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      02-23-2008, 11:26 PM   #67
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Wow. What more do you want? The M3 driver has been using that car for months, the GT-R and the GT3 he just got in and drove. I think it is very clear which cars are best at which catagories, in which the M3 would only win in the DRL segment.

I don't understand when people mention fitting two kids in the back and the wife in the front, can't the GT-R do the same? Don't they have the same luxury features? CA? Navi? Heated seats? Power seats? Sound system? Bi-Xenon? I don't know about you, but if I had a wife and two kids I'd rather take the GT-R. Simply because I know my wife can drive it and won't complain about the stick (majority of wives out there). Yes the SMG/XMG is coming out, but that will take a while.

Don't get me wrong, I loved the E36/E46 M3s. When they launched, they were kings of their class. The E92 is a massive dissapointment. I am sure that the CSL will be coming stateside this time, they wouldn't tarnish the M3 name like this. I actually was planning to order the M3 when the concept was released, but thats in the trash now.
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      02-23-2008, 11:46 PM   #68
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The M3 is a looker. I love it, but for roughly the same price, you could be driving a quality Japanese monster like the GT-R.

Ha! Datsun...my mother had a 1981 Datsun King-Cab 4x4 when I was a kid! I haven't heard that name in years. It wasn't the company name though, just the car line name. First Datson, and then Datsun. It was always Nissan and DAT as the corporations. Then Nissan after the merger. I just had to correct his mistated fact.
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      02-24-2008, 12:35 AM   #69
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Let's face the facts...

1. As for the Porsche, the GT3 starts at $107,000. It better be faster than the M3. The fact they are even comparing them is crazy. Car magazines have never compared the M3 against supercars. It says a lot for the M3.
2. As for the GT-R, if I wanted a driving experience like a video game, I'd skip the GT-R and get an Xbox.
3. High power cars on a curvy track: grip is everything. AWD has a huge advantage. Also, the M3 was the driver's own car so the tires were probably hosed (mine will be after about a week).
4. Who wants an AWD car that just keeps it straight all the time. As for me, if you can't slide the backside on command half the fun is gone.
5. Finally, if I wanted an ugly car that went fast I would get a Supra, mod it, and pone every car I ran into like this guy:
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      02-24-2008, 12:42 AM   #70
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guys, pop the pill and cure the heartburn. there will always be a better car out there than the M3...japanese, german, american, british. like what some of you have said in this thread, this comparison is a compliment to the M3 since it's pitted against two monsters, not to mention legends in their own right. BUT it's also stupid, in my opinion....because no matter what that guy does, even if he made a dozen attempts in his M3, he will never match the performance of the two other cars. same goes with lap times. the M3 simply belongs to another performance car category.

as to those calling the GT-R as "it's still a Nissan" or a "ricer" -- good luck to you when a GT-R pulls up beside you in a stop light. don't get me wrong, i am a big BMW fan....but the GT-R is a legend and has a pedigree that was made to compete head-to-head NOT with M3s, M6s, C63s, CLK63s -- but with Porsche 911 Turbos/GT3, Ferrari F430s, Gallardos. ok, enough of the GT-R. M3 is a great car -- let's just enjoy it for what it's made of and capable of doing, and stop comparing it with cars like these.

bring on the CSL!

cheers!
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      02-24-2008, 12:59 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McLarenF1 View Post
Its a compliment to get beat that badly by a ricer?? Sorry im dont see the compliment there.
What are you talking about? I'm not complimenting that at all and not being an apologist for the M3 and GT3 losing to the GT-R. If I'm going to be spending $75k+ for a car, it sure isn't going to be for a Nissan - I don't care HOW fast it is. It's about as stupid of an idea as spending over $90k on a Viper. You're still just driving a Dodge.
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      02-24-2008, 03:11 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROTORHEAD77 View Post
The M3 is a looker. I love it, but for roughly the same price, you could be driving a quality Japanese monster like the GT-R.
In theory not in practice.........it is very apparent that the dealers will be charging plenty over MSRP to get one, so it doesn't matter what the MSRP is, the fact is the GT-R is gonna cost you much more than a loaded M3.

That being said, the GT-R has my attention----looking forward to when we can get a hold of them.
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      02-24-2008, 03:49 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
Did anyone notice the comment about the brakes, 2 laps and at the end of the second lap there was no brakes.
Ummmm. So basically what that guy is saying is that my 330i has better brakes than the M3. After two laps on the Tail of The Dragon (300 corners in 12 miles---so 24 miles of hard braking), my 330i had maybe an extra inch or two of brake pedal travel. Not 4 inches and definitely not no braking. This is concerning. So if you have to stop on the Autobahn at 150MPH, you'll get down to 60MPH and your brakes won't work? WTF. How could BMW let this go? If they don't know how to build brakes why didn't they partner up with Brembo or something?
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      02-24-2008, 03:57 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by rvacha View Post
I think I'd start with the fluid, which clearly boiled, then decide on the Brembos
Sorry for the ignorant question but that's why one gets brake fade? The brake fluid boils? How does that happen? Why does brake fluid get hot to begin with? I thought it was because the brake pads get so hot that they start to get mushy.
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      02-24-2008, 11:05 AM   #75
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Men, one review and everyone gets the panties twisted in a bunch! there is nothing new here, the Skyline has always been faster than any M3 and now people are making a big deal out of nothing, like this is some new phenomena or they just figured out the sun rises from the east and sets in the west.

The brakes issue is funny to me, this guy has thousands of miles on his car, and someone in a 330 is comparing that to a driver who drives his car at the limit most of the time not to mention the nurburg ring, if that's not comedy then I don't know what is, sorry buddy your are not Chris Harry of autocar I doubt your car has been on the limit like his m3 has.

The tyres on his car, were almost bald, trying getting any grip on a 335 with bald tyres and it's 2 degrees outside and then maybe you might understand how much harder it was to lunch an M3 (which has more torque than the 335 to the wheels) with DSC turned all the way off with wheel spin in 2nd gear (most likely around 40 something miles an hour), he simply should have been in MDM mode, which might have helped but still wouldn't have mattered. The GTR is faster, it's automotive technology at it's very best. The exhaust note sounds meh, the front of the car horrendous, but I do like that big booty it got what kind I say I like big butts and I sure as hell don't need to lie about that, lol.

I'm not here defending the M3 to bits but to say the m3 is competition to the GTR is nonsense. The only car Nissan cared about when developing the GTR was the 911 and it clearly shows, it gave the 997 GT3 a whopping on all aspects except (tail-out antics, which you never need in getting the fastest lap), so just because the M3 shares the same price with it, it must be compared? apples and oranges to me not even in the same class a GT car vs. a car that was never even close to a GT, since it started production way back when.

It's funny to see BMW irrational fans who think the M3 is the end to all means compare the care to cars way above it and expect it to win and then say I'm not ordering one, because of 1 review says this and another one says that (sounds like the steering issue to me, everyone feels different about it), who knows that might just mean you never really wanted one in the 1st place. Good luck on the GTR though, hopefully Nissan stealers are not too money hungry like some BMW stealers, lol.

If the car is for you then deal with the shortcoming, as all cars have them but the notion that an m3 can hang with the GTR or the GT3 is more a fanboy dream than anything else, it never has it never will.

Once my 335 lease is done, my next destination is M world (gotta do it before I get wifed up, lol).
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      02-24-2008, 11:12 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d3l0n View Post
how does a chipped turbo e90/e92 kick ass on a e90/e92 m3 btw?
it depends let's see when the M-DCT comes out! some people who test can launch their manual cars
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      02-24-2008, 11:49 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by chitosing View Post
guys, pop the pill and cure the heartburn. there will always be a better car out there than the M3...japanese, german, american, british. like what some of you have said in this thread, this comparison is a compliment to the M3 since it's pitted against two monsters, not to mention legends in their own right. BUT it's also stupid, in my opinion....because no matter what that guy does, even if he made a dozen attempts in his M3, he will never match the performance of the two other cars. same goes with lap times. the M3 simply belongs to another performance car category.

as to those calling the GT-R as "it's still a Nissan" or a "ricer" -- good luck to you when a GT-R pulls up beside you in a stop light. don't get me wrong, i am a big BMW fan....but the GT-R is a legend and has a pedigree that was made to compete head-to-head NOT with M3s, M6s, C63s, CLK63s -- but with Porsche 911 Turbos/GT3, Ferrari F430s, Gallardos. ok, enough of the GT-R. M3 is a great car -- let's just enjoy it for what it's made of and capable of doing, and stop comparing it with cars like these.

bring on the CSL!

cheers!
+1

Couldn't have said it better. Nissan designed the GT-R with the 911 Turbo in its sight from the 1st sketch. As for the M3, as long it's the best in its class (ie. C63 AMG, RS4, IS-F), it's good enough for me.
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      02-24-2008, 03:20 PM   #78
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I thought this might interest you lot regarding the time that the M3 did on these bald tyres you are going on about. Re-cap, his time on his flying lap was 1:07.4, well surprise, surprise, when earlier on Autocar did their British Driver's Car of the Year awards which featured the M3 (different car, same tyres) it's best time was 1:07.1, that was a whole 3 tenths slower that Chris's own car with these balding tyres.

I know it's on a different day and everything but it does prove a small point that you are looking for excuses where there aren't any. The simple truth is on this course the M3 isn't that special.

P.S.
I thought it best to post all of the times from that day just to prove that the M3's time wasn't the only similarities and will include these most recent times in red.
Lotus 2-Eleven : 1m02.75s
Porsche GT3RS : 1m03.60s
Lambo LP640 : 1m03.80s
Nissan GTR : 1m04.00s
Audi R8v8 : 1m04.10s
Porsche GT3 : 1m04.30s
Mercedes SLK55 : 1m06.60s
BMW M3 : 1m07.10s
BMW M3 : 1m07.40s
Porsche CaymanS :1m08.10s
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      02-24-2008, 03:46 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
I thought this might interest you lot regarding the time that the M3 did on these bald tyres you are going on about.
Chris describes them as "slightly worm rubber" - did I miss bald somewhere?
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      02-24-2008, 04:04 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thooooorgal View Post
great videos.

I don't understand you .... of course the M3 is a slower track car than those 2, you didn't know that ???

Now, a new test for those 3 cars :

- go to the shop 2 km from here, take your wife and 2 kids, get back with a lot of stuff ... who will win ?

You have a car, able to do that, and also which is not ridiculous on the track, and could be tested again super-cars .

I'm happy with that ... M3 all the way !

You do know that the GTR has back seats and a trunk just like the M3 right?
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      02-24-2008, 04:55 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvacha View Post
Chris describes them as "slightly worm rubber" - did I miss bald somewhere?
I was referring to the comments made by Simple1

Quote:
The tyres on his car, were almost bald, trying getting any grip on a 335 with bald tyres and it's 2 degrees outside and then maybe you might understand how much harder it was to lunch an M3 (which has more torque than the 335 to the wheels) with DSC turned all the way off with wheel spin in 2nd gear (most likely around 40 something miles an hour), he simply should have been in MDM mode, which might have helped but still wouldn't have mattered. The GTR is faster, it's automotive technology at it's very best. The exhaust note sounds meh, the front of the car horrendous, but I do like that big booty it got what kind I say I like big butts and I sure as hell don't need to lie about that, lol.
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      02-25-2008, 12:31 AM   #82
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All those who are running to put green down on the GT-R after seeing this.... I just want to remind you of 1 very important thing.... It's a NISSAN.

Save up a few more pennies and go buy a base model Porsche Carrera. It may not be the fastest $90k car out there, but at least it's not a NISSAN!!!

enuf said.
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      02-25-2008, 01:37 AM   #83
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I guess we will have to see what the CSL will do?

0-60 in over 5 sec?....ouch
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      02-25-2008, 02:19 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Celsius View Post
your BMW M3 will DEPRECIATE quicker than that Nissan GTR!
u r so right. BMW does hold the award for the next 5yrs to be the best cars with the best depreciation value.

Last edited by d3l0n; 02-25-2008 at 04:13 AM.
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      02-25-2008, 06:43 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronno111 View Post
All those who are running to put green down on the GT-R after seeing this.... I just want to remind you of 1 very important thing.... It's a NISSAN.

Save up a few more pennies and go buy a base model Porsche Carrera. It may not be the fastest $90k car out there, but at least it's not a NISSAN!!!

enuf said.
Have fun trying to tell that to the GT-R that just smoked you at the stoplight/track. You can honk your horn to try to get his attention, but chances are he'll be so far ahead he wouldn't hear you even if your overrevved your engine.

Jokes aside, I buy cars because I love to drive them. I don't buy cars to tell people I drive them. If you want to brand shop, thats fine by me. It helps with the MSRP problem we've been having over at the Nissan camp. $10k markup on a Nissan? Last time I checked no 997 was commanding a markup. Even worse for the Caymans/Boxsters which are almost always below MSRP.
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      02-25-2008, 08:36 AM   #86
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Edmunds

Balance and body control of the GT-R are extraordinary through faster,
bumpy bends that will have the 911 unsettled enough to make the driver lose confidence.

It all seems superbly well screwed together, as you'd expect of a Nissan,
and the quality of the materials is high.

It's a big, solid car you can rely on when the going gets tricky,


Automobile

we immediately noticed the GT-R's stiff structure and suspension setup.

While stiff, the GT-R reveals a level of dampening and overall suspension feel that few other cars carry. From the ultra precise and intuitive
steering to the powerful brakes, the GT-R is able to maintain over-the-road speed that will, hold on for this, likely embarrass nearly every
other production car in the world. Even with the adjustable Bilstein dampers in their stiffest setting, the GT-R is never harsh and it soaks up
potholes and frost heaves like a rally car. Body control, front-end grip, overall balance, engine response,
and transmission shift speed all come together to yield a mega car with a mega pace.

Overall, the car feels very secure and fast with a well-balanced chassis.


Car (UK)

There is none of the styling poetry of a Porsche or, even more, a Ferrari, but the Nissan is bank-vault solidly built

AutoCar (UK)

As for the interior, it makes you wonder just how heavily Porsche relies on its reputation to charge as much as it does for a 911 Turbo.
The GT-R is as well made if not better than the Porsche inside

Top Gear (UK)

before you've even fired it up - via the red starter button - the GT-R communicates solidity. You can feel it in the
rim of the steering wheel, in the interior controls. It's not messing. Frankly, it feels like a truck.


Doors, seats, wheel, controls: all have a delicacy the Nissan doesn't. Some also have a flimsiness the Nissan doesn't. (in comparison to the Audi R8)

Its body control over these bumps and crests is breathtaking. You just know that this car had been meticulously engineered down to the last tiny grommet. To put it another way, it's making the R8 look very secondhand indeed.

I can see in my mirrors that Germany is struggling to keep up with Japan. When we swap, it's clear that the Audi's 59bhp power deficit isn't the only
reason why.
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      02-25-2008, 09:35 AM   #87
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Of course the M3 isn't as quick as the GT-R or the GT3, but he didn't even come close to what the M3 can do. 5.2 to 60? Come on! I can't help but wonder if it being his personal car had any impact.
The guy driving the car doesn´t now how to shift a 6MT properly.
Of course with the GT-R it is just pedal to the floor. ( much easyer ).
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      02-25-2008, 11:23 AM   #88
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The guy driving the car doesn´t now how to shift a 6MT properly.
Of course with the GT-R it is just pedal to the floor. ( much easyer ).
Sorry mate but you are way off the mark with a comment like that, Chris is a decent pilot and better than most here.

But regarding this plain awful time that the M3 and GT3 produced, it must have been something to do with the surface on the day. But bags the question, does anyone know what the acceleration time of an M3 when tested with M-Dynamic mode ON vs DSC off. It would be an interesting marker for those of you who happen to partake in traffic-light fun.
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