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      12-09-2007, 09:52 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by RandyB View Post
I'm going to wait for MY09 anyways so I can look at all of the options and color combos firsthand and drive the thing and then make a decision. If I were to order one right now, I would get AW with black leather and 19" wheels. I want to drive one with and without EDC if possible since that is the only option that I'm on the fence about.
I think you'll have a hard time driving the car at a dealer since incoming cars would have already been sold for some time. You might be able to drive a friend's or go to M-school. Even then I think it will be hard to run into a non-EDC car. Regardless, I would like to know what the non-EDC setup is like as well.
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      12-09-2007, 11:19 AM   #24
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Can't blame you for passing. Just insane pricing isn't out yet.
+1 Downright folly by bmwusa and frankly, a hint of arrogance. My guess is the beancounters are hoping for a drop in EUR/USD - which I expect will happen in 2008 - EUR is at least 20% overvalued now and economic / political pressure is also building suggesting a weaker EUR on the other side of the 'Pond' in '08.
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Last edited by Voltigeur; 12-09-2007 at 03:08 PM. Reason: addendum
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      12-09-2007, 11:21 AM   #25
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I think you'll have a hard time driving the car at a dealer since incoming cars would have already been sold for some time. I would like to know what the non-EDC setup is like as well.
Patience will likely be required to get the local test drive option. I too would like to see how much of a diff EDC makes.
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      12-09-2007, 11:25 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Lil. Lucas View Post
From the dealer sample I've seen its nothing like the picture posted..
I'd say this is more accurate, its really something you need to see in person to know what colour it is. My description is a rich reddish brown..
That looks closer to the better photos I've seen. I love this colour!
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      12-09-2007, 11:45 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by RandyB View Post
I'm going to wait for MY09 anyways so I can look at all of the options and color combos firsthand and drive the thing and then make a decision. If I were to order one right now, I would get AW with black leather and 19" wheels. I want to drive one with and without EDC if possible since that is the only option that I'm on the fence about.
I'm with you for waiting for the 2009's for all the reason's stated - plus, I want to see what the competition has to offer for 2009.
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      12-09-2007, 11:55 AM   #28
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It may be a justification for not wanting to wait too much longer. If I was sure of March DCT production, I would wait. But, when there has been virtually no spy info recently on this makes me think it is a ways off, yet.

Frankly, while DCT sounds interesting, the extra weight, complexity and probably $3k cost makes me not want to wait. I know it will be faster and great on the track, but I have been driving manuals for 43 years and this one is supposed to be better than that in my Er6.
Wise decision. Though I think DCT is an interesting proposition. It would take a lot of bravado to buy a first year DCT. Day 366 may be another story. I was going to ask you about the mileage numbers we are hearing. I know you are environmentally concious. I think my biggest concern is the mileage, at least in comparision to some other very high performance cars. The GT2 has 530 horsepower and 505 lbs of torque and has a projected 17 and 24 mpg. It appears the GT-R with it's 480 hp and 434 lbs of torque may get a few miles to the gallon more than the M3. What do you think about the M3's mileage numbers thus far?
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      12-09-2007, 12:09 PM   #29
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Wise decision. Though I think DCT is an interesting proposition. It would take a lot of bravado to buy a first year DCT. Day 366 maybe another story. I was going to ask you about the mileage numbers we are hearing. I know you are environmentally concious. I think my biggest concern is the mileage, at least in comparision to some other very high performance cars. The GT2 has 530 horsepower and 505 lb of torque and has a projected 17 and 24 mpg. The GT-R with it's 480 hp and 434 lb of torque looks like it will get a couple miles to the gallon more than the M3. What do you think?
I believe turbo engines give you a bit of best of both worlds--when cruising and not really using the FI, they get good mileage. When you put the foot down they have the power, along with a much higher fuel consumption. The way fuel economy tests are run they don't really call for real aggressive throttle (although the new EPA test is more real world than the old).

The fuel economy of the M3 does bother me. As an architect, "sustainability" is a big part of our goal these days. I'm a LEED accredited professional (info on LEED here: http://www.usgbc.org/DisplayPage.aspx?CMSPageID=222). I rationalize the M3 because I do pretty well with sustainabllity in all other aspects of my life. Also, 80% of my driving is at a moderate intensity. My E46 only averages about 17 on my urban/suburban use, though it's great it can get in the high 20s at a steady 75 on the freeway. I wish BMW had worked more at this aspect of the S65, whether through direct injection, cylinder deactivation, or whatever. It's not enough to keep me from purchase, but it bugs me a little.
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      12-09-2007, 01:40 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Voltigeur View Post
That looks closer to the better photos I've seen. I love this colour!
Have you actually seen Fox Red in real life?
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      12-09-2007, 02:33 PM   #31
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Though I think DCT is an interesting proposition. It would take a lot of bravado to buy a first year DCT. Day 366 may be another story.
It is rumored that BMW will leverage the BorgWarner DCT [they've been making them for 2 years now]
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      12-09-2007, 02:41 PM   #32
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Have you actually seen Fox Red in real life?
Fair question. My comment is more based on years of photography and use of digital software to alter WBal and filter etc - and the photos that appear better exposed don't give FR so much of an orange tint.

I'm also basing the comment on a discussion w/ a mate in Oz who has seen the colour at a local dealer ... but this will be the first element I want to confirm in person before I commit to an order specifying FR (that and m-dct .. just have to be patient).

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      12-09-2007, 03:03 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Well, there's no charge for the moonroof, I'm sure, so you sholdn't have to worry about that.
I had heard that it may possibly be a no charge trade off for the carbon fiber roof on the coupe.

I thought it would be like $1k on the sedan.
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      12-09-2007, 03:04 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
I believe turbo engines give you a bit of best of both worlds--when cruising and not really using the FI, they get good mileage. When you put the foot down they have the power, along with a much higher fuel consumption. The way fuel economy tests are run they don't really call for real aggressive throttle (although the new EPA test is more real world than the old).

The fuel economy of the M3 does bother me. As an architect, "sustainability" is a big part of our goal these days. I'm a LEED accredited professional (info on LEED here: http://www.usgbc.org/DisplayPage.aspx?CMSPageID=222). I rationalize the M3 because I do pretty well with sustainabllity in all other aspects of my life. Also, 80% of my driving is at a moderate intensity. My E46 only averages about 17 on my urban/suburban use, though it's great it can get in the high 20s at a steady 75 on the freeway. I wish BMW had worked more at this aspect of the S65, whether through direct injection, cylinder deactivation, or whatever. It's not enough to keep me from purchase, but it bugs me a little.
I appreciate the reply and link. LEED appears to be at the forefront of evironmentally friendly designs. It is also nice to have a forum member who has followed and appreciated BMW's for more than just a few years.

Do you happen to flyfish? Oregon has some of the most productive rivers in the country.
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      12-09-2007, 04:00 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Well, there's no charge for the moonroof, I'm sure, so you sholdn't have to worry about that.

I want a RED, not pink or orange. I would prefer a deeper color, but even Imola-like would be okay. An orangesish brown like Tanin {similar to Cinnamon} would be okay, too, but is not an option.
+1 sort of. FR makes me wanna
If BMW was offering Cinnamon or anything close to it, I would have ordered Jet Blk/Cinnamon loaded out without blinking. We have truly been screwed on color combos. As it stands, I will probably go SSII / Speedcloth and 19's. That's it. So sick about the lack of Cinnamon or something close to it. Sorry, I have stated this in other threads, but my displeasure with the color situation grows daily. But, it does make ordering a basic car with one or two options a much easier decision. Why should I plop down 65K+ for a color combo that makes me go "ho-hum". Bastards, I bet they killed Kenny too
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      12-09-2007, 05:15 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voltigeur View Post
Fair question. My comment is more based on years of photography and use of digital software to alter WBal and filter etc - and the photos that appear better exposed don't give FR so much of an orange tint.

I'm also basing the comment on a discussion w/ a mate in Oz who has seen the colour at a local dealer ... but this will be the first element I want to confirm in person before I commit to an order specifying FR (that and m-dct .. just have to be patient).

Well the pictures you posted are NOT an accurate representation of Fox Red. Fox Red is more like Cinnamon than Imola Red.
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      12-09-2007, 05:17 PM   #37
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If BMW was offering Cinnamon or anything close to it, I would have ordered Jet Blk/Cinnamon loaded out without blinking. We have truly been screwed on color combos. As it stands, I will probably go SSII / Speedcloth and 19's. That's it. So sick about the lack of Cinnamon or something close to it. :

FFS!! I really am losing the will to live.

If Fox Red is like any previous colour it's Cinnamon. I've seen it with my own eyes. Not in a picture.
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      12-09-2007, 06:20 PM   #38
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Well the pictures you posted are NOT an accurate representation of Fox Red. Fox Red is more like Cinnamon than Imola Red.
Not my pics mate But, I'll wait until the m3 arrives stateside and check it all out ... 'cinnamony' is OK, just would not like it if it were to be too orangey-tan in tone.
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Last edited by Voltigeur; 12-09-2007 at 06:26 PM. Reason: addendum
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      12-09-2007, 06:31 PM   #39
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I appreciate the reply and link. LEED appears to be at the forefront of evironmentally friendly designs. It is also nice to have a forum member who has followed and appreciated BMW's for more than just a few years.

Do you happen to flyfish? Oregon has some of the most productive rivers in the country.
Nope, Ruff, afraid I never got the fishing bug. You're right, though, tons of good streams & rivers around here. Now flyfishing for salmon, that would be fun!
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      12-10-2007, 05:03 AM   #40
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I'm starting to think mofomat's monitor isn't very well calibrated. I'm almost certain these are in line with what fox red looks like..
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      12-10-2007, 09:22 AM   #41
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I'm starting to think mofomat's monitor isn't very well calibrated. I'm almost certain these are in line with what fox red looks like..
Now that (on my monitor) looks more like I expect it to. Still not sure if I want to live with it for a number of years, though. I may end up with Speed Cloth.

I've sent a priority email over the weekend through BMWUSA Owner's Circle to see if samples are available (fat chance!). I've also queried them on when we can expect pricing.
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      12-10-2007, 09:27 AM   #42
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I also expect that to be a fairly accurate representation of Fox Red.
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      12-10-2007, 10:06 AM   #43
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I'm starting to think mofomat's monitor isn't very well calibrated. I'm almost certain these are in line with what fox red looks like..
Well this picture wasn't the same one as earlier in the thread. In this one the seats are a bit more "orange", but it still doesn't accurately show how orange the colour is. It's called "Fox" red for a reason.
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      12-10-2007, 10:07 AM   #44
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I also expect that to be a fairly accurate representation of Fox Red.
What do you mean "expect"? How can you comment unless you've actually seen the colour with your own eyes? I have many times, and it has quite an orange hue to it, so much so it should really have been called Fox Orange.
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