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      04-20-2008, 01:04 PM   #23
ersin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy View Post
we asian's are shorter ok
But, isn't the tallest man in the world Chinese?
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      04-20-2008, 01:51 PM   #24
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Excellent and amusing piece. I like it that the author knows his Japanese battleships (aside: the sister ship to the Yamato was the Musashi, eponymously named after a Japanese Samurai).

I'd love to drive a GT-R but I suspect it could become antiseptical an ownership experience over the medium term. Be nice perhaps to own one for track.

Notice how the "CAR" mag review in 4/2008 "Nissan Crushes the Germans" had this opinion on the M3 by Ben Barry, "... this is the most FUN I'll have all day" [emphasis added]

Says it all, really.
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      04-20-2008, 02:13 PM   #25
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I would not say he was "flaming" the GT-R. He just points out what kind of driving experence the GT-R gives the diriver. If you want to go fast with the aid of electronics you are going to feel out of the loop. So if you ain't got the skills and want to go real fast buy a GT-R. I personaly don't want to trun over all control to software programers when I dirve.
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      04-20-2008, 03:09 PM   #26
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The GT-R is an ugly SOB (in my opinion). However, it is beautiful with regards to its engineering. It is breath taking in the fact that it can out perform so many more expensive cars. However I don't think it would leave me breathless as the ///M3 would... I’m sure it would leave me awestruck, but I think at the end of the day I want to be dumbstruck, so for that I will get the M3.
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      04-20-2008, 03:41 PM   #27
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I can not say boo about the GTR having not driven it or sat in it etc.

Just in general, I own three AWD cars, have driven a 996 turbo (awd) have driven a dozen rwd sports cars etc.

I would notice the AWD cars are slightly less fun to drive. I don't say that means it's a bad car, but after my drive of a 911 turbo, I was left with a puzzle opinion. I liked the way it was easy to drive and it made mincemeat of the roads I drive normally but the point was that I was bored at normal speeds. It seems like I needed to see where the edge was to have fun and yet I am not able to get that fast (near the edge) in such a car.

But several RWD cars you can wag their tails without being at insane speeds. I suspect that's what I am looking for. I want something thats fast (OK) but that's not all I'm looking more for fun to drive.
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      04-20-2008, 04:04 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksfrogman View Post
I don't see how anyone can agree or disagree about the uninvolving nature of the GTR until they have driven it. Blowing the doors off a Porsche 911 Turbo, Corvette, and Viper with a rice rocket is pretty exciting in itself, not to mention all the other cars lower on the pecking order. And you can probably do that with a cup of Starbucks in one hand.

I'm not sure I would call the car ugly, but it certainly isn't beautiful. In that price range, I would say the Cayman-S is beautiful--sleek design, round curves, very organically flowing body. The only redeeming quality of the GTR's Mitsubishi-esh design is that one can see vestiges of the old Skyline in the circular taillight arrangement and angular rear roof line.
I do not believe the The GT-R was designed to be pretty. Godzilla is not dashing. It's intent is to smash things like performance numbers. Considering the intent of this car, I think it looks the part just fine.

I Couldn't agree more about the looks of the Cayman. Reminds me of a Ferrari Dino. IMO, better looking than the 997 line except for the GT series. The Cayman could easily be a bargain basement Ferrari as much as a Porsche, given it's swoopy lines, mid engine placement, and corner carving prowess.
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      04-20-2008, 04:49 PM   #29
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I agree with many others, excellent writing and a very refreshing dissent of opinion about the car. With all of the flawless press thus far, one is obligated to at least read and ponder this point of view. Having not driven any cars that offer super car performance and incredible ease of driving (how many are there actually?...) I can not really comment. However, I think I know what an enthusiast (who is not a real ace or part time racer) really wants is a car. Fast, thrilling and yet still safe, meaning some margin for driver error and controllable/predictable on limit. As well we want something that is involving, rewarding of good driver skills. Obtaining this very fine balance is really tough from a design/engineering perspective. Although achieving such monstrous performance and making it so easy to handle is also a very admirable achievementin the same domains.
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      04-20-2008, 06:35 PM   #30
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We are all creatures of our senses. Some of us may like food/restaurants; some may like music; some may like movies/videos. We like the driving experience. It's that experience that drives us.
The same reason we try different foods such as Italian, French, Chinese, etc.; we also like to experience different cars. Each one offers a different sensation. How the Porsche took that turn; how the Ferrari sounded; how the Lamborghini accelerated off the line...
If all we needed was to get from point A to point B, a Yugo would suffice.
The GT-R has been univerally lauded as the most anticipated event in quite some time. For anyone to say that they would never want to experience this car simply because it's a Nissan; they are simply depriving themselves of that experience that drives us all.
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      04-20-2008, 07:38 PM   #31
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I think the root cause of the "sterility" is AWD, not the sum of the car's technical wizardry. I'd argue that if you take AWD out of the equation, the GT-R is about on par with every other modern GT on the market in terms of electronic intervention, M3 included. Particularly when you tack on M-DCT.
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      04-20-2008, 08:32 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zieglerc View Post
I think the root cause of the "sterility" is AWD, not the sum of the car's technical wizardry. I'd argue that if you take AWD out of the equation, the GT-R is about on par with every other modern GT on the market in terms of electronic intervention, M3 included. Particularly when you tack on M-DCT.
Likley Nissan has taken a lot of the front-wheel-drive out of the car. I mean they worked on RWD bias.

I think as quick as the GTR is is not many people 'race' so except for bragging the GTR is not necessary.

I mean if we need/want to we can buy a Z06 for less (or same) money as a M3. Things like rear seat may be more important to many than if a car can go 0-100 in less than 8 seconds.
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      04-21-2008, 12:29 AM   #33
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I can imagine the super-competend AWD and massive grip making a pretty uninvolving drive at any sane street speed. But I'll bet at its limit on the track it is simply amazing. The rear torque bias allows tail-out antics like a RWD car, but the transfer of power to the front allows you to gather it up and slingshot out of corners. Driven fast and well on the track I'll bet it is quite amazing.
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      04-21-2008, 02:20 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e36jakeo View Post
Driven fast and well on the track I'll bet it is quite amazing.
And if you really want some excitement and danger you can turn most of the electronic aids off entirely...
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      04-21-2008, 11:58 AM   #35
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love Dan Neil's reviews.... so funny but still so informative... GT-R definitely ranks up there in performance but probably not so in driving dynamics..... it seems that's the most common comments on most of the reviews out there... superbly fast but lacks "character".... I remember this one reviewer saying that if it was a choice and that he didn't have to foot the bill, it would be the P-car turbo for sure but if it was his own money, he'll be writing it to Nissan...
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      04-21-2008, 05:41 PM   #36
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Dan isn't the only one to rain a bit on the GT-R parade - Autoweek compared the GT-R to the Lexus IS-F and said: "The GT-R is the faster car, but it is not necessarily better to drive. With the cars hot-shoed back-to-back, the character of the Lexus makes up for its power and overall speed deficit." I do, however, agree with the incredible shrinking pee pee comment -that GT-R is a beast....and up here at 5,200' it will seem even more so mit der turbos.

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      04-21-2008, 05:45 PM   #37
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Thumbs down

Japanese cars are camels of USA and dont handle anywhere near German cars.
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      04-21-2008, 05:47 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwprince4life View Post
Japanese cars are camels of USA and dont handle anywhere near German cars.
Except for the Evo X which beats any BMW in all handling numbers.
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      04-21-2008, 05:53 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwprince4life View Post
Japanese cars are camels of USA and dont handle anywhere near German cars.
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      04-21-2008, 09:44 PM   #40
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I don't know, hard for me to knock a car that fast in straight-line AND on the track.......
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      04-21-2008, 09:59 PM   #41
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The GT-R is hideous. It is an aberration of design. It is an insult to the eye.
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      04-23-2008, 07:18 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Entertaining review. Without having driven or seen one, from what I know I would have to agree with the conclusions. A great piece of engineering., though. Funy how excelling at almost everything can ultimately mean it does not excel at what matters most to lots of enthusiasts.

I'm extremely happy with the M3 and it gives me as much performance as I want or need.

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      04-24-2008, 12:36 AM   #43
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Love the E92 M3 & Love R35 GTR

I love both cars however the next car will be the E92 M3. The rumored dealer mark of around $100k for the GTR so makes my decision for the M3 E92. I want both cars the M3 for daily driving and GTR for the weekend and ZO6 slaying. Knowing that the M3 E92 is my next ride, I plan on the vpec GTR in a few years. I call it the best of both worlds.
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      04-24-2008, 12:43 AM   #44
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