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      09-04-2008, 05:34 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lyndon_h View Post
Arguing about abortion or religion is pointless.
you are wrong.

now.. ur turn
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      09-04-2008, 05:42 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayx1989 View Post
this is the mothers choice not anyone else to have an abortion or not that is how it should be...
Obama is sported by many, including doctors for this reason
Obama is a person who listens to what the people have to say about issues and this is the kind of president we need, a president that will listen to what people have to say
What greater authority is there? Would you say that a U.S. Supreme Court decision should be the end of it? And that a contemporaneous politician who fought for the other side was wrong?
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      09-04-2008, 06:21 PM   #47
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From Obama's interview with Bill O'Reilly:

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I think that the surge has succeeded in ways that nobody anticipated, Obama said while refusing to retract his initial opposition to the surge. Ive already said its succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.
I can think of at least three people who anticipated the success of the surge, George W. Bush, David Petraeus, and John McCain.

And, when exactly did he say that before today?
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      09-04-2008, 07:29 PM   #48
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I concur. He will come to your home and eat your children!!
Cannibalism is a natural right too!
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      09-04-2008, 08:37 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lyndon_h View Post
Arguing about abortion or religion is pointless.
Arguing about anything on the Internet is pointless.
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      09-05-2008, 10:40 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayx1989 View Post
this is the mothers choice not anyone else to have an abortion or not that is how it should be...
Your own words betray the pro choice line. What is this woman a "mother" to? If a pregnant woman is a "mother," then that implies there's another person involved - the baby. If that's true, then she should have no more "right to choose" to destroy that baby's life when it is unborn than she should after he/she is born.
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      09-05-2008, 10:56 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayx1989 View Post
this is the mothers choice not anyone else to have an abortion or not that is how it should be...

Obama is sported by many, including doctors for this reason

Obama is a person who listens to what the people have to say about issues and this is the kind of president we need, a president that will listen to what people have to say
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamecock9901 View Post
Your own words betray the pro choice line. What is this woman a "mother" to? If a pregnant woman is a "mother," then that implies there's another person involved - the baby. If that's true, then she should have no more "right to choose" to destroy that baby's life when it is unborn than she should after he/she is born.
Proverbs 6

2 if you have been trapped by what you said,
ensnared by the words of your mouth,
3 then do this, my son, to free yourself,
since you have fallen into your neighbor's hands:
Go and humble yourself;
press your plea with your neighbor!
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      09-05-2008, 05:43 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganeil View Post
I have heard this charge repeatedly. Maybe you can give me examples. The only issue I recall him changing his mind on is offshore oil drilling.
Certainly. From what I can recall off the top of my head right now, I've heard McCain flip on immigration, offshore drilling, tax cuts, social security, privacy laws, and a couple others but I may have to research a bit. That's not to mention that I've known him as a 'maverick' of the Republican party, leaning more towards the middle. The last couple months he has played HARD to the right side, dismissing many things he's said in the past. Now Palin is hard right and his speech last night all of a sudden seemed to lean across party lines again... He's just been this way, then that way, then this way again. It concerns me if he'd do the same thing if elected to office. As I say that, I've also seen Obama move towards being a bit more centric then I originally thought he was, so I know it's going on on both sides - I just have personally felt much more of it from the Republican side this election.

I wish their were more than two major parties
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Last edited by Spec 1; 09-05-2008 at 06:36 PM. Reason: We need more parties!
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      09-05-2008, 06:10 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganeil View Post
I have heard this charge repeatedly. Maybe you can give me examples. The only issue I recall him changing his mind on is offshore oil drilling.
Oh, let me help, since you are too old and lazy to use Google


http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/0...-in-two-weeks/

http://www.alternet.org/election08/90956/?page=entire

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/01/04/mccain-100-years/

Not convincing enough???
Here are some VIDEOS for you


http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...oq=mccain+flip


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      09-05-2008, 07:05 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spec 1 View Post
Certainly. From what I can recall off the top of my head right now, I've heard McCain flip on immigration, offshore drilling, tax cuts, social security, privacy laws, and a couple others but I may have to research a bit. That's not to mention that I've known him as a 'maverick' of the Republican party, leaning more towards the middle. The last couple months he has played HARD to the right side, dismissing many things he's said in the past. Now Palin is hard right and his speech last night all of a sudden seemed to lean across party lines again... He's just been this way, then that way, then this way again. It concerns me if he'd do the same thing if elected to office. As I say that, I've also seen Obama move towards being a bit more centric then I originally thought he was, so I know it's going on on both sides - I just have personally felt much more of it from the Republican side this election.

I wish their were more than two major parties
I do not agree that McCain has flipped on immigration. He still supports a comprehensive approach to dealing with the issue but accepts the political reality that it must be done in two steps with border control coming first. As far as tax cuts are concerned, he has supported them since his earliest days in Congress when he support the Reagan tax cuts. He did oppose the Bush tax cuts because he felt they should be structured differently and be combined with spending cuts but that does not imply that he should support raising taxes now. I would certainly hope that someone would change his mind if the situation warrants it and the situation around offshore drilling has definitely changed. I am not familiar with any changes with regard to social security or privacy laws but if you have information I would like to see it.

I also do not think that any of those changes constitute a hard move to the right. Immigration is an issue that splits the right as well as the left and tax cuts are a fairly mainstream center-right policy prescription. If he were Rudy Guiliani and suddenly became pro-life, a long term advocate of gun control who became a life member of the NRA, or big government spender who began railing against government spending, I would think you would have a case for that charge but that is not what has happened.
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      09-05-2008, 07:42 PM   #55
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Quote:
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Arguing about anything on the Internet is pointless.
It is NOT!!!!
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      09-05-2008, 08:26 PM   #56
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For just a few thousand dollars McCain will sell citizenship to illegals.
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      09-05-2008, 11:28 PM   #57
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It is NOT!!!!
Is too. I know you are, but what am I? Take that!
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