m3 prices while getting a stock to slightly modded 335i's performance.

I hope I am wrong and this car can trap around 108 and I will be happy paying more for the DSG, interior, and styling.



I agree with you. Audi stop overpricing your vehicles or make them perform to similar competitor's vehicles

Wow, Audi doesnt overprice their vehicles last i checked. In fact a comparably equipped A4 tends to undercut its BMW 3 series competitor. Granted, its a turbo I4, but dont start with that Audi overpricing. Not to mention if the new S4 comes in at 48K which is where the current one is, a loaded one will be about 55K, which is the start of all these other cars (m3, IS-F, C63), all of which come with less standard features.

Just throwing that out there.
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      09-24-2008, 02:08 AM   #54
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Is it really a competitor to the M3............ NO. But only in terms of outright acceleration and here are the reasons why I am saying this.

After owning an S5 and now driving an M3 I can tell you that on the road their respective performance in the corners are very similar, the M3 has better front end grip but the S5 had better exit speed, swings and roundabouts. Yes the M3 will destroy it on the straights but this is less of an issue off the track.

Second, the A4's chassis is better balanced than the A5, slightly longer wheelbase and better weight balance, as a result of this the A4 3.2Quattro with only 265hp is actually quicker on Hockenheim and by almost a second ahead of the S5 and nearly a second and a half ahead of the 335i. Now though this still places the M3 ahead by more than a second and a half ahead of the A4 3.2Quattro the chances are with Audi retuning the suspension, adding 70hp, fitting 7 gears and dual clutch plus including the new Quattro Sport diff that the S4 will be very close indeed to what the M3 achieved.

Sure it's not going to be as quick in acceleration and it will not get to close to the M3's time on the ring as it's a power track but on the public roads I would place the S4 very close to the M3 in capability.
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      09-24-2008, 03:14 AM   #55
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it's nice, but imho after a short period time it'll look pretty meh (like the s5)
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      09-24-2008, 04:14 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
Is it really a competitor to the M3............ NO. But only in terms of outright acceleration and here are the reasons why I am saying this.

After owning an S5 and now driving an M3 I can tell you that on the road their respective performance in the corners are very similar, the M3 has better front end grip but the S5 had better exit speed, swings and roundabouts. Yes the M3 will destroy it on the straights but this is less of an issue off the track.

Second, the A4's chassis is better balanced than the A5, slightly longer wheelbase and better weight balance, as a result of this the A4 3.2Quattro with only 265hp is actually quicker on Hockenheim and by almost a second ahead of the S5 and nearly a second and a half ahead of the 335i. Now though this still places the M3 ahead by more than a second and a half ahead of the A4 3.2Quattro the chances are with Audi retuning the suspension, adding 70hp, fitting 7 gears and dual clutch plus including the new Quattro Sport diff that the S4 will be very close indeed to what the M3 achieved.

Sure it's not going to be as quick in acceleration and it will not get to close to the M3's time on the ring as it's a power track but on the public roads I would place the S4 very close to the M3 in capability.
+1 on everything. Cant wait to read the first reviews.
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      09-24-2008, 05:11 AM   #57
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Car is fine,but those front LED lights are not my cup of tea...A5/S5 LED lights looks much better.
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      09-24-2008, 12:31 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E82tt6 View Post
Hmmm. I would have expected more power.

I like the car otherwise, but I think it should come packing 380 or so from the factory. In my mind, it needs to be able to soundly outperform the 335i, and at least hold a candle to the C63 and M3 to be priced in the 50s.

It'll be cheaper than the M3, or C63, so I can see it being a bit down on power to those, but it looks like its Power/Weight will be worse than the 335i? And this is before BMW releases the 355hp unit for the M135i and 335tii.

+1. Hopefully the new engine will have nice tuning potential.
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      09-24-2008, 03:17 PM   #59
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This S4 will be just as big a pile of crap as the B6 and the B7 models...
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      09-24-2008, 04:52 PM   #60
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This S4 will be just as big a pile of crap as the B6 and the B7 models...
Alert, Alert, NARROW-MINDED BMW FAN.

Seriously man, you need to get out more often and try things a new. Sure BMW cars are great but so are so many other stuff too, Audi's latest no exception.

I personally think you will find the S4 a car which will readdress the balance and people's opinions on Audi cars a whole.

May I suggest trying the X5 on a track and then comparing the same course in an X6, I think you will be amazed how much difference this new diff makes the car behave. The same will be true of the S4 and knowing how well the S5 behaved I can only imagine how the S4 will be and I'm guessing 'M3 good'.
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      09-24-2008, 06:39 PM   #61
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I suspect Audi was constrained by emissions laws for this car.... They need to build more Lupos so they can have faster cars.

I dread seeing the next generation of BMWs' compromises.
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      09-24-2008, 07:29 PM   #62
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Ugly?

Uhhh.. not quite.


That bitch is hot!









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      09-24-2008, 07:33 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iatacs19 View Post
Very nice car, but the corporate/marketing execution is out of touch with reality.

If the S4 sedan will start @ $49k then it's doomed before it even starts selling.

S4 seems more of a direct competitor to the 335i than M3...

The supposed RS4 is priced even above the M3...

WTF is Audi thinking???
Audi has always sold their direct competitors at a higher price.

Always.

S4 IS a direct competitor to the 335. Not that it seems, it IS.

RS models compete with M models.

Isn't this old news already?

And no, the S4 is far from doomed.
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