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      01-21-2008, 01:03 AM   #1
Epacy
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Current E92 M3 Owners - Battery Pic Request

Would any current owners be so kind as to snap a couple of pics of their battery?
Checking to see if there is some sort of control module on top of the battery for BER.
This is what the NA one looks like and would like to compare:
Thanks!



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      01-21-2008, 02:23 AM   #2
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Looks pretty similar to mine.
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      01-21-2008, 11:11 AM   #3
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Thanks GeriFix!!

They do like identical. This is good news for BER in NA! Looks like it is a definite.
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      01-21-2008, 01:20 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Thanks GeriFix!!

They do like identical. This is good news for BER in NA! Looks like it is a definite.

BER? "Bit error ratio, bureau of education & research, basic encoding rules, BER corp"???????
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      01-21-2008, 02:35 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Thanks GeriFix!!

They do like identical. This is good news for BER in NA! Looks like it is a definite.
Are you willing to call it "definite" that the US gets BER based on the appearance of a US vs. EU car battery?
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      01-21-2008, 02:54 PM   #6
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I thought BMW already announced that BER (Break Energy Regeneration) was not coming to the US.
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      01-21-2008, 03:00 PM   #7
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Sir Epacy,

I am impressed with you inquisitive thinking process. You are definately on the right track to solving this ongoing mystery about U.S. bound cars.
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      01-21-2008, 06:56 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Are you willing to call it "definite" that the US gets BER based on the appearance of a US vs. EU car battery?
BER requires a special battery and from the pictures the setup is identical, down to the control module.

Apparently, BMW already put BER in the European E60 a couple of years ago.
They are adding it to the 1-series as well.

Things seem to be lining up. I'll go ahead and call it a definite.

Check Tbone's Detroit Auto Show thread for excruciating detail on BER and where this request came from.
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      01-21-2008, 06:56 PM   #9
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Sir Epacy,

I am impressed with you inquisitive thinking process. You are definately on the right track to solving this ongoing mystery about U.S. bound cars.
Thanks, I think...
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      01-21-2008, 09:51 PM   #10
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Quote:
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Things seem to be lining up. I'll go ahead and call it a definite.
Seems just a tad weak to me unless there is written docs proving that US 135 gets BER. Can you confirm that?
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      01-21-2008, 10:32 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Seems just a tad weak to me unless there is written docs proving that US 135 gets BER. Can you confirm that?
Yes, the evidence is somewhat sketchy with what I have provided.
I do not have a document confirming NA 1-series BER.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fifth Gear
16/1/07

The BMW 1 Series will get a mid-life facelift and numerous engine enhancements this spring. A sporty new three-door variant will also be introduced.

A series of (relatively small) styling changes seem to tone-down some of designer Chris Bangle's trademark 'flame surfacing', including a new front bumper, a more prominent grille and revised headlights. Elongated doors and a repositioned B-pillar are the main alterations on the three-door variant.

Major changes can be found amongst the oily bits, where new or revised extra-efficient engines have been introduced. Performance and economy has been enhanced across the range; the most improved engine is the 118d which has 21bhp more power and is 19% more fuel efficient. In fact, the 118d will be the most efficient BMW on sale, offering 60mpg.

These economical engines are assisted by new BMW technology like a Brake Energy Regeneration (BER) system, which will also be introduced on the revised 5 Series. This innovative system uses a newly developed alternator that stores energy when the brakes are applied, allowing (says BMW) for a 2-3% improvement in fuel economy.
Greg won't like this description. However, it is to point out that the 1-series is getting BER.


http://fifthgear.five.tv/jsp/5gmain.jsp?lnk=101&id=2064
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      01-21-2008, 11:14 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Yes, the evidence is somewhat sketchy with what I have provided.
Greg won't like this description. However, it is to point out that the 1-series is getting BER.
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      01-22-2008, 02:13 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Yes, the evidence is somewhat sketchy with what I have provided.
I do not have a document confirming NA 1-series BER.
I don't really follow the 1er very closely. It is new to the US but has been available abroad for some time, right? So the BER change is a "mid-life" change for the 1er? Will these mid-life changes be present in the 2008 135? If that is the case I would say the deal is pretty sealed on BER for the M3. I'll be glad this feature made it but am also suprised by its lack of mention in US information like the brochures. Perhaps they know most Americans and most that will buy the M3 don't give a squat about mpg. Thanks for the work on this one!
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      01-22-2008, 03:02 AM   #14
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pics look very different to me????
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      01-22-2008, 07:42 AM   #15
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My *guess* is that if the euro version has BER, so does the NA version. It's a simple module that probably doesn't cost much - at least compared to the AGM battery. I could be wrong, but I believe the 1er has had BER since day 1, although other things have been tacked on since then. BER is under the generic umbrella of "efficient dynamics". Very few documents outside of the press releases for the S65B40 engine have mentioned BER however. Internally BER appears to actually be called "intelligent generator control", whose German acronym is "IGR". I *believe* that most of the junk seen on the battery is actually associated with the "intelligent battery sensor", IBS. IBS does the actual determination of battery charge state as well as battery health prediction. The IBS function is probably much more expensive than IGR. I don't believe IGR can function without data from IBS since IGR must afterall charge the battery under ALL circumstances if the battery is too low, and IBS would be one one providing the info.

Again if I were to take a *guess* I'd say that corporately BMW wants to appear green, while avoiding giving potential buyers of its highest performing cars (i.e. ///M) an impression that the product is overly green, as it might imply "performance compromise". If so this might explain why there are few and sketchy details.
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      01-22-2008, 08:31 AM   #16
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BER in the sense that the alternator will charge the battery just when the car is braking? Because I don't think that is one of those systems that use the braking itself to produce power. .
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      01-22-2008, 08:32 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
I don't really follow the 1er very closely. It is new to the US but has been available abroad for some time, right? So the BER change is a "mid-life" change for the 1er? Will these mid-life changes be present in the 2008 135? If that is the case I would say the deal is pretty sealed on BER for the M3. I'll be glad this feature made it but am also suprised by its lack of mention in US information like the brochures. Perhaps they know most Americans and most that will buy the M3 don't give a squat about mpg. Thanks for the work on this one!
1er has been abroad for some time. I believe this is a model refresh with the new 1er models, not so much a "mid-life" change.
Again, I have nothing conrete on NA 1er BER, but press release have indicated the 1er will have BER.
I also read an older article that said the BER/AGM batteries were black and the standard batteries were white. Not sure if this still holds true, however, you can see the M3 has a black battery, same as the Euro one. It is the 1er that has the white battery

Quote:
Originally Posted by sayemthree
pics look very different to me????
White battery is the 1er.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rvacha View Post
Again if I were to take a *guess* I'd say that corporately BMW wants to appear green, while avoiding giving potential buyers of its highest performing cars (i.e. ///M) an impression that the product is overly green, as it might imply "performance compromise". If so this might explain why there are few and sketchy details.
BER also uses a special alternator as well.
Also, BER doesn't indicate a performance compromise. It is the other way around. It actually reduces the load on the engine so more energy can be applied for moving the car.
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      01-22-2008, 08:37 AM   #18
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Actually it seems to be a 90ah battery, which is not that much, considering it the car has to fully depend on her during acceleration (including A/C). Must be a really powerful alternator.

I was really happy when I heard this for he first time, as I always find that the A/C leaks power from the engine. Some cars turn the A/C off during full acceleration, but it's not the same thing.
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      01-22-2008, 12:06 PM   #19
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Quote:
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BER in the sense that the alternator will charge the battery just when the car is braking? Because I don't think that is one of those systems that use the braking itself to produce power. .
Epacy and I had an extensive discussion of this in this thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108637. My position is that BMW seems to be misusing the term "BER", since it does not seem to be truly regenerative. Rather, the alternator is only engaged in non-load conditions. Every car produces electrical power in these conditions. The fact that BMW is limiting the alternator use is more efficient, but hardly regenerative.
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