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      02-07-2008, 06:59 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uberdude328i View Post
I asked this in another BMW forum, but does anyone else see heavy Concept CS styling cues in the front and rear body work?
Nope. Don't see it.
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      02-07-2008, 07:09 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
There certainly is a third pedal. That is not inconsistent with a sequential RACING box, though.
If the black surface on the right is indeed the throttle, then I guess this is not an automated squential transmission?
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      02-07-2008, 07:10 PM   #113
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More photos of the M3 Rahal Letterman at Chicago Auto Show

The car looks really good, way better than the photos

More high res photos here, there were too many to post

http://www.edbmw.com/blog/2008/02/07...man-racing-m3/













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      02-07-2008, 07:12 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
If the black surface on the right is indeed the throttle, then I guess this is not an automated squential transmission?
Most sequential racing boxes use the clutch only to take off in 1st gear, after which you just slam the gearlever around, no need to pop the clutch.
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      02-07-2008, 07:17 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
Most sequential racing boxes use the clutch only to take off in 1st gear, after which you just slam the gearlever around, no need to pop the clutch.
Didn't know this.
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      02-07-2008, 07:18 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvacha View Post
Nope. Don't see it.
HA. Fair enough. Guess it's just me.
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      02-07-2008, 07:22 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
If the black surface on the right is indeed the throttle, then I guess this is not an automated squential transmission?
Automated, no. Sequential still yes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequent...l_transmission
Read, enlighten, enjoy!
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      02-07-2008, 07:23 PM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Hmm.

368/4 = 92 ft-lb/L

I do believe that's the highet number I've seen on any motor, race or otherwise.
335i: 300ft-lb, 3L -> 100ft-lb/L
911 GT2: 505ft-lb, 3.6L -> 140ft-lb/L
Evo X: 300ft-lb (?), 2L -> 150ft-lb/L
etc.

If you meant, normally aspirated? We would need to know the specific output of all the good production-based racing engines out there.

Of course a NA street engine will never have the specific output of a NA racing engine. Duh.
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      02-07-2008, 07:29 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
Most sequential racing boxes use the clutch only to take off in 1st gear, after which you just slam the gearlever around, no need to pop the clutch.
Exactly. That's what this little tidbit in the press release alludes to:

"quick shift system with ignition cut-out controlled by shifting force"
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      02-07-2008, 07:32 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvacha View Post
Exactly. That's what this little tidbit in the press release alludes to:

"quick shift system with ignition cut-out controlled by shifting force"
Man I love racing technology!
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      02-07-2008, 07:41 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
335i: 300ft-lb, 3L -> 100ft-lb/L
911 GT2: 505ft-lb, 3.6L -> 140ft-lb/L
Evo X: 300ft-lb (?), 2L -> 150ft-lb/L
etc.

If you meant, normally aspirated?
You mean the 335i sitting in my garage makes 300 ft-lb? No shit?

I obviously I mean N/A. "Duh." But thanks for correcting the mistake without being a prick about it.

Quote:
We would need to know the specific output of all the good production-based racing engines out there.
I've never seen any quoted as high, including F1, Indy, or any closed wheel car I can think of. At least not for open track cars. I'm sure a top fuel dragster makes well over 100 ft-lb/L.

Can anyone find any N/A engine making over 92 ft-lb/L? I'm really curious. Just throw a URL out if you have one.

Quote:
Of course a NA street engine will never have the specific output of a NA racing engine. Duh.
That depends on the race engine and street engine in question. "Duh."
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      02-07-2008, 08:01 PM   #122
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      02-07-2008, 08:14 PM   #123
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^^^^

True, but I'll bet this was posted to a different forum (non-M3Post) and then moved here.
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      02-07-2008, 08:19 PM   #124
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No prickiness intended - I was simply astonished that someone could make such a definitive and sweeping statement...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Can anyone find any N/A engine making over 92 ft-lb/L? I'm really curious. Just throw a URL out if you have one.
I'll try to find some data for the usual suspects (RSR, F430, Aston), out of curiosity.

Although if there is a HP limit in the GT2 class, that could mean that larger displacement engines (F430, Aston etc.) may have to limit their torque output in order to obey the HP limit.

Not that a few points in either direction is really meaningful for racing, IMO. Winning races seems to be a delicate balance between power, weight, handling and fuel consumption/management. Oh, and driver.

Quote:
That depends on the race engine and street engine in question. "Duh."
I meant either the best example of each (across manufacturers), or the street vs. race version of the same engine.

As you well know, street engines - no matter how good they are - have to cope with emmission regulations, noise regulations, reliability considerations, low grade fuels etc. IMO they're not really comparable with race engines, in any way.





Anyway, this looks like a promising platform. I'd particularly like to see how they managed to have those radiator ducts in the nose, so close to the windshield - they must have pushed the engine way back towards the bulkhead.

I wish they'd make an M6 race car for the GT1 class...
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      02-07-2008, 08:31 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
No prickiness intended - I was simply astonished that someone could make such a definitive and sweeping statement...
I'll happily retract it at the presence of some counter-evidence. I know I've had this discussion on a forum before, years back. At that time, a search for any car boasting specs better than the PTG M3 (90 ft-lb/L) came up empty.

Quote:
I meant either the best example of each (across manufacturers), or the street vs. race version of the same engine.

As you well know, street engines - no matter how good they are - have to cope with emmission regulations, noise regulations, reliability considerations, low grade fuels etc. IMO they're not really comparable with race engines, in any way.
Street engines can be tuned - to the utter damnation of emmission regulations, noise regulations, reliability considerations and fuel grades. And oh how they are - sometimes to power levels exceeding the stock tune by a wide margin (and yes this is naturally aspirated I am referring to).

So, can you point me to any tuned street engine - any at all - making over 92 ft-lb/L? And of course I should love to see race engines with similar figures also. A dyno graph would be even better.
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      02-07-2008, 11:18 PM   #126
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Wow what a stunning car....
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      02-08-2008, 01:59 AM   #127
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485bhp at what RPM? 125nm/L for a NA engine is certainly impressive

This car has more scoops and vents than I remember seeing on other GT2 class racers... probably the result of their R&D in CFD and wind tunnel through their F1 programs.
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      02-08-2008, 02:56 AM   #128
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very wide!
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      02-08-2008, 04:19 AM   #129
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Remove the fins, and cover up the lower two air dams and you will have one aggressive looking street M3 without being way too rude. They should have incorporated those front fenders and rear wheel wells on the new M3.... man... I can see some of you doing this conversion soon.


BTW, Can a 335i with Vishnu V2 smoke this by the bus length?
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      02-08-2008, 06:16 AM   #130
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its different i like it alot
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      02-08-2008, 06:44 AM   #131
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woot woot!
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      02-08-2008, 09:15 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
+1, ROTFLMAO....
They've upgraded the engine, cooling, suspension, brakes, wheels, lowered the weight, etc...I thought an M3 was race ready sans track prep?
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