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      09-07-2008, 11:31 PM   #23
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I see Zolty is working on your car, your car is in excellent hands my friend....So the RD sport conversion belonged to you....When I was at AutoTalent Frederico was asking Zolty when he can remove the engine...Nice please keep us updated.
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      09-08-2008, 01:53 AM   #24
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I'm going to do my best to answer these questions as they come along, however I must stress that I am not quite sure about what I am allowed to say and what is a 'corporate secret.'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
Excellent, what do they charge for it? Will be nice to have competition for Dinan, the more strokers the merrier.
As far as pricing is concerned, I'd suggest calling RDSport / Racing Dynamics directly. Also, I'd say that Dinan would be future competition, they don't have an engine kit for this car yet.

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Originally Posted by BCMPOWER View Post
What is included in the complete car package? Others have posted ideas of modifications to handle the increased power of the rebuilt engine, are they beefing up the transmition and differential? I am curious to see if RDsport has created a exclusive aerodynamics package for the M3, I have always like their tornado kit for the E46 M3. Please keep us posted, looks to be an amazing car when finished!
The complete RS 45 package has a full aerokit which is in development now. I've seen the drawings and pre production work and it looks really good. Once I get final pictures I'll post them. Also, with the complete conversion there is some interior work and special badging, etc...
There really is a lot of work coming up, from the suspension and brakes to a rear differential cooler. Instead of posting now about what is coming down the line it's a bit easier to do it in sections.

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Originally Posted by JMD0977 View Post
Is this the first one they are doing? How long does it take for the installation+tests? Is it always about 2 motnhs?
I want one!
I think this is the first one in North America, but to be honest I haven't asked. I think it does take about 2 months. Since I'm leaving the car there it's not a big deal if it takes longer.

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Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
I am wondering if now that Dinan and RdSport have strokers if anyone else will enter the game and the competition will drive prices down. Dinan will want >30k but if someone can do this for 15k people will line up.
Dinan doesn't have a stroker kit, at least not yet. Also, their M5/M6 engine kit just came out, RDSport / Racing Dynamics has had one for a long time now. Unfortunately pricing tends to remain high because the parts are expensive and there really isn't enough volume to offer substantial discounts without turning to cheap suppliers.

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Originally Posted by Kadarin View Post
Would love to hear more details... For example, is this just a stroker kit (crank, piston, rod replacement in stock block), or do they alter camshaft profiles? Compression? Bore? Cylinder head port work?
This is where I have to be careful. I don't think I can give specific details. The stroke does change and the new displacement is 4.6L. I do know that replacement camshafts are already available for the M3 from RD and you can order them as a standalone product.

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Originally Posted by Arsenal View Post
I see Zolty is working on your car, your car is in excellent hands my friend....So the RD sport conversion belonged to you....When I was at AutoTalent Frederico was asking Zolty when he can remove the engine...Nice please keep us updated.
Yes the engine was removed at Autotalent last week, however the work is not being done there. I really do like Autotalent, it's a great shop and always nice to see the cars inside.


BTW thanks for all the nice comments. I'll try and keep posting info and pictures when I get them. In the meantime here are a few more pics I took last week. I actually think the engine has already been taken apart, I'll get pics asap.

Bonus points if you can guess which car is in the background of this first picture.





I thought it was pretty nerdy to put an 'M' badge on the ECU case.
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      09-08-2008, 02:06 AM   #25
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This is an AWESOME project Bro! Cant wait to see it Good Luck
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      09-08-2008, 02:22 AM   #26
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Nice modifications, pretty impressive. And the car in the back is a Ferrari 275 GTB from 1966 or 67 . Am I right?

How well known is RDsports in the US? They had some trouble here in Europe some years ago for rebadging a Hartge H50 as far as I can remember.
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      09-08-2008, 02:50 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saebb View Post
Nice modifications, pretty impressive. And the car in the back is a Ferrari 275 GTB from 1966 or 67 . Am I right?

How well known is RDsports in the US? They had some trouble here in Europe some years ago for rebadging a Hartge H50 as far as I can remember.
Good guess, it's a 275 GTB/4. Unbelievable car.

RDSport and Racing Dynamics of Milan did not rebrand a Hartge H50, and neither did the accused party which was their German importer at the time. This was all settled privately quite a few years back, and there were various behind the scenes mitigating circumstances. It's really a long story and best not posted on these forums.
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      09-08-2008, 03:51 AM   #28
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WOW! I cannot wait to see the finished product of that engine! subscribed! =D
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      09-08-2008, 04:34 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nd54 View Post


As far as pricing is concerned, I'd suggest calling RDSport / Racing Dynamics directly. Also, I'd say that Dinan would be future competition, they don't have an engine kit for this car yet.

I think this is the first one in North America, but to be honest I haven't asked. I think it does take about 2 months. Since I'm leaving the car there it's not a big deal if it takes longer.

Dinan doesn't have a stroker kit, at least not yet. Also, their M5/M6 engine kit just came out, RDSport / Racing Dynamics has had one for a long time now. Unfortunately pricing tends to remain high because the parts are expensive and there really isn't enough volume to offer substantial discounts without turning to cheap suppliers.
Dinan does have a stroker, not on the market yet, technically. From what I see, since yours is supposed to be the first, RDsport does not have one on the market yet either, technically.

I was hoping you would share the price as I am not going to take the time to call and inquire about something I am not purchasing. The exchange of information on messageboards with enthusiasts is quicker and easier, but if you don't want to share the price I understand.

Pricing remains high when there is no competition, eventually others will enter the stroker fray as the volume of cars increases greatly in the next few years.
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      09-08-2008, 05:42 AM   #30
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      09-08-2008, 07:59 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nd54 View Post
This is where I have to be careful. I don't think I can give specific details. The stroke does change and the new displacement is 4.6L. I do know that replacement camshafts are already available for the M3 from RD and you can order them as a standalone product.
I wonder why they are so secretive? Its not like you couldn't measure the bore, stroke, compression height, wrist pin height, etc. yourself.

I suspect they are turning the crank down and using a smaller rod journal. Probably changed the wrist pin location also. Will they at least tell you what brand of pistons and rods they are using?

Personally I would not let them touch my engine until I knew every minute detail of what they were going to do. But maybe this is just secret now because yours is the first and they don't want any mis-info out there?? I guess you know a lot more of the details than you are allowed to say.

Oh and I should add - you must have big cajones. I hope it pays off - you're car is going to be sick!
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      09-08-2008, 08:00 AM   #32
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Thats amazing info.

Thanks for sharing
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      09-08-2008, 08:21 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nd54 View Post
I’ve purchased the complete car package, which includes the 4.6L engine conversion. Similar to their M5 engine rebuild which is 5.6L and rated at 648hp, the engine for this car will produce around 520hp. More importantly, it’s naturally aspirated power keeping with the M philosophy, which is why I oppose forced induction on these cars.

Here are some teaser shots. It actually is very impressive, especially the engine. Every person that has seen the engine has commented on how well designed and built it is. I’ll be posting more pictures as they come.


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      09-08-2008, 08:58 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nd54 View Post
Good guess, it's a 275 GTB/4. Unbelievable car.
Guess? It was knowledge .

Quote:
Originally Posted by nd54 View Post
RDSport and Racing Dynamics of Milan did not rebrand a Hartge H50, and neither did the accused party which was their German importer at the time. This was all settled privately quite a few years back, and there were various behind the scenes mitigating circumstances. It's really a long story and best not posted on these forums.
Well, I was just wondering. The fast the accusements came up the fast they were gone. So let sleeping dogs lie. Hope to see some more progress pics of this exciting tune up. Was the design kit also ordered? And is all this available for Germany?
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      09-08-2008, 09:44 AM   #35
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Now that's awesome!
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      09-08-2008, 10:36 AM   #36
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Your car is going to be a beast! Are you going for the sleeper look and embarrass 911 turbos? or are you going to do the whole kazam, bam thanks mam?
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      09-08-2008, 11:50 AM   #37
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Quote:
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I would hope not. If the price were about $40k as is suspected, then turning the crank to create a stroker would be just a hack. For the $40k price tag, the motor should get a custom forged crank.
For 40k I definitely agree. I was under the impression they were trying to do this at a much lower price-point.
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      09-08-2008, 11:55 AM   #38
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      09-08-2008, 12:12 PM   #39
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Do they provide some sort of warranty for their work? If i remember correctly Dinan covers the remainder of BMW's warranty (i could be wrong).
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      09-08-2008, 12:27 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
I would hope not. If the price were about $40k as is suspected, then turning the crank to create a stroker would be just a hack. For the $40k price tag, the motor should get a custom forged crank.
Before this gets out of hand, and the speculations become facts, all RDSport/Racing Dynamics R motors use custom billet crankshafts, custom billet rods, and, in 99% of the applications, the piston supplier is the same as BMW uses in the production version of the same motor.

Warranty is 2 years/50K miles, or the remainder of your new BMW warranty.

I hope this helps.
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      09-08-2008, 12:52 PM   #41
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Good stuff..keep us updated.
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      09-08-2008, 01:53 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
Dinan does have a stroker, not on the market yet, technically. From what I see, since yours is supposed to be the first, RDsport does not have one on the market yet either, technically.

I was hoping you would share the price as I am not going to take the time to call and inquire about something I am not purchasing. The exchange of information on messageboards with enthusiasts is quicker and easier, but if you don't want to share the price I understand.

Pricing remains high when there is no competition, eventually others will enter the stroker fray as the volume of cars increases greatly in the next few years.
I was under the impression the Dinan kit wasn't going to be ready until next year. Plus with the whole buyout thing I figured it might get delayed.

Pricing remains high depending on the parts suppliers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
I wonder why they are so secretive? Its not like you couldn't measure the bore, stroke, compression height, wrist pin height, etc. yourself.

I suspect they are turning the crank down and using a smaller rod journal. Probably changed the wrist pin location also. Will they at least tell you what brand of pistons and rods they are using?

Personally I would not let them touch my engine until I knew every minute detail of what they were going to do. But maybe this is just secret now because yours is the first and they don't want any mis-info out there?? I guess you know a lot more of the details than you are allowed to say.

Oh and I should add - you must have big cajones. I hope it pays off - you're car is going to be sick!
They are not being secretive, I know all of the details but I cannot post them on this forum, I don't know what is public information and what isn't. It's different if RD was posting the information as opposed to myself. Anyway as you can see someone from RDSport did post some information later on to correct your assumption about the crank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc View Post
Your car is going to be a beast! Are you going for the sleeper look and embarrass 911 turbos? or are you going to do the whole kazam, bam thanks mam?
Thanks! I think for people that know cars they'll realise it isn't a normal M3. For the average person a BMW is a BMW though. I still plan on embarrassing 911 turbos

Last edited by nd54; 09-08-2008 at 02:26 PM.
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      09-08-2008, 02:50 PM   #43
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good luck sir!

being secretive about the cost means its expensive, kind of like vendors not posting prices on BBK
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      09-08-2008, 02:54 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDSport View Post
Before this gets out of hand, and the speculations become facts, all RDSport/Racing Dynamics R motors use custom billet crankshafts, custom billet rods, and, in 99% of the applications, the piston supplier is the same as BMW uses in the production version of the same motor.

Warranty is 2 years/50K miles, or the remainder of your new BMW warranty.

I hope this helps.
Thanks for the clarification on that. Much appreciated.

So, is there any chance you can clear up the other secrets, such as the bore, stroke, compression, engine redline RPM, rod length, rod ratio, wristpin height, any more detailed dyno information, etc?

If not, that's fine, I do understand. But can you at least specify whether you won't discuss those things because you are still working on details or are still deciding between a couple different possibilities; OR if you won't discuss them because you are trying to keep those things proprietary?

In any case, as you can already see, people do speculate and may speculate about those other details I list above in the future. So, anywhere you may be concerned about speculation becoming fact, you are obviously encouraged to post anything you are at liberty to say. No one wants M3Post to be a factual source of information more than we do. But you have to understand that, absent of facts, people are going to make guesses. And it certainly does not help that when some one starts a very interesting thread about a very hot topic only to not be able to answer many of the questions that naturally follow.

Anyway, I am looking forward to seeing your finished product. Sounds like you are on your way to offering a very nice product with killer performance.
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