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      03-16-2008, 04:17 AM   #1
Vyruz Reaper
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My Chrisitan G/F... help? maybe?

So, i meet this girl awhile ago, <insert love story here> and she is a Christian.

The question here is Marriage. We "love" each other and are at the point where we want to make commitments knowing that a few years down the line we are getting married. Lemme break the story to you.

Me - I was born into a non religious family Islamic family. My parents moved here from Iran in the 70s and they didnt believe in Islam. Today, i personally do not believe in islam either. I believe myself to be a pretty good person, am a firm believer of showing love to everyone(most of my beliefs reminisce Christianity) I BELIEVE in God. I like to look at every side of everything, and am a very open-minded person

Her - She is born into a a religious christian family. She is egyptian, born in the US just like me. She goes to the Eastern Coptic Orthodox church. Now this is where the story gets tricky. Her mom unfortunately passed away like 4 years ago. It was very hard on her, and it seemed around that time period she has lost faith in the chruch. She still goes, still practices Christianity, but she even tells me her faith is not strong(which i dont believe , either you have faith or not... but maybe im wrong). Her last relationship ended cuz he was catholic and she christian and she and her family wanted him to convert and he wanted her to convert. Now moving to us. when we meet, she warned me about her religion stance, that she could only be with a christian. After getting to know each other longer, we ended falling in love. Now the problem is that her dad does not want to meet me and tells her she cannot marry me unless im christian. Its been going on like this for a while now. She goes back on forth on how she feels. one minute she says u have to convertto christian to marry me the other is i will marry you even if your not BUT my dad wont let me. I dunno haha its really confusing.

Sorry its like 2 in the morning and im kinda tired typing this. I consider myself kinda a smart guy. I have had NUMEROUS convos regarding religion.

it seems she is relying on the fact that i would convert to christianity cuz i want to and not just to marry her. Which is true, but i dont know if i want to become christian. Here is WHy:

1) i dont beleive that if you are not a christian you will "burn in hell" like the bible states
2) The debate over evolution - doesnt this discredit the bible and religion in general?
3) The non acceptance of other religions is crazy to me. Why cant i be christian and believe that that other muslim guy or jew guy is going to heaven too? (well i know this, cuz thats the words of Jesus, and all he wanted is ppl to believe in him and they will go to heaven)
4) the discrimination of other people and religions
5) Did Jesus christ have a wife? kids? even tho he did or didnt, why couldnt he be a father and yet still be divine and do all the magical things he did? I mean for me to even think like this i would get kicked out of a church, but to me its possible and i dont want to think its not just cuz christianty tells me its not
6) so many problems with the bible, and the fact that we dont know even when it was wrtten can me that some information can be wrong or slightly off.
7) I WILL NOT TELL MY KIDS THAT THE MUST BE CHRISTIAN AND FORCE THEM TO CHURCH AND TELL THEM THEY CANNOT MARRY SOMEONE IF NOT THEY ARE NOT CHRISTIAN (I Believe in choice, if you are forced to love God, is that really Love? No ppl must decide themselves, and forcing my kids which at that time they wont be able to make the decision is something i do not want ot do. if they want ot becoming chrsitian when they can make that choice great. If they want to remain non religious and believe in god greaty. Islam? great. Buddhist? great. etc etc)


I am open to becoming christian but i DO NOT and WILL NOT adopt such things as "if you are not christian you will burn in hell" or any other irrational thing to me i read in the bible.



So i am stuck. She wants to Marry me yes. Her problem is her religion, and its tied to her family. It seems more that the fact that her family is religious and thats forcing her hand, otherwise we would be engaged already. She accepts me for who i am, and loves the way i dont jump to conclusions, and look at the bigger picture. We really fit well together, and i support her for her religion. I do not want her to stop her faith cuz of me.

any input would be great. Thanks guys, BTW im 23 and she is on her way into med school, and im on ym why to get my MBA, after taking a few years of of school to be a broker(damn real estate is sucking right now... haha)
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      03-16-2008, 05:39 AM   #2
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It's not if you're not Christian, this "religion" you burn in hell. It simply states if you do not believe that Jesus Christ is your lord and savior, you will burn in hell as you were damned from birth.

Religion and belief is a very touchy subject. My suggestion is don't fake yourself out by trying to believe you will "convert" for this girl. My personal opinion is that doesn't seem genuine therefore deems itself as worthless.

Don't let her stop her faith and you should believe what you believe in. Just love each other and give each other everything you guys got.
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      03-16-2008, 07:57 AM   #3
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I think if you really want your questions answered you should speak with a Christian Pastor and ask him those questions. Try going with your girlfriend to her church and ask her Pastor about your concerns. You're in luck because it's Sunday
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      03-16-2008, 08:20 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyruz Reaper View Post
So i am stuck. She wants to Marry me yes. Her problem is her religion, and its tied to her family. It seems more that the fact that her family is religious and thats forcing her hand, otherwise we would be engaged already.

any input would be great. Thanks guys, BTW im 23 and she is on her way into med school, and im on ym why to get my MBA, after taking a few years of of school to be a broker(damn real estate is sucking right now... haha)
It looks like you guys have some more time (school). I would work on convincing the family, try and become more integrated into it, in the meantime. You're still young...

Religion is a pain in these scenarios...
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      03-16-2008, 09:48 AM   #5
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Personally I would never marry anyone who would not accept me for who I am.

That said, if you're willing to accomodate her and her family's belief, I'd bring those issues up with her.

"7) I WILL NOT TELL MY KIDS THAT THE MUST BE CHRISTIAN AND FORCE THEM TO CHURCH AND TELL THEM THEY CANNOT MARRY SOMEONE IF NOT THEY ARE NOT CHRISTIAN"

This is the big one, talk with this about her.

As for the rest of your questions, it sounds like you wouldn't find anything objectionable in a moderate christian church of any denomination. Most moderate churches focus more on the message than the mythology, and are very inclusive.

It's only the whackos that want to draw lines of division between themselves and others. This isn't what Christianity is really about, just as Islam isn't really about blowing up buildings. It's just a small group of very vocal nutjobs that try to use their religion as an excuse for evil, instead of a tool for good.

That said, if your GFs family are VERY extreme in their beliefs... do some careful thinking. You could have a lot of problems down the line if they're as fundamentalist as you make them seem. If your GF feels the same way, IMO your relationship is doomed given your condradictory beliefs. If her family made her brake it off with the last guy because he was a different kind of christian (catholic instead of orthodox), you might be in for a bumpy ride.
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      03-16-2008, 09:51 AM   #6
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Isnt is there a HOLY ROLLER's site this could be on...

Atheist by the way...
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      03-16-2008, 10:01 AM   #7
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still so many ignorant people out there (her family).......fretting over f**king religion. Haha, what a joke.

Screw her silly family and tell her to stop being so silly too and marry you.
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      03-16-2008, 11:27 AM   #8
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I'd be careful on this one. There are other issues that come from it. I'm non-catholic/ christian and I ended up marrying a Jehovah's Witness. Thats a tough one! The parents didn't care. My parents were so pissed, they didn't come to the wedding. Things went well for 15years and now we have kids. THATS THE TOUGH PART NOW! She has started going back to her meetings and 'would like' to take the kids and i disagree with this. 1 year old and 2 year old will go with whatever if the parents follow it is my thinking. Let them grow up and let them make a decison then.

As for your situation, the question you have to ask is, WHEN WILL IT STOP? Today, be christian or you can't marry my daughter.
Tomorrow, get new friends as they are not following the christian way,
list goes on.........

End result, the choice is up to the 2 of you. The dad has no say unless you plan on living with him. They will come to accept it soon enough. Give it some thought as it's not just a now thing but future (kids etc) as well.

Good luck
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      03-16-2008, 11:59 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FatChicken007 View Post
I think if you really want your questions answered you should speak with a Christian Pastor and ask him those questions. Try going with your girlfriend to her church and ask her Pastor about your concerns. You're in luck because it's Sunday
WOW... thanks guys! i didnt know i would get such response.

I have talked to 2 priests, one of her church, another of a friends. I got some good input, but it seems everyone has their own views of everything. Now as her family, yes they seem extreme, but i never met them, she just makes it seem that way so i dont really know...

as for her not loving me for who i am, i tell her this, and her response is "i cannot tell you that i will marry you if you are not christian, cuz its not a christian thing to say, but i can say is that if you d not convert, i wont leave you"

im like wtf?? hahaha

One thing is true tho, i have NEVER known anything about religion. I guess they dont teach you these things in school. Its such a fascinating subject really. That and evolution and such.

Any other suggestions, i would love to talk about this and answer any question you guys have.

Converting *might* be an option, but i do not want to also convert just to marry her. But im the type of guy that likes to look at all sides, then make a rational, patient decision. But anything regarding religion and evolution seems irrational... haha

thanks guys!
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      03-16-2008, 12:07 PM   #10
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OP is super long. i stopped on first line where it says 'christian'. i think i know the rest of the story.. dump herrrrrrr
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      03-16-2008, 12:45 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyruz Reaper View Post
Any other suggestions, i would love to talk about this and answer any question you guys have.

Converting *might* be an option, but i do not want to also convert just to marry her. But im the type of guy that likes to look at all sides, then make a rational, patient decision. But anything regarding religion and evolution seems irrational... haha

thanks guys!
You have to figure out where to draw the line. How extreme would the intrusion of her religion have to become before it would make you uncomfortable?

In my personal case, I'd be fine with doing a wedding in whatever tradition she wanted, and I'd probably be willing to do a simple rite of some sort if it would make her parents happy. However, I would not be willing to make a personal investment in a spiritual tradition in which I had not interest or faith. I wouldn't be willing to attend gatherings/rites on a chronic basis, nor would I be willing to push her families set of beliefs onto my children. This is just me personally, but you have to think for yourself where YOU would draw the line, and make it clear to her.
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      03-16-2008, 12:52 PM   #12
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If you dont give a shit about religion anyway.......then convert. Who cares, its all such BS anyway....this whole business of religion.

Since all this religion BS is in your head anyway, converting would be nothing. Its not like your physically changing or converting anything, its all in your head. So I'd say, if worse comes to worse, just "convert."

Geez, religion is so f**king silly and stupid. Dont think so? Then just look at this guy's situation at hand. Dont get me wrong though, I do believe in God....and science.

Baba, agar kosseh eyn dohkdareh khobeh, pass negarishdar. Vahgarnar, velish kon baba haha.
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Last edited by Neema; 03-16-2008 at 01:23 PM.
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      03-16-2008, 01:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyruz Reaper View Post

1) i dont beleive that if you are not a christian you will "burn in hell" like the bible states
2) The debate over evolution - doesnt this discredit the bible and religion in general?
3) The non acceptance of other religions is crazy to me. Why cant i be christian and believe that that other muslim guy or jew guy is going to heaven too? (well i know this, cuz thats the words of Jesus, and all he wanted is ppl to believe in him and they will go to heaven)
4) the discrimination of other people and religions
5) Did Jesus christ have a wife? kids? even tho he did or didnt, why couldnt he be a father and yet still be divine and do all the magical things he did? I mean for me to even think like this i would get kicked out of a church, but to me its possible and i dont want to think its not just cuz christianty tells me its not
6) so many problems with the bible, and the fact that we dont know even when it was wrtten can me that some information can be wrong or slightly off.
7) I WILL NOT TELL MY KIDS THAT THE MUST BE CHRISTIAN AND FORCE THEM TO CHURCH AND TELL THEM THEY CANNOT MARRY SOMEONE IF NOT THEY ARE NOT CHRISTIAN (I Believe in choice, if you are forced to love God, is that really Love? No ppl must decide themselves, and forcing my kids which at that time they wont be able to make the decision is something i do not want ot do. if they want ot becoming chrsitian when they can make that choice great. If they want to remain non religious and believe in god greaty. Islam? great. Buddhist? great. etc etc)
Definitely I am not an expert here. But if Christ is not in you, don't fake it. And don't intermarry.

It would be difficult for her to go to church without you if you were married. If she is a Christian, her commitment to the church will ebb and flow. She is at an ebb. In marriage, as the years go by, she would draw nearer to her church, and you would not be there. Her disappointment would become stronger in knowing that her faith is muted by her non-believing husband.

It is best if the man is the spiritual leader of the family. If you cannot be that head, then there is a tremendous disadvantage. From the start the marriage is in trouble. Don't go there.

Right now you feel you have found your mate. That feeling will pass whether you marry her or not. You can be certain of that. It will be very difficult for both of you and for any children. Divorce statistics are already through the roof. In this relationship, the odds are stacked against you.
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      03-16-2008, 01:37 PM   #14
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If she is a Christian, she will have a deep desire to live out her faith. Your not being there in faith and growing in it would be very uncomfortable for you and for her. You would see her wanting to live more of her Christian life while you don't want it. It would be frustrating for her and irritating to you.

A person's faith is their deepest commitment. It goes beyond blood, friendship, love... It is the core of the being. To suppress that to try to please one's spouse robs that person of their life.

Don't go there.

I haven't read this yet, but thought I could give you some idea by pointing to a resource that may be of value for you. http://www.gospel.com/topics/unequally+yoked
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      03-16-2008, 01:39 PM   #15
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You would see her wanting to live more of her Christian life while you don't want it. It would be frustrating for her and irritating to you.
I agree with you on that.
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      03-16-2008, 01:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mantis View Post
OP is super long. i stopped on first line where it says 'christian'. i think i know the rest of the story.. dump herrrrrrr
I agree with the end result.
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      03-16-2008, 01:53 PM   #17
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As a Christian, she knows she should not marry a non-Christian. Her family also has told her so. It is not a matter of not knowing the warnings.

Without having lived long years of marriage to a non-believer she doesn't yet understand. She doesn't believe that it would get worse, rather than better. But she would come to understand. She would cry when you are not there. She might cry while you are there. But her cries would not bring you to Christ. If you are not called by Christ, you are not going to "become a Christian." It's just not possible to fake it with those who know you best. Nor should you fake it.

Find a way out. Then get yourself together and let her get herself together. When the time/place/person is right, you will find your true match. This one isn't it.
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      03-16-2008, 01:58 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Boost_Nation View Post

Baba, agar kosseh eyn dohkdareh khobeh, pass negarishdar. Vahgarnar, velish kon baba haha.
HAHAHAHHAHA kos kesh! i cant stop fucking laughing! funny shit! merci khale mamnoon, but i was her first.... i didnt think it would end up theway it is... she is just to good to walk away form, med school, nice girl, smart.. and she is good looking to boot, ive fucked around with many girls and she is a bit different
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      03-16-2008, 01:58 PM   #19
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I think you have a lot of very important religious questions that a knowledgeable pastor would be able to answer and put your mind at ease. I'd suggest you go with her to church one day and stay and talk to one of the pastors at her church about your questions afterwards. Hope this helps.
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      03-16-2008, 02:03 PM   #20
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HAHAHAHHAHA kos kesh! i cant stop fucking laughing! funny shit! merci khale mamnoon, but i was her first.... i didnt think it would end up theway it is... she is just to good to walk away form, med school, nice girl, smart.. and she is good looking to boot, ive fucked around with many girls and she is a bit different
haha, bezahn beh chak deygeh ahhhhyyy babaaaaa.

But no, I DEFINITELY understand what you mean, and I wouldnt leave a girl like that for something like this either.
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      03-16-2008, 02:13 PM   #21
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As a Christian, she knows she should not marry a non-Christian. Her family also has told her so. It is not a matter of not knowing the warnings.

Without having lived long years of marriage to a non-believer she doesn't yet understand. She doesn't believe that it would get worse, rather than better. But she would come to understand. She would cry when you are not there. She might cry while you are there. But her cries would not bring you to Christ. If you are not called by Christ, you are not going to "become a Christian." It's just not possible to fake it with those who know you best. Nor should you fake it.

Find a way out. Then get yourself together and let her get herself together. When the time/place/person is right, you will find your true match. This one isn't it.

well im not too worried, if she doesnt want marriage or anything, im not going to be devastated.. i dunno that just my personality with girls, after my first relationship my heart broke, and ever since bitches alway come and go.

Here is the thing tho, she knew i was non-christian. She was FORCED being christian as a child, i didnt know her when she was younger or before the passing away of her mom, so i cant tell you too much how she was then. But in my current research of religion and evolution, she is really drawn to seeing thwe world in a non christian way. She doesnt believe that she cannot marry me. But u know thinking about this, even tho she doesnt believe that have to be christian to marry, she s naive in thinking that we would work if she wants to keep her faith.

Here is the problem, i dont know if this religion stuff is BS? maybe it is maybe it isnt. I dont know. Maybe Evolution is real, maybe its bullshit.

ill just ride it out, and see how everything goes, i think thats the best way. Esp. when she goes to med school, she can really help me to get my mba .

I just wont expect anything, well see how it works out
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      03-16-2008, 02:15 PM   #22
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question, is anyone a full fledged christian here? would you marry a non-believer? would you let your kids marry non believers?
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