Would would owned who? e90/2 M3 or IS-F

[esqu1re]

Wait for the next generation IS-F. The current one is ok, but needs a manual and/or DCT.

[davcrz5]

Here are 1/4 mile times of M3 and ISF from Dragtimes.com all car are stock this show that ISF is slightly faster than M3 in quarter mile, but both cars are very close time wise. I know drag racing is not what M3 is built for it's more of track car, but now that 2011 ISF has matched M3 at VIR on the track it will be interesting to see what future holds for these two monster. Nothing like good old fashion rivalry to get the blood pumping and in real world were most of us spend our time driving thats what matters to me the most. It's amazing how so many people on different forums rely on here say, misinformation, bias forums, bench racing, or T.V. show that are made first and for most for entertainment not accuracy to get there information from, doesn't anyone go to track anymore or hang out with different type of car owners and see first hand what other cars are capable of.

IMO with improvement made to 2011 ISF it can now honestly be said that both cars are pretty equal. M3 may have some small advantage regarding its handling and steering feel but not enough for your average driver to take advantage of. They are both two different cars that have a common goal but reach that goal differently one more track focused another more of street machine in the end you have two pretty bad ass cars.

Compare 1/4 mile Drag Racing timeslips:
BMW M3
Lexus IS-F

Click on the 1/4 ET to display the DragTime in detail.


1/4 Mile
ET 1/4 Mile
MPH 1/8 Mile
ET 1/8 Mile
MPH 0-60 Foot

ET Temp F Stock Car Year Driver
Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 CrazyMPG
12.379* 114.730 8.028 89.790 1.856 43.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2009 ChicagoISF
12.385* 115.010 8.077 91.010 1.945 41.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Cole
12.441* 116.420 8.144 90.320 2.001 46.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Cole
12.466* 113.790 8.104 89.040 1.911 46.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 ToothDoc
12.506* 115.290 8.171 89.510 1.964 55.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Cole
12.510* 114.810 Yes BMW M3 Coupe 2009 NA
12.540* 117.200 8.196 90.240 2.015 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Steve
12.565* 111.980 8.172 90.610 1.953 61.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Cole
12.582* 111.820 8.148 87.540 1.912 59.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2009
12.610* 113.110 Yes BMW M3 Sedan 2008 NA
12.610* 113.020 Yes BMW M3 Coupe 2009 NA
12.670* 112.060 8.270 88.780 2.033 78.8 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 Cole
12.700* 114.000 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 NA
12.705* 113.190 8.293 89.150 2.002 56.0 Yes Lexus IS-F 2008 2JZIS-F

[technik330]

Wow, the narrow mindedness of some of the posters in here is pathetic...

I've driven an '09, '10 IS-F, and am looking forward to driving the '11 model; I've also driven my fair share of M3s as well, both e46 and e92.

I believe the e92 M3 is a superb vehicle, it's the culmination of 3, prior, generations of evolution and refinement.

That said: It's clear that Lexus has listened to its customers, critics as well, and has created a product that meets, if not exceeds, the same standards as the M3.

I'll be in the market for a new car next year and I can assure you I'll be considering the IS-F, M3 as well... if it'll be around for a '12 MY.

What can't be denied, marginalized, etc. is the fact that the IS-F, within its first generation, has managed to meet the performance figures of the sport's car "standard" that is now on its fourth generation; I, subjectively, find that pretty damn impressive.

I'm no more a fan of Lexus than I am of BMW, but I believe credit, when due, should be given.

[Richbot]

Lexus hasn't listened to its customers, it's listened to the automotive press and M3 customers in creating the 2011 ISF. Lexus customers are choosing not to buy the ISF in droves. Too bad too, seems to be a great package and I'm assuming an otherwise Lexus-like ownership experience, sans boredom.

[smmmurf]

Originally Posted by Richbot

Lexus hasn't listened to its customers, it's listened to the automotive press and M3 customers in creating the 2011 ISF. Lexus customers are choosing not to buy the ISF in droves. Too bad too, seems to be a great package and I'm assuming an otherwise Lexus-like ownership experience, sans boredom.

I see quite a few of them around here
Not as common as M3's but Lexus IS250/350's aren't as common as 328/335's either.
I hear the 2011 is fantastic with the new LSD.

[KIS]

I, like many on this forum, had a short list of possible cars. It was the C63, S4, IS-F, and of course, the M3. Of these four I wanted to like the IS-F because I believe Lexus has the best service, period. I also like the sales people and have bought several Lexus' over the years from them. I took the IS-F on an extensive test drive, and while the car is capable, it felt cheap. It was the Japanese interpretation of what a sports sedan should be. While some may like it, it wasn't even close to the M. Now the C63 that's a whole different comparison......

[emthreeboy]

I never really liked the ISF, never even went to look at it prior buying the M.

[technik330]

Originally Posted by KIS

I, like many on this forum, had a short list of possible cars. It was the C63, S4, IS-F, and of course, the M3. Of these four I wanted to like the IS-F because I believe Lexus has the best service, period. I also like the sales people and have bought several Lexus' over the years from them. I took the IS-F on an extensive test drive, and while the car is capable, it felt cheap. It was the Japanese interpretation of what a sports sedan should be. While some may like it, it wasn't even close to the M. Now the C63 that's a whole different comparison......

Ignorance, at its finest.

[Lexura1414]

Originally Posted by technik330

Ignorance, at its finest.

LOL.. I agree

[SUB-ZERO]

Originally Posted by KIS

I, like many on this forum, had a short list of possible cars. It was the C63, S4, IS-F, and of course, the M3. Of these four I wanted to like the IS-F because I believe Lexus has the best service, period. I also like the sales people and have bought several Lexus' over the years from them. I took the IS-F on an extensive test drive, and while the car is capable, it felt cheap. It was the Japanese interpretation of what a sports sedan should be. While some may like it, it wasn't even close to the M. Now the C63 that's a whole different comparison......

I too test drove an IS-F prior to test driving the m3. I was very impressed with the IS-F and almost purchased it. However, when I drove the m3, I was really blown away and ended up purchasing the m3. Now that I have had my m3 for over a year, I truely beleive that I made the right choice. So much so, that I ended trading my RX350 for a X5d.

The only thing that I miss about my Lexus, is the service. Although BMW of Arlington has moved to Alexandria and they have a really nice new facility, the Lexus service is still better. Hell, my Infiniti dealer had better service than BMW.

However, whether I'm driving the X5 or the M3, I am always so happy to have purchased them that service comes in second.

As a note, I didn't feel like the IS-F has a cheap interior as some pointed out. Actually, the interior on the IS-F is a bit more sporty than that of the M3 in my opinion...especially the factory carbon trim. I did feel however, especially after driving the ///M, that the Lexus' steering was a bit numb and that is was not as balanced as the ///M. Lexus cars in general seem to share that same trait...they are just boring to drive. My RX350 was so boring to drive, that I felt like sleeping every time I was behind the wheel. With my X5, I always feel engaged and ready to drive!

Just my two cents...

-SZ

[technik330]

^

Thank you for posting an IS-F commentary worth reading.

I'm no more a fan of the IS-F than I am of the M3; I'm truly baffled by some of the narrow minded tools posting in this thread.

For the record, I'm cognizant that this is m3post...

Getting back on point, I would suggest driving a '10, but more likely an '11 model.

I'm going to try and get a crack at driving one this weekend, lots of changes from the '08, even the '10 model.

[Dave07997S]

I think the ISF is a great car and will make some stiff competition...on paper. The fact is the price is so close to the M3s, that why not just buy the M3. In fact I have to wonder if the people who bought the ISF did so just to not buy an M3. I drove a 2010 ISF and thought the car was a awesome ride, I didn't get to do burnouts out the drive but I did get to drive a tad rapidly and the low end torque really felt good. Its just the M3 even in Sedan form lookes more svelt, more purposeful. I also totally disliked the rear end of these cars, especially the hideous rear exhaust....they just had to be so different, yet it doesn't work.



I think its great that Lexus really stepped up the oats for this car to compete with the M3, competetion is good. However, I obviously put my money where my mouth is.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by technik330

^

Thank you for posting an IS-F commentary worth reading.

I'm no more a fan of the IS-F than I am of the M3; I'm truly baffled by some of the narrow minded tools posting in this thread.

For the record, I'm cognizant that this is m3post...

Getting back on point, I would suggest driving a '10, but more likely an '11 model.

I'm going to try and get a crack at driving one this weekend, lots of changes from the '08, even the '10 model.

You'll be pleasently surprised...what I found really nice with this car is you don't have to get on it to get it going. The M3 needs some prodding to get the revs up to scoot, then you look like a jack ass like you want to race. The ISF really cruises yet scootes with ease.

Dave

[SUB-ZERO]

Originally Posted by technik330

^

Thank you for posting an IS-F commentary worth reading.

I'm no more a fan of the IS-F than I am of the M3; I'm truly baffled by some of the narrow minded tools posting in this thread.

For the record, I'm cognizant that this is m3post...

Getting back on point, I would suggest driving a '10, but more likely an '11 model.

I'm going to try and get a crack at driving one this weekend, lots of changes from the '08, even the '10 model.

I general, Lexus makes a great product. I am sure that two years into the IS-F, Lexus has learned a few tricks that will make the IS-F more engaging to drive. However, now that the BMW bug has bitten me, it would be really tough to trade in any of my Beemers for a Lexus...unless of course it is an LFA...LOL! Obviously, if Lexus is capable of building a car like the LFA, I am sure they can make the IS-F better so only time will tell. I wish BMW would build a car like an LF-A....but less expensive

-SZ

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

I think the ISF is a great car and will make some stiff competition...on paper. The fact is the price is so close to the M3s, that why not just buy the M3. In fact I have to wonder if the people who bought the ISF did so just to not buy an M3. I drove a 2010 ISF and thought the car was a awesome ride, I didn't get to do burnouts out the drive but I did get to drive a tad rapidly and the low end torque really felt good. Its just the M3 even in Sedan form lookes more svelt, more purposeful. I also totally disliked the rear end of these cars, especially the hideous rear exhaust....they just had to be so different, yet it doesn't work.

I think its great that Lexus really stepped up the oats for this car to compete with the M3, competetion is good. However, I obviously put my money where my mouth is.

Good discussion.

I find it interesting that you are suggesting that the price is reasonably close down there. The price disparity is enormous up here. I paid $74K for mine and a similarly equipped M3 was in the high $80K's. Imo, the $15K premium wasn't worth it. I looked at a Frozen Grey 2011 E93 M3 at the dealership the other day when my X5 was in....$6100 option for the paint....$109 000 in total.

I had actually tried to pick up a C63 first. It was only $78K but a 5 month wait, hence the Lexus. They are all very good cars and closer than some people care to admit.

Originally Posted by SUB-ZERO

I general, Lexus makes a great product. I am sure that two years into the IS-F, Lexus has learned a few tricks that will make the IS-F more engaging to drive. However, now that the BMW bug has bitten me, it would be really tough to trade in any of my Beemers for a Lexus...unless of course it is an LFA...LOL! Obviously, if Lexus is capable of building a car like the LFA, I am sure they can make the IS-F better so only time will tell. I wish BMW would build a car like an LF-A....but less expensive

-SZ

It is pretty amazing that Lexus has put up numbers only 3 years later that will match or best the M3. Yes, I realize that the M3 is almost due for a model change and that it will hopefully improve, but the rapid progression of Lexus' performance segment is quite an accomplishment.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

Good discussion.

I find it interesting that you are suggesting that the price is reasonably close down there. The price disparity is enormous up here. I paid $74K for mine and a similarly equipped M3 was in the high $80K's. Imo, the $15K premium wasn't worth it. I looked at a Frozen Grey 2011 E93 M3 at the dealership the other day when my X5 was in....$6100 option for the paint....$109 000 in total.

I had actually tried to pick up a C63 first. It was only $78K but a 5 month wait, hence the Lexus. They are all very good cars and closer than some people care to admit.



It is pretty amazing that Lexus has put up numbers only 3 years later that will match or best the M3. Yes, I realize that the M3 is almost due for a model change and that it will hopefully improve, but the rapid progression of Lexus' performance segment is quite an accomplishment.

Base price for a Lexus ISF is right under $60k as is a E92 M3 coupe, while the sedan is right at $56k.

Now when you option them out they actually are quite close here.

Dave

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

Base price for a Lexus ISF is right under $60k as is a E92 M3 coupe, while the sedan is right at $56k.

Now when you option them out they actually are quite close here.

Dave

I just built similar ones on the US sites. Full load IS F is $64 770. Similarly equipped M3 sedan (not loaded) is $73 375 and can still go further from there.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

I just built similar ones on the US sites. Full load IS F is $64 770. Similarly equipped M3 sedan (not loaded) is $73 375 and can still go further from there.

I got 69,055 when you add the sport wheels and tires which are right at $4k.

DCT is not an auto but the one I configured came in at $72,375..so yea a tad more...but I'd still rather have the M3.

One other thing..if you want a 6MT your only option is the M3.

Dave

[SCCAForums.com]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

DCT is not an auto but the one I configured came in at $72,375..so yea a tad more...but I'd still rather have the M3.

Dave

As long as you're ok with it being slower in a straight line, slower on the road course, get worse gas mileage, and have anemic torque below 5,000 that is clearly your right.

PS... Apples to apples.. comparably equipped with Nav, IS-F is $64K to M3 Sedan 72K (You don't need the F-Sport wheels... it's purely a style change... both are 19" unlike BMW, where standard is 18")

[davcrz5]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

I got 69,055 when you add the sport wheels and tires which are right at $4k.

DCT is not an auto but the one I configured came in at $72,375..so yea a tad more...but I'd still rather have the M3.

One other thing..if you want a 6MT your only option is the M3.

Dave

Hey Dave

I paid $61,200.00 for my 2011 USB IS-F fully loaded with nav, sunroof, 19 rims, ipod adapter, ML sound systems , alcantara and leather seats, HIDs, LSD, etc. IMO the only option thats is worth getting would be custom color seats such as alpine white or new orange and black seats. Like stated early this is cool discuss regarding these to fine beasties.

By the way my name is Dave also two cool names for two cool cars lol

[technik330]

Originally Posted by SCCAForums.com

As long as you're ok with it being slower in a straight line, slower on the road course, get worse gas mileage, and have anemic torque below 5,000 that is clearly your right.

PS... Apples to apples.. comparably equipped with Nav, IS-F is $64K to M3 Sedan 72K (You don't need the F-Sport wheels... it's purely a style change... both are 19" unlike BMW, where standard is 18")

Your posts have made me a couple of times. It's good to know someone with racing experience, not to mention a previous owner of an e9x M3, has so many good things to say about an IS-F.

What I would like to ask you is how you feel about going from a manual to the automatic in the IS-F, do you miss having a manual car?

I've only ever owned manual cars and I'm, somewhat, concerned that I might grow bored of an automatic transmission in a sports car.

I also wanted to ask where you believe the M3 has the edge over the IS-F?

Thanks,

-Chris

[ss134]

Good comparison on Top Gear: