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      03-17-2008, 11:43 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by M-Maika View Post
If i were you i would go for the M3.
-Less waiting time.
-More beautiful
-Can take 2 extra passengers
-Cheaper
-Good performance

bs the other car is just a nissan ( what a crap of brand )
Shore they are japanese and they know what they are doing, but its a Nissan.

My 2 cents
I'd say the same thing if I could barely speak english. Must make you cry that the M3 can't hang with the crappy Nissan.
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      03-17-2008, 12:08 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS View Post
I'd say the same thing if I could barely speak english. Must make you cry that the M3 can't hang with the crappy Nissan.
Try your reply to him in Spanish and see you you do.
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      03-17-2008, 01:21 PM   #47
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I just talked to the sales person who was going to sell me a GTR for +$5000 said not to expect a car for 1+ year as they are not getting enough so there are too many people ahead of me even to take a deposit. I'm on the waiting list just to get on the waiting list it would seem.

Likely if I can't locate a GTR w/o a huge mark-up I'll not get one.

--

My point is if the GTR is selling true for msrp +$20K then it's not so big a deal, I'll wait. I was asking myself if I'd pay $10K (more than a M3) to get a GTR but if it's +$30K more than a M3 that's not hard for me to say I won't need it.

the M3 is way more here and now, bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. if I can make up my mind about the 6MT or DCT it'd be almost ready to order.
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      03-18-2008, 04:04 AM   #48
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      03-18-2008, 10:37 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS View Post
Oh, and don't forget. the M in M3 is supposed to stand for motorsport. If that is the case, why shouldn't anyone compare the M3 to the best performance cars around the world, ESPECIALLY if its the exact same price as the M3? Oh thats right, the M now stands for marketing.
BMW Motorsports is running the 485bhp E92 M3 ALMS GT2 this year, a race prepped version of the road car. As far as I can recall, I don't remember seeing Nissan running any Skyline or GT-R in any major GT series... other than the fake Japanese Super GT series with a 4.5L V8. If you want to talk about motorsports credentials or racing heritage, the GT-R isn't even close.

But not having the motorsports credentials of the M3 doesn't take anything away from the fact the GT-R is a great road car.
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      03-18-2008, 10:52 AM   #50
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GTR has great performance, but its a Nissan and it looks it too!!!! Would pay for that car at all!!! Just my personal feeling!!!
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      03-18-2008, 11:01 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by dechoong View Post
BMW Motorsports is running the 485bhp E92 M3 ALMS GT2 this year, a race prepped version of the road car. As far as I can recall, I don't remember seeing Nissan running any Skyline or GT-R in any major GT series... other than the fake Japanese Super GT series with a 4.5L V8. If you want to talk about motorsports credentials or racing heritage, the GT-R isn't even close.

But not having the motorsports credentials of the M3 doesn't take anything away from the fact the GT-R is a great road car.
The GT-R has been racing for a quite a while, and if you don't know also has quite a history as the Skyline. Even if the GT-R doesn't race where the M3's are, at least I can compare the cars that are being sold, which conveniently come at the same price. And that is where the M3 gets humbled, and comparisons between the GT-R and M3 based on performance are laughable. Like I said earlier, it will take the M3 at least 2-3 generations to reach the performance level of the GT-R. That is a SHOCKING 14-21 years, and really emphasizes just how far ahead of the curve the GT-R is.
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      03-18-2008, 11:32 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS View Post
The GT-R has been racing for a quite a while, and if you don't know also has quite a history as the Skyline. Even if the GT-R doesn't race where the M3's are, at least I can compare the cars that are being sold, which conveniently come at the same price. And that is where the M3 gets humbled, and comparisons between the GT-R and M3 based on performance are laughable. Like I said earlier, it will take the M3 at least 2-3 generations to reach the performance level of the GT-R. That is a SHOCKING 14-21 years, and really emphasizes just how far ahead of the curve the GT-R is.
I'm stressing the M3 motorsports and racing heritage which you denied. You don't see the Skyline or GT-R competing with the M3 because their racing cars do not meet the FIA GT homologation requirements... meaning the race car has to be based on the road cars that they sell. The GT-R in the Japanese Super GT series uses a one off 4.5L V8, and it's not even a 4wd like the road going version. Hence you won't find a Skyline (in the past) or a GT-R in the prestigious European or American LeMans series under the GT category. The E92 M3 has more in common with its racing version than the GT-R will ever be.

Besides, what is so surprising that the GT-R outperforms the E92 M3? Take into account the GT-R has a 3.8L V6 vs 4L V8 (very close in displacement), but with twin turbochargers and a very advanced 4wd hardware, I'm sure Nissan engineers would commit seppuku if the GT-R only matches the performance of the M3. However, I'm truly impressed that they can do it at such competitive price
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      03-18-2008, 11:57 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS View Post
Like I said earlier, it will take the M3 at least 2-3 generations to reach the performance level of the GT-R. That is a SHOCKING 14-21 years, and really emphasizes just how far ahead of the curve the GT-R is.
Source? Dude for all you know, in 21 years the new M3 will be electric with 2000 hp and 2000 tq at an instant and constant since it'll run on electricity. You see, I can site out a BS opinion too............
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      03-18-2008, 12:01 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dechoong View Post
I'm stressing the M3 motorsports and racing heritage which you denied. You don't see the Skyline or GT-R competing with the M3 because their racing cars do not meet the FIA GT homologation requirements... meaning the race car has to be based on the road cars that they sell. The GT-R in the Japanese Super GT series uses a one off 4.5L V8, and it's not even a 4wd like the road going version. Hence you won't find a Skyline (in the past) or a GT-R in the prestigious European or American LeMans series under the GT category. The E92 M3 has more in common with its racing version than the GT-R will ever be.

Besides, what is so surprising that the GT-R outperforms the E92 M3? Take into account the GT-R has a 3.8L V6 vs 4L V8 (very close in displacement), but with twin turbochargers and a very advanced 4wd hardware, I'm sure Nissan engineers would commit seppuku if the GT-R only matches the performance of the M3. However, I'm truly impressed that they can do it at such competitive price
Very well put, thanks for all of this information that I had no idea!! I always wondered why the Japanese cars do not compete on GT series.
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      03-18-2008, 12:04 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisFastM3 View Post
Source? Dude for all you know, in 21 years the new M3 will be electric with 2000 hp and 2000 tq at an instant and constant since it'll run on electricity. You see, I can site out a BS opinion too............
Hahahaha!! Agree entirely!! Maybe 2,500 hp!! Anway, I agree that to say the M3 need 21 years to "catch up" to the GTR seems a bit stretched to say the least!!
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      03-18-2008, 12:16 PM   #56
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Source? Dude for all you know, in 21 years the new M3 will be electric with 2000 hp and 2000 tq at an instant and constant since it'll run on electricity. You see, I can site out a BS opinion too............
Yea, except you sound much more ridiculous. At the very least, the next 7 years the M3 will be dominated by the GT-R. If you used your brain and any logic, you would see that with the incremental improvments the M3 makes in its history, it won't be approaching the current GT-R even in its next generation. So it would take at least 2-3 generations.
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      03-18-2008, 12:57 PM   #57
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. The GT-R in the Japanese Super GT series uses a one off 4.5L V8, and it's not even a 4wd like the road going version.
FYI: the longer term plan is to use the 3.8tt motor, but it's not ready for racing yet, in the interim the engine that was used in the 350Z based car is being used.
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      03-18-2008, 02:25 PM   #58
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FYI: the longer term plan is to use the 3.8tt motor, but it's not ready for racing yet, in the interim the engine that was used in the 350Z based car is being used.
Till then... currently none of the Japanese racers in the GT500 class is using an engine that has anything to do with their road cars. The old Skyline certainly wasn't using the TT in-line 6 what was then Japan GT days.
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      03-18-2008, 02:49 PM   #59
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maybe that can help you decide.

So huge...
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      03-18-2008, 03:04 PM   #60
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Hmmm, based on the GT-R website the GT-R is 40mm longer than the M3, but its also 80mm narrower and 54mm shorter.

So yeah its a real whale!!!
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      03-18-2008, 03:04 PM   #61
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maybe that can help you decide.

So huge...
Holy S**t! ... and I thought the old Skyline was a little too bulky.
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      03-18-2008, 04:27 PM   #62
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Yea, except you sound much more ridiculous. At the very least, the next 7 years the M3 will be dominated by the GT-R. If you used your brain and any logic, you would see that with the incremental improvments the M3 makes in its history, it won't be approaching the current GT-R even in its next generation. So it would take at least 2-3 generations.
All I'm saying is that nobody can look that far in the future....... I was just trying to prove a point. 2,000hp, 200,000hp, whatever. Just making a point.

For instance, lets say just for the hell of it the GT-R greatly reduces the M3's sales & they don't reach the 100,000 car mark they set out for. Do you think those inginous German engineers are gonna sit there & go "oh well"?

Sorry for going a bit off topic
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      03-18-2008, 04:33 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by BMW335icDDS View Post
I'd say the same thing if I could barely speak english. Must make you cry that the M3 can't hang with the crappy Nissan.

Im not buying an M3 to race with GT-R.
If i wanted to kick ass nissan i would buy a Veyron.
All the GT-R owners could get another 2 or 3 turbos more and even so would take up the ass.

Barely speak English !!!

You are such a looser.
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      03-18-2008, 05:30 PM   #64
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Im not buying an M3 to race with GT-R.
If i wanted to kick ass nissan i would buy a Veyron.
All the GT-R owners could get another 2 or 3 turbos more and even so would take up the ass.

Barely speak English !!!

You are such a looser.
Hey, if I couldn't argue intelligently either, I'd probably resort to name calling like you. I'm sure you don't have the means to buy a Veyron, but the GT-R has Veyron like performance (actually it beats it on the Nurburgring). Yea, I must be such a loser since I worked hard to attain a well respected job with a 997S in my garage along with the 335 Vert. Not to mention being on a waitlist for the GT-R. Yea, I must be such a loser.
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      03-18-2008, 05:34 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by ChrisFastM3 View Post
All I'm saying is that nobody can look that far in the future....... I was just trying to prove a point. 2,000hp, 200,000hp, whatever. Just making a point.

For instance, lets say just for the hell of it the GT-R greatly reduces the M3's sales & they don't reach the 100,000 car mark they set out for. Do you think those inginous German engineers are gonna sit there & go "oh well"?

Sorry for going a bit off topic
Point well taken. My point was simply that the next M3 most likely won't be as fast as this gen's GT-R, so to buy the next M3 that can do what the GT-R can do right now will probably be in 2-3 generations.
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      03-18-2008, 05:38 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by dechoong View Post
I'm stressing the M3 motorsports and racing heritage which you denied. You don't see the Skyline or GT-R competing with the M3 because their racing cars do not meet the FIA GT homologation requirements... meaning the race car has to be based on the road cars that they sell. The GT-R in the Japanese Super GT series uses a one off 4.5L V8, and it's not even a 4wd like the road going version. Hence you won't find a Skyline (in the past) or a GT-R in the prestigious European or American LeMans series under the GT category. The E92 M3 has more in common with its racing version than the GT-R will ever be.

Besides, what is so surprising that the GT-R outperforms the E92 M3? Take into account the GT-R has a 3.8L V6 vs 4L V8 (very close in displacement), but with twin turbochargers and a very advanced 4wd hardware, I'm sure Nissan engineers would commit seppuku if the GT-R only matches the performance of the M3. However, I'm truly impressed that they can do it at such competitive price

Well, here's my argument. If heritage and racing in a prestigeous league means so much, why then does it not translate to the success of their street cars? You did say that the racing series is based off street cars right? I will not pretend I know much about these racing series, because I don't. But I do know that when it came to street car versions of these race cars, the M3 got massively outclassed. And for the one putting the photo of how "massive" the GT-R is, whats more amazing is that it outhandles the M3 despite its size. It is faster around corners and corners better. Thats amazing.

Oh yea, last time I checked, the E92 M3 wasn't exactly the smallest or lightest M3 ever made either.
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