M School vs BMWCCA Driver School

[stevespools]

Has anyone done both and could describe the difference? I signed up for M School Nov 6-8 and have been a club member for a year but haven`t attended anything yet. I don`t want to abuse my car on a track while it`s still so new and under warranty. I`ve never attended any driver school or driven on a track.

[M34EVER]

never done it.. but i heard its kinda of a waste spend more time in the classroom then on the track....

i dont like abusing my car either... but i would rather take a day and go up to watkins gleen and play with other Ms and porsche.... you dont need to beat on your car.. just have fun...

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by stevespools

Has anyone done both and could describe the difference? I signed up for M School Nov 6-8 and have been a club member for a year but haven`t attended anything yet. I don`t want to abuse my car on a track while it`s still so new and under warranty. I`ve never attended any driver school or driven on a track.

If you can afford it, go to M School. Much better professional instruction and you get to beat on BMW's cars instead of your own.

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by T Bone

If you can afford it, go to M School. Much better professional instruction and you get to beat on BMW's cars instead of your own.

Thanks - that`s what I was thinking. Have you done M School?

[antzcrashing]

I am interested too. Price ballpark for M school?

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by stevespools

Thanks - that`s what I was thinking. Have you done M School?

Yes and I am doing the Advanced M school in a few weeks.

You will have a great experience with M School in Spartanburg.

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by T Bone

Yes and I am doing the Advanced M school in a few weeks.

You will have a great experience with M School in Spartanburg.

Awesome I can`t wait. I hope the cars are all 6MT

[MysticBlue]

Originally Posted by M34EVER

never done it.. but i heard its kinda of a waste spend more time in the classroom then on the track....

Which are you referring to? I certainly didn't have any complaints about seat time at the M school. Very professional operation, first rate all the way as far as I am concerned. Haven't been to a CCA event so can't compare.

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

I am interested too. Price ballpark for M school?

2 day is $3295

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...S/Default.aspx

[lvwirelessguy]

Originally Posted by T Bone

If you can afford it, go to M School. Much better professional instruction and you get to beat on BMW's cars instead of your own.

The guys that instruct at the BMWCCA events are very professional, and alot of them have taught at The M School before.

Having said that I still want to make it to SC sometime soon

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by lvwirelessguy

The guys that instruct at the BMWCCA events are very professional, and alot of them have taught at The M School before.

Having said that I still want to make it to SC sometime soon

I`ve read that the CCA instructors are very professional. I`m more concerned about driving my car on the track since I`ve never done it before and really want to drive it hard. It`s seems the best way to start by thrashing someone else`s car

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by stevespools

I`ve read that the CCA instructors are very professional. I`m more concerned about driving my car on the track since I`ve never done it before and really want to drive it hard. It`s seems the best way to start by thrashing someone else`s car

You will have fun but it is likely your classmates will have track experience.

You will see who has driven on the track when you go through the heel-n-toe exercises.

When I went, I won the King Rat award

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by T Bone

You will have fun but it is likely your classmates will have track experience.

You will see who has driven on the track when you go through the heel-n-toe exercises.

When I went, I won the King Rat award

so I should practice that? Heel/toe is blipping the throttle for downshift while braking hard in a turn?

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by stevespools

so I should practice that? Heel/toe is blipping the throttle for downshift while braking hard in a turn?

Analyze your statement and understand your failure

Seriously, practice is very good. ONe thing that will "surprise" any one new one the track is the "blipping" that is required is much more than the streety and your foot is much deeper into brake pedal.

[enigma]

Originally Posted by lvwirelessguy

The guys that instruct at the BMWCCA events are very professional

I would dispute this from experience.

Some of them are great, other, not so much...

[lucid]

Originally Posted by enigma

I would dispute this from experience.

Some of them are great, other, not so much...

Agreed. I ran into some great instructors who have raced professionally and started giving me dead-on advice the minute I started driving. I ran into others who were giving me poor guidance that I ignored. But, overall, it's not a bad deal for the price.

[MysticBlue]

Originally Posted by stevespools

so I should practice that? Heel/toe is blipping the throttle for downshift while braking hard in a turn?

First, as you will learn, hard braking and downshift should be done before turn in, not in the turn. In any case, it is difficult to practice heel and toe on the street. It is tough to find a place where you can safely get into the brakes deep enough and long enough to do a proper heel and toe. In my (limited) experience, it feels pretty awkward to try to do it in normal street situations because you can't get the brake pedal down close the gas pedal. Having said that, it doesn't hurt to practice so when you do it at the track, at least you aren't trying something you've never tried. Just be aware that most likely when you try it on the street, it will feel awkward. It works much better at the track with an instructor working with you.

[stevespools]

Originally Posted by T Bone

Analyze your statement and understand your failure

Seriously, practice is very good. ONe thing that will "surprise" any one new one the track is the "blipping" that is required is much more than the streety and your foot is much deeper into brake pedal.

sounds cryptic; I think you`re saying it can`t be practiced on the street. Are you advising me to do the CCA driver schools before attempting M School?

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by stevespools

so I should practice that? Heel/toe is blipping the throttle for downshift while braking hard in a turn?

DON'T practice that, and don't bother trying that in your first, or even first few schools. Just use the pedals the way you're used to using them.

If you use any new technique under duress, you're more likely to screw up, and you don't want to be whistling downhill into a blind hairpin when you do that.

By the way, it will be duress after several sessions. By the end of the day, you'll be going so much faster than in the first session or two that you'll likely get your instructor's complete attention a couple of times.

That's code for scaring the poor bastard. If so, you'll hear about it.

Bruce

PS - They may possibly teach heel/toe techniques to you at the M school. Don't know. If you want to pursue that with your CCA instructors, they may help with that, but only if you slow down.

[MysticBlue]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

PS - They may possibly teach heel/toe techniques to you at the M school. Don't know. If you want to pursue that with your CCA instructors, they may help with that, but only if you slow down.

Yes they do, at least during the 2 day M school.

[MysticBlue]

I would be somewhat hesitant recommending the M school to someone if they have never done a track event before. The instructors are very good and patient and will work with you but I think you will get a lot more out of it if you've done some kind of autocross or track event (with instruction) before this. At my 2 day M school there were a couple of guys there who hadn't done anything before this and were obviously in a little over their heads.

[enigma]

Originally Posted by MysticBlue

I would be somewhat hesitant recommending the M school to someone if they have never done a track event before. The instructors are very good and patient and will work with you but I think you will get a lot more out of it if you've done some kind of autocross or track event (with instruction) before this. At my 2 day M school there were a couple of guys there who hadn't done anything before this and were obviously in a little over their heads.

I have always though it best to go to a few autocrosses before a track day. Much better place to learn basic car control skills.