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      02-22-2008, 07:08 AM   #23
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I have to disagree with you on this one. I do not get the R8 at all. Talk about overpiced. For another 10-15K you can have a 997tt which will crush the R8. I really like the idea of a mid-engine sports car, but for that price the R8 needs another 50-60 horsepower. I'd rather have a 2wd C2S with Porsche Sports Exhaust for $25-30k less.
I think the problem here is the price difference that Audis are in the US compared to Europe against it's rivals. Over here the R8 competes with the C4S and sorry but for me the Audi R8 is by far the classier car and it's handling is truly incredible which builds confidence like no other.

I believe it's the pricing policy that Audi has in the States that lead to the continuing discussion that we always have.
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      02-22-2008, 07:15 AM   #24
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I think the problem here is the price difference that Audis are in the US compared to Europe against it's rivals. Over here the R8 competes with the C4S and sorry but for me the Audi R8 is by far the classier car and it's handling is truly incredible which builds confidence like no other.

I believe it's the pricing policy that Audi has in the States that lead to the continuing discussion that we always have.
I agree that if the price was closer, I'd go with the contemporary R8 too. The problem is magnified for me because I would compare the C2S, which is obviously even less expensive, as I wouldn't want the AWD in the Porsche.
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      02-22-2008, 07:39 AM   #25
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Ive had to go through this agonizing decision (M3 is more expensive than a fully loaded 997S in my country) a few months back (youll find my post about it somewhere 2-3 months back) and although I havent mentioned it here anywhere, I finally took the step and decided to buy the Porsche 997S. Again, although personally I wasnt as excited about it as the M3, having had other BMW's before and simply loved every aspect of them, but the hype about the Porsche was just so intense that I couldnt overlook it.

And I must say ever since ive gotten into the porsches driving seat in mid january, I never ever looked back or regretted my decision.. its just a completely different experience than any of the other BMW cars ive ever driven. There is absolutely nothing I dislike about the 997S. The 'feel' of the car is just so light, sporty, precise, its a car that you really can feel 'connected' to as in your working with it not trying to work against it.. heck a lot of the times you have trouble driving it at normal speeds since you get so excited while driving it. Straight line acceleration is also very nice (although im sure it doesnt compare to the M cars), im quite confident that from a standing start ill be ahead of most M cars until 70 mph or so, which is all you need for traffic light racing I guess (already tried it against M5/M6's and my car isnt even fully broken in yet). The engine/exhaust noise is absolutely fantastic, especially inside the cockpit.. such a loud and agressive howl!

I will definitely want to drive an e92 M3 still, since I still do have a passion for BMW and especially the M3, but I daresay I would not want to swap it for my 997S. My friends just gotten on the M3 list, so hopefully ill get a chance to drive it soon. If anything, my next car would be a 997TT or maybe a new generation M6 (since i love that design!), but thats in the very distant future

Like everyone here has already said, it all boils down to personal choice and your intent of usage. I know people who own both M and Porsche cars, and they are all very happy with their rides. Whoevers driven a Porsche though usually sais driving it is just something else, regardless of what they own.

Heres some photos of my new ride btw


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      02-22-2008, 08:00 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Boshhaab View Post
Ive had to go through this agonizing decision (M3 is more expensive than a fully loaded 997S in my country) a few months back (youll find my post about it somewhere 2-3 months back) and although I havent mentioned it here anywhere, I finally took the step and decided to buy the Porsche 997S. Again, although personally I wasnt as excited about it as the M3, having had other BMW's before and simply loved every aspect of them, but the hype about the Porsche was just so intense that I couldnt overlook it.

And I must say ever since ive gotten into the porsches driving seat in mid january, I never ever looked back or regretted my decision.. its just a completely different experience than any of the other BMW cars ive ever driven. There is absolutely nothing I dislike about the 997S. The 'feel' of the car is just so light, sporty, precise, its a car that you really can feel 'connected' to as in your working with it not trying to work against it.. heck a lot of the times you have trouble driving it at normal speeds since you get so excited while driving it. Straight line acceleration is also very nice (although im sure it doesnt compare to the M cars), im quite confident that from a standing start ill be ahead of most M cars until 70 mph or so, which is all you need for traffic light racing I guess (already tried it against M5/M6's and my car isnt even fully broken in yet). The engine/exhaust noise is absolutely fantastic, especially inside the cockpit.. such a loud and agressive howl!

I will definitely want to drive an e92 M3 still, since I still do have a passion for BMW and especially the M3, but I daresay I would not want to swap it for my 997S. My friends just gotten on the M3 list, so hopefully ill get a chance to drive it soon. If anything, my next car would be a 997TT or maybe a new generation M6 (since i love that design!), but thats in the very distant future

Like everyone here has already said, it all boils down to personal choice and your intent of usage. I know people who own both M and Porsche cars, and they are all very happy with their rides. Whoevers driven a Porsche though usually sais driving it is just something else, regardless of what they own.

Heres some photos of my new ride btw


Nice ride, congrats! Get the Porsche Sport Exhaust (PSE) and you'll really love the sound. Porsche really struck it right though with the intake noice inside the cabin. The Porsche aero kit looks nice too.
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      02-22-2008, 08:46 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by devo View Post
I agree that if the price was closer, I'd go with the contemporary R8 too. The problem is magnified for me because I would compare the C2S, which is obviously even less expensive, as I wouldn't want the AWD in the Porsche.

Have driven both the C2S and the C4S back to back on both the road and the track and without a doubt the awd car is the better balanced and behaved of the two. You can not only get on the power sooner coming out of a corner but it doesn't suffer the understeer going into a corner as much and over bumped the nose not only feels but is better tied down.

I love Porsches, had a couple but I prefer the Caymans better balance character to that of the 997.

I personally prefer a car that's performance is the accessible more of the time, this is one of the main reasons for preferring the R8 over a 997 as much as anything.
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      02-22-2008, 08:47 AM   #28
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I wouldnt consider a 911 simply because its a tiring car to drive over long distances. I have driven a friends 997s extensively and although its a cracking sports car it doesnt cut it as GT. Cabin is cramped and noisy, there are rattles and poor ride on bad roads. Performance wise there wouldnt be much between a 997s and a E92 M3 but thats only half the story because you actually have to live with the thing. There is also one other thing, the engine of the 997s is nowhere nearly as tracktable as an M engine. Caught in the wrong gear the Porsche feels like a car with a big turbo. M cars generally pull much better in higher gear-lower revs situation.
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      02-22-2008, 11:02 AM   #29
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I wouldnt consider a 911 simply because its a tiring car to drive over long distances. I have driven a friends 997s extensively and although its a cracking sports car it doesnt cut it as GT. Cabin is cramped and noisy, there are rattles and poor ride on bad roads. Performance wise there wouldnt be much between a 997s and a E92 M3 but thats only half the story because you actually have to live with the thing. There is also one other thing, the engine of the 997s is nowhere nearly as tracktable as an M engine. Caught in the wrong gear the Porsche feels like a car with a big turbo. M cars generally pull much better in higher gear-lower revs situation.
I sort of agree with everything apart from the tractable of their engines, I have always found them to pull cleanly from as little as 500rpm on the clock. I personally don't rate the new M3 engine anywhere near as tractable as the old 6cyl M3 engine which again wasn't as tractable as the Audi V8. There is no doubt that the new M3 engine is right up there with the very best engines currently made and kept in that sweet spot there is few engines it's equal, the way it punches towards the limiter is very impressive, more so than what the RS4 is capable of.

The only engines I rate more highly are the F430, the v10 in the Carrera GT, oh and possibly the GT3. High praise for something where the whole car costs less than most of these engine I have mentioned.
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      02-22-2008, 12:01 PM   #30
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I have had some experience with both cars over the past 6 years and they both are fantatsic! (not new news to anyone, I am sure). However, The C4S felt the most balanced of the cars and had the sweetest exhaust notes (Sports Exhaust). The M3 with SMG felt consideably faster and actually more sportscar, more exciting, also more confortable. In the looks department the 911s are way more attractive and get an extra look or two (if you want that). I think both cars are easily daily drivers and I would put 100 miles a day on them and not feel the least bit worn out. The M3 gets the nod in the comfort department and usability. I think for me anyway the two cars offer greatness on many levels and both do it in slightly different ways. So, I switch it up every couple of years and don't often buy them new so i don't get crushed financialy. Having said this i will be buying a new M3 as as there is no market for used E92 M3 currently, so I will probably hold it for at least 3 years and then maybe back to 911, who knows. I will say the car that i felt had the most powerfull feel in the acceleration department was my 02 M Roadster. Too stiff and small for a daily driver though.
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      02-24-2008, 06:18 PM   #31
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Hands down, if money weren't the issue I'd buy a 997S. The flat six sounds simply awesome. The M will be incredible as a package but I think the P-car is the more sporting model.
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      02-26-2008, 01:42 AM   #32
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NO, not me - the GT3 is an awesome car but I need at least four seats for the family. 4 usable seats that is.
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      02-27-2008, 04:21 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstringer View Post
I am just really curious and don't mean to offend anyone. Would most people on this board drive a Porsche 911 if they could afford it?

Basically are we M3 enthusiasts because it's affordable performance or is it by choice?

Rob
if i had the spare , a porsche it would be, bmw or audi only cos im poor
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      02-27-2008, 05:09 PM   #34
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Having just test driven the 997 gt3 rs (car I have wanted for several years) I can confirm it will be my next car. It was awesome (see other thread why).
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      02-27-2008, 05:46 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
the 911 is a weekend, sunny day car. To tie up another $90K for a weekend warrior is hard. Don't get me wrong, you can drive the 911 as a dd, but the miles will hurt the residuals a lot.

Besides, I need that $20k towards my GT-R in June.
I am pondering this exact question, I love the GT3 a lot, probably would regret a 911S (ie. not a GT3) so it's quite a bit more (about 2x the cost of a M3).

I know the 911S would be more like in-between price but for me, the GT3 or forget it.

My wife says to me why don't I just get the GT3 in that case. But Like I say that's not a great everyday car. I have a S2000 currently and will keep that a while if I get the M3. I mean the GT3 costs a lot more but probably will be driven a lot less than the more all around car like the M3 (for me).

Actually, I like the blend of practicality and sport and muscle of the M3. It's not cheap but compared to the 911 then it does look like a good deal.
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      02-27-2008, 07:19 PM   #36
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I have owned both a 911 and a Cayman S within the past couple of years; just sold the CS. I am fortunate enough to be able to afford any of these cars but chose the M3 this time around because with 3 kids it seems that I am always carrying a kid or two and will be able to drive the M3 sedan far more frequently than I drove either of the Porsches, which were often parked. I loved both of my Porsches - they are great cars...
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      02-27-2008, 07:31 PM   #37
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soon I will be driving both
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      02-29-2008, 03:49 PM   #38
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With the increasing number of super car/high-performance car appearing in the market, probably 911 is just one of the many choices. From $60k to $200k, which is the price range the 911 lineup pretty much covers, there are plenty of cars north of 350hp from different countries, and they are all nice and rare, let's see:

BMW M3
BMW M5
BMW M6
Nissan GT-R
Maserati Grantursimo
Porsche 911 C/CS/C4/C4S/targa/GT3/GT3 RS/GT2/Turbo
Porsche Cayman S
Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG
Lexus IS-F
Audi R8
Audi RS4
Aston Martin Vantage
Aston Martin DB9
Ferrari F430
Lamborghini Gallardo
Lotus Exige S
Chevrolet Corvette Z06

And even Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution and Subaru Impreza WRX STI could do what a regular 997 could performance-wise for half the money, so 911 is not that dominant in this area in my opinion. Too many choices to choose from, not a no-brainer anymore. I personally would pick GT-R, M3, M5 and Granturismo before I consider any 911.
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      03-01-2008, 11:54 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstringer View Post
I am just really curious and don't mean to offend anyone. Would most people on this board drive a Porsche 911 if they could afford it?

Basically are we M3 enthusiasts because it's affordable performance or is it by choice?

Rob
I faced this choice and chose the M3 Sedan over the 911 'cause I haul kids and dogs around fairly often. I also considered the M5, but don't need quite that much room and like the more agile feel of a lighter car. For my situation the M3 Sedan seemed like the best car balancing performance and practicality.
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      03-02-2008, 12:05 AM   #40
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the current 911s are much improved over the 996s that were discontinued in '04. I'm personally not much of a 911 guy except for the GT3 & RS. Between the 997S and the M3, it would be the M3 for me. I just love a screaming engine!
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      03-02-2008, 10:18 PM   #41
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having driven 911s from family members, I would say that if $$ wasn't a huge consideration, i would get a 911. However, having 2 kids and us being the "let's drive here, let's drive there" kind of a family, it makes more sense for me to get the E92 M3. More room, easier back seat access, trunk space considerations (we are an avid golfing family) and especially the free maintenance program with the stateside BMWs, it was a quick, easy decision on my part.
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      03-04-2008, 07:47 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boshhaab View Post
Ive had to go through this agonizing decision (M3 is more expensive than a fully loaded 997S in my country) a few months back (youll find my post about it somewhere 2-3 months back) and although I havent mentioned it here anywhere, I finally took the step and decided to buy the Porsche 997S. Again, although personally I wasnt as excited about it as the M3, having had other BMW's before and simply loved every aspect of them, but the hype about the Porsche was just so intense that I couldnt overlook it.

And I must say ever since ive gotten into the porsches driving seat in mid january, I never ever looked back or regretted my decision.. its just a completely different experience than any of the other BMW cars ive ever driven. There is absolutely nothing I dislike about the 997S. The 'feel' of the car is just so light, sporty, precise, its a car that you really can feel 'connected' to as in your working with it not trying to work against it.. heck a lot of the times you have trouble driving it at normal speeds since you get so excited while driving it. Straight line acceleration is also very nice (although im sure it doesnt compare to the M cars), im quite confident that from a standing start ill be ahead of most M cars until 70 mph or so, which is all you need for traffic light racing I guess (already tried it against M5/M6's and my car isnt even fully broken in yet). The engine/exhaust noise is absolutely fantastic, especially inside the cockpit.. such a loud and agressive howl!

I will definitely want to drive an e92 M3 still, since I still do have a passion for BMW and especially the M3, but I daresay I would not want to swap it for my 997S. My friends just gotten on the M3 list, so hopefully ill get a chance to drive it soon. If anything, my next car would be a 997TT or maybe a new generation M6 (since i love that design!), but thats in the very distant future

Like everyone here has already said, it all boils down to personal choice and your intent of usage. I know people who own both M and Porsche cars, and they are all very happy with their rides. Whoevers driven a Porsche though usually sais driving it is just something else, regardless of what they own.

Heres some photos of my new ride btw


Beautiful machine you have there with the Tubo wheels complimenting Carrera White very nicely. It will handle much better with the Bilsteins though!!!
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      03-04-2008, 08:18 PM   #43
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Choice for me. Influenced heavily by the back seat.
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      03-11-2008, 12:13 AM   #44
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It cost $109k and worth every red cent!

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