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      01-11-2008, 10:32 AM   #23
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I agree with the rest that this number would be acceptable and pretty much what we've come to expect. $69k Fully loaded = sub $60k MSRP.

The "Your kidding right?" scenario that I picture would be the price being something like $52k base. If that happens you would hear Audi owners and MB owners yelling, "WTF!!!!" from their cabins as you blow by them in the rediculously awesomely priced coupe.

And of course my reaction to the opposite end of the spectrum with a MSRP over say $62k would be, "Fuck off, I'll go buy a GTR".
+1 million
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      01-11-2008, 11:46 AM   #24
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+1 !!! If I were BMW that's how I would think about pricing. This board is full of bmw aficionados, but there are those who have the $$$ and say, what sporty car can I buy w/ $X ($65 - $85k), and for most of these I believe the 911 has a lot more cachet and is far more blingy on Rodeo drive = worth a premium.

M3 is a great car - don't get me wrong - but to Joe Public a 911 speaks more iconically. To price too close to the 911 is overreaching, IMO.
I could not agree more with this statement. Love the M3 to death but when you are getting into Porsche territory it will make the decision harder. I will throw out a controversial topic. Why not kill the military probgram on all "M" cars. Seriously why does the military need a discount on a $50,000+ sport car and if you are in the military and can afford this car at a discount then you can afford to pay what the "general public" pays. Euro delivery discounts are not available to us. I believe if you do that and "soften" the MSRP selling price then we will have the price we want. In my scenario the car does not get discounted to much and there is a flatter profit margin in the US. Even at the end of the E46 production cycle the best that most people could get off of MSRP was $1,500 - $2,000. What if BMW loosens its position on selling cars off MSRP? That certainly opens up a whole new realm of actual "MSRP".

There is no doubt about it that this whole pricing thing is getting ridiculous and if they don't announce pricing on Monday it will suck.
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      01-11-2008, 12:28 PM   #25
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I could not agree more with this statement. Love the M3 to death but when you are getting into Porsche territory it will make the decision harder. I will throw out a controversial topic. Why not kill the military probgram on all "M" cars. Seriously why does the military need a discount on a $50,000+ sport car and if you are in the military and can afford this car at a discount then you can afford to pay what the "general public" pays. Euro delivery discounts are not available to us. I believe if you do that and "soften" the MSRP selling price then we will have the price we want. In my scenario the car does not get discounted to much and there is a flatter profit margin in the US. Even at the end of the E46 production cycle the best that most people could get off of MSRP was $1,500 - $2,000. What if BMW loosens its position on selling cars off MSRP? That certainly opens up a whole new realm of actual "MSRP".

There is no doubt about it that this whole pricing thing is getting ridiculous and if they don't announce pricing on Monday it will suck.

I totally agree about the military pricing. Get rid of it. Some yay-hoo out shooting Muslims or on a ship somewhere shouldn't cause my car to cost me more (ie some type of deal between US military and BMW where ultimately tax payer money gets used to pay for armed forces cars).
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      01-11-2008, 12:35 PM   #26
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I totally agree about the military pricing. Get rid of it. Some yay-hoo out shooting Muslims or on a ship somewhere shouldn't cause my car to cost me more (ie some type of deal between US military and BMW where ultimately tax payer money gets used to pay for armed forces cars).



Showing your true colors again. So many things wrong with that statement.
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      01-11-2008, 12:39 PM   #27
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Showing your true colors again. So many things wrong with that statement.

That's my opinion. I pay over 200K per year in taxes, and it just gerds me to think about all the places it goes.

Do away with the military sales program.
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      01-11-2008, 12:48 PM   #28
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Exactly, that's not the end-of-the-world forecast he was promoting. Still put it over $70k OTD. Taxes and GGT are a bitch.
Aw so lucky we don't have taxes up here! Only good thing about this state!
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      01-11-2008, 01:13 PM   #29
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I could not agree more with this statement. Love the M3 to death but when you are getting into Porsche territory it will make the decision harder. I will throw out a controversial topic. Why not kill the military probgram on all "M" cars. Seriously why does the military need a discount on a $50,000+ sport car and if you are in the military and can afford this car at a discount then you can afford to pay what the "general public" pays. Euro delivery discounts are not available to us. I believe if you do that and "soften" the MSRP selling price then we will have the price we want. In my scenario the car does not get discounted to much and there is a flatter profit margin in the US. Even at the end of the E46 production cycle the best that most people could get off of MSRP was $1,500 - $2,000. What if BMW loosens its position on selling cars off MSRP? That certainly opens up a whole new realm of actual "MSRP".

There is no doubt about it that this whole pricing thing is getting ridiculous and if they don't announce pricing on Monday it will suck.
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Originally Posted by aerisolphaln View Post
I totally agree about the military pricing. Get rid of it. Some yay-hoo out shooting Muslims or on a ship somewhere shouldn't cause my car to cost me more (ie some type of deal between US military and BMW where ultimately tax payer money gets used to pay for armed forces cars).

Without getting into the disrespect in some of these comments I would like to shed some light on Military Sales so that you both understand the facts.

First off, Military Sales does not effect any of the profit BMW receives. The cars are still aquired at or above invoice which as you know is at or above dealer cost. This is true for Ford, GM, Audi, Mini, Nissan, Infiniti, Land Rover, and VW Military Sales programs offered.

Military Sales is programs established to simply offer BMW's at below MSRP to Military Members, Diplomats, and Civilian Contractors deployed overseas. It applies to everyone on TDY/PCS orders out of the country including, but not restricted to, the Middles East. Most Military Sales actually take place in Germany, England, and Spain.

Military Sales comes straight from the factory and in fact does not effect BMW's profit on the car. The car is simply sold to the customer at about 1% over invoice. BMW still makes the same amount they would make on any other car. Imagine your dealership offering you a car at invoice... thats all that is taking place.

Military Sales simply cuts out the middle man (the dealership) and reduces profits they would normally aquire. The actual Military Sales rep is usually associated with a dealer however the profits do not go to the actaul dealer. The profits are aquired by programs like Pentagon Sales or Superior Sales.

I wont go into it with you gentlemen but I find your posts to both be ignorant in one case and offensive in another.

Jason
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      01-11-2008, 02:21 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by aerisolphaln View Post
That's my opinion. I pay over 200K per year in taxes, and it just gerds me to think about all the places it goes.

Do away with the military sales program.
No one cares how much you pay in taxes. And by saying that you make yourself look like that much more of an ass. Anyone paying 200k in taxes can afford to pay premium for a car, so quit your bitching and be glad someone else is fighting allowing you to sit and cry about a few thousand.

A break on a car is the very least we owe anyone in the military.
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      01-11-2008, 02:25 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by aerisolphaln View Post
That's my opinion. I pay over 200K per year in taxes, and it just gerds me to think about all the places it goes.

Do away with the military sales program.
And to think that the freedom you enjoy helped create the influx of cash you have to be able to pay the 200K in taxes.
Even though you may disagree with how your taxes are spent, you shouldn't short sight the men and women out there putting their lives on the line by being disrespectful.
This goes for the other lame poster about shooting from a boat and yada yada...
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      01-11-2008, 02:26 PM   #32
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What's next? Get rid of soldiers tuition assistance? Alot of diplomats and contractors not just the military benefit from this program. People involved in democratization of war torn countries such as Bosnia, Kosovo, Iraq and Afghanistan just to name a few. The people you are bashing are contributing to worldwide stability in ways that you have no knowledge about so that you can sleep without a guy wearing a bomb vest knocking on your door. I've been blown up twice by these fanatics, others have been through worse. The guy you are trashing just might be driving the new M3 with hand controls because he no longer has legs. Of course you're welcome to your opinion but your brush strokes are a bit broad. Sorry for the OT. Carry on.
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      01-11-2008, 02:35 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by JEllis View Post
Without getting into the disrespect in some of these comments I would like to shed some light on Military Sales so that you both understand the facts.

First off, Military Sales does not effect any of the profit BMW receives. The cars are still aquired at or above invoice which as you know is at or above dealer cost. This is true for Ford, GM, Audi, Mini, Nissan, Infiniti, Land Rover, and VW Military Sales programs offered.

Military Sales is programs established to simply offer BMW's at below MSRP to Military Members, Diplomats, and Civilian Contractors deployed overseas. It applies to everyone on TDY/PCS orders out of the country including, but not restricted to, the Middles East. Most Military Sales actually take place in Germany, England, and Spain.

Military Sales comes straight from the factory and in fact does not effect BMW's profit on the car. The car is simply sold to the customer at about 1% over invoice. BMW still makes the same amount they would make on any other car. Imagine your dealership offering you a car at invoice... thats all that is taking place.

Military Sales simply cuts out the middle man (the dealership) and reduces profits they would normally aquire. The actual Military Sales rep is usually associated with a dealer however the profits do not go to the actaul dealer. The profits are aquired by programs like Pentagon Sales or Superior Sales.

I wont go into it with you gentlemen but I find your posts to both be ignorant in one case and offensive in another.

Jason
Thanks for the clarification Jason. This should settle it. It's interesting how some people are ready to jump to conclusions on the basis of a poorly thought out assumption.
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      01-11-2008, 03:38 PM   #34
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I'm all for giving our soldiers whatever assistance possible. Whether, for or against, the war these men and women more than deserve anything and everything we can give them.

I'll be the first to bitch about our excessive taxes, but in this case, I say that we can't give these people enough.

OT, I know, back to the original post.
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      01-11-2008, 03:54 PM   #35
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That's my opinion. I pay over 200K per year in taxes, and it just gerds me to think about all the places it goes.

Do away with the military sales program.

Coming from someone else who pays close to 200k in taxes, if there is one place i'm happy my money goes its towards our boys over there.

On the other hand i'd rather not fund your abortions, and i would rather your illegitimate children die a normal death after a crap-tastic life.

Also for someone who makes around 400k/year (thoroughly not impressed) you should at least be able to spell gird. gerd is a gastric disease. And i think you mean to use the word "irk".

back on topic now:
awesome that price will be announced on monday.
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      01-11-2008, 04:07 PM   #36
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I'm all for giving our soldiers whatever assistance possible. Whether, for or against, the war these men and women more than deserve anything and everything we can give them.
.
Agree, specially because military sales doesn't affect the price that the rest of the customers pay, and they people that are really getting the taxes are not them.... they just receive their salary. At least it's an optional job. In other countries people are obligated to go and fight in terrible conditions whether they like it or not.
You have to consider that when you sign in for a force (a job), you get some premiums and also make sacrifices. A soldier knows that eventually he/she might be deployed to a conflict zone (specially in the US forces). The problem is that some people are getting rich with our money and our soldiers are loosing their lifes and health for it.

Also remember that a lot of people put their lifes on the line everyday, 365 days of the year and not only during war. (police, firemen, etc...) They should also get some credit (which they don't).
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      01-11-2008, 05:49 PM   #37
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Also remember that a lot of people put their lifes on the line everyday, 365 days of the year and not only during war. (police, firemen, etc...) They should also get some credit (which they don't).[/quote]

I am very well aware of the lack of benefits to many police officers and firefighters. I am a retired police officer who put in over twenty years of service.
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      01-11-2008, 05:58 PM   #38
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It's amazing that some people who make good money are ungrateful and pigheaded about the government (which includes the armed forces and local police/fire/ems) that produces an environment for them to make that income. You wonder how that happens when most of our leadership managed to skip out on their draft obligations back in the day.
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      01-11-2008, 06:08 PM   #39
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Ungrateful is absolutely the right word.

We have come to expect this kind of thinking from aerisolphaln. This isn't the first time he has shown himself to be self-centered and egotistical.

What's even more amazing is he isn't even smart enough to keep these kind of thoughts to himself.
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      01-11-2008, 06:38 PM   #40
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is all of this legit or is it just your prediction
(refering to pricing for USA annouced this monday)
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      01-11-2008, 06:50 PM   #41
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is all of this legit or is it just your prediction
(refering to pricing for USA annouced this monday)
Back OT! No idea - speculation I guess ...
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      01-11-2008, 07:07 PM   #42
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Unless he is a top BMW exec, which I doubt he is because why would he be posting such stuff on the web if he was, he is just speculating like the rest of us, which is fine.
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      01-11-2008, 07:31 PM   #43
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It's amazing that some people who make good money are ungrateful and pigheaded about the government (which includes the armed forces and local police/fire/ems) that produces an environment for them to make that income. You wonder how that happens when most of our leadership managed to skip out on their draft obligations back in the day.
That enviorment is made by all of us. Society makes the enviorment in a democracy (and pays for that). People elect their goverment and people make desicions that influence our world (sometimes very indirectly)

It would be very dificult to create a system with which each citizen would choose where their taxes go. (I would choose heath care and free M3's for everybody!!! )

For example: a friend was complaining yesterday because of all the money that pro league players make. That isn't their fault! If nowbody followed the games, they wouldn't be making such a huge amount of cash.

Each one is free to express, even if the rest doesn't agree... the problem is that posting things that are out of the context of this forum is not correct.

But well, back to the M3 world..... As was expected monday will be the big day for a lot of people (including me) and I really hope that the base price will stay under 58k.
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      01-11-2008, 08:02 PM   #44
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Without getting into the disrespect in some of these comments I would like to shed some light on Military Sales so that you both understand the facts.

First off, Military Sales does not effect any of the profit BMW receives. The cars are still aquired at or above invoice which as you know is at or above dealer cost. This is true for Ford, GM, Audi, Mini, Nissan, Infiniti, Land Rover, and VW Military Sales programs offered.

Military Sales is programs established to simply offer BMW's at below MSRP to Military Members, Diplomats, and Civilian Contractors deployed overseas. It applies to everyone on TDY/PCS orders out of the country including, but not restricted to, the Middles East. Most Military Sales actually take place in Germany, England, and Spain.

Military Sales comes straight from the factory and in fact does not effect BMW's profit on the car. The car is simply sold to the customer at about 1% over invoice. BMW still makes the same amount they would make on any other car. Imagine your dealership offering you a car at invoice... thats all that is taking place.

Military Sales simply cuts out the middle man (the dealership) and reduces profits they would normally aquire. The actual Military Sales rep is usually associated with a dealer however the profits do not go to the actaul dealer. The profits are aquired by programs like Pentagon Sales or Superior Sales.

I wont go into it with you gentlemen but I find your posts to both be ignorant in one case and offensive in another.

Jason
I intended no disrespect to the military by suggesting discontinuing the military discount specifically on “M” cars. I apologize if that is what you felt.

I am very well aware of how the military program works, which is similar to the Euro delivery plan. What I intended for people to debate was exactly what you state about most transactions taking place in Europe, based on the dollar? I am curious how the whole “invoice” price is established and I would assume everything is a factor. If you are saying it is not, then I guess the conversation is over.

Now if the military discount does not play any factor what so ever then I guess, so what. Conversely, if I have to pay more as a result of any discount program that is not available to everyone, I will debate it.

Now if someone wants to debate the misappropriation of taxes, public servants (i.e. teachers and policemen) not receiving the same privileges as military or the value of freedom go ahead, but that is probably for another forum.
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