vs isf

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by BMRLVR

What do you expect on a BMW Forum...... You think the same question asked on a Lexus Forum would turn out any different (favouring the IS-F That is)

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

I mean, it is a BMW forum after all. Head over to a Lexus forum and see what type of answers you'll get. I'm pretty sure it'll be the IS-F. Then you can go over there and say "Expected responses from a Lexus forum. "

You're both actually wrong.

The OP posted about what was faster. Not subjective discussions like what looks better, what has the better interior, what rides better. Of course, you'll find a bias when subjective matters are being discussed but that doesn't apply here.

The Lexus forum that I used to frequent, CL, was very objective when it came down to performance discussions. It was widely acknowledged that the cars are close enough that it will all depend on the driver. (Other than top end where a stock F will beat a stock M3 due to the limiter).

Fwiw, there is a member here that has owned and tracked both and the F came out on top in straight line and track numbers.

[Cabinetman]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

You're both actually wrong.

The OP posted about what was faster. Not subjective discussions like what looks better, what has the better interior, what rides better. Of course, you'll find a bias when subjective matters are being discussed but that doesn't apply here.

The Lexus forum that I used to frequent, CL, was very objective when it came down to performance discussions. It was widely acknowledged that the cars are close enough that it will all depend on the driver. (Other than top end where a stock F will beat a stock M3 due to the limiter).

Fwiw, there is a member here that has owned and tracked both and the F came out on top in straight line and track numbers.

You know these forums would be no fun if we were all objective.

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by Scoobe

In all Lexus is making progress but they are chasing legends in AMG and M. Both are known for making the cars vast departures from their cousin platforms. That takes an enormous investment that Lexus has not yet made. If Lexus really wants to go head to head with M and AMG, they are going to need a much larger focus from Toyota to do it. As long as the "F division" is building off a patchwork of existing Lexus equipment, it's going to have a hard time breaking into the "elite" club of M and AMG. Look no further than Audi to see how long it takes to just get into the same conversation as those two.

Good post.

The IS F was a skunkworks project that was never actually intended for mainstream production.

The LF A was an excercise in demonstrating their performance capabilities and to expand the brand image. Even though it took too long and they spent a ridiculous amount of money, it has changed the perception of the brand to some degree. If some of that tech trickles down to upcoming models it is certainly a win for Lexus.

Unless they commit to doing F cars across the range (GS F is rumored to be coming) that truly compete with the AMG's and M's on all levels, they will struggle with brand cache. Not really relevant when approaching things from a performance perspective, but we all know there are multitudes of luxury car buyers that care more about the badge on the hood than the car itself.

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by Cabinetman

You know these forums would be no fun if we were all objective.

Haha...true...and fwiw, I wasn't referring to you.

[slo_guy]

Originally Posted by trapit

That's a shame, my F-250 runs 13.0

But what would it run in Denver?

[BMRLVR]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

You're both actually wrong.

No actually your wrong not us........ we were both responding to "you" stating that the responses were "expected responses from a BMW Forum" not the OP. Granted the OP's question was not answered by most people, instead they responded with their opinions/subjective remarks.

All I said in my response was that you would get the same kind of remarks on a Lexus Forum..... how was I wrong in saying this??? Are Lexus owners better people that are indifferent/totally objective???

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by BMRLVR

No actually your wrong not us........ we were both responding to "you" stating that the responses were "expected responses from a BMW Forum" not the OP. Granted the OP's question was not answered by most people, instead they responded with their opinions/subjective remarks.

All I said in my response was that you would get the same kind of remarks on a Lexus Forum..... how was I wrong in saying this??? Are Lexus owners better people that are indifferent/totally objective???

What part don't you understand?

You are wrong in saying you would get the same kind of remarks on the Lexus forum I used to frequent. It is far more open minded and objective than any BMW site I've ever experienced. Why are you baiting with the "better people" comment?

Spend some times on other forums. Out of the MB, Porsche, Lexus forums (6speed encompasses them all) and BMW forums that I participate in, the BMW sites seem to be the most insecure and unwilling to have non-biased discussions.

P.S. Btw....it's "you're" not "your".

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

You are wrong... No, you are wrong... sounds like a regular forum to me.

[IFX]

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

I mean, it is a BMW forum after all. Head over to a Lexus forum and see what type of answers you'll get. I'm pretty sure it'll be the IS-F. Then you can go over there and say "Expected responses from a Lexus forum. "

it doesn't matter what forum you're on, we're enthusiasts. (Well i'am)
You should appreciate a good car when you see one.

Some of you are just BMW dickriders sipping that BMW kool-aid.

Get off of it. There are other great cars out there, and the IS-F is one of them.

[BMRLVR]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

What part don't you understand?

You are wrong in saying you would get the same kind of remarks on the Lexus forum I used to frequent. It is far more open minded and objective than any BMW site I've ever experienced. Why are you baiting with the "better people" comment?

Spend some times on other forums. Out of the MB, Porsche, Lexus forums (6speed encompasses them all) and BMW forums that I participate in, the BMW sites seem to be the most insecure and unwilling to have non-biased discussions.

P.S. Btw....it's "you're" not "your".

If you ask me you are the only one baiting..... I have never posted on a Lexus IS-F Forum because I don't own one and am not interested in owning one at this point. You on the other hand are trolling on M3Post singing the virtues of Lexus owners and cutting us BMW owners down when you don't have an M3, in my opinion, that is not very classy.

The reason why Lexus, MB, and Porsche Forums are more open is plain and simple..... there are fewer enthusiasts involved on those sites and fewer of the owners of those cars are enthusiasts. You can plainly see by the number of posts, views, and threads that the most activity on of all the car Forums in this category is the BMW Forums by far...... The reason why people like yourself, footie etc. come over here and post the virtues of other brands like Lexus and Audi is because you actually get a reply from fellow enthusiasts over here..... Instead of posting and waiting for days before you get a reply.

I respect the capabilities, performance and quality of the IS-F, C63, RS4, and RS5 but I drive an M3 and prefer it to either of the other candidates in this list (To be honest the only other one I would consider out of those 4 choices is the RS4 because the one thing I have to have in a performance car is a manual transmission and the RS4 is the only one of those cars that even offers it)

Please realize that my original reply to you was not intended to offend you, I was just basically replying with the reciprocal of your post.


P.S. BTW.... You are right it should have been "You're" and not "Your". Try and refrain from stooping to the level of correcting grammar and punctuation on the forums. I have to admit, I do try and make my posts as grammatically correct as possible, without spending too much time proof reading. I don't think it makes a person seem smart by correcting someones punctuation and grammar.

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

Originally Posted by IFX

it doesn't matter what forum you're on, we're enthusiasts. (Well i'am)
You should appreciate a good car when you see one.

Some of you are just BMW dickriders sipping that BMW kool-aid.

Get off of it. There are other great cars out there, and the IS-F is one of them.

I'm not saying there aren't. People on the BMW boards obviously prefer BMW. Hence why they bought one and decided to join a BMW forum. There are people, that can appreciate other brands but if I buy a 911 Turbo, or a C63, or even a Mustang, you can damn well bet I'm going to be singing praises and recommending it to anyone and everyone. I won't be signing up on a BMW forum when I own a another make. Just sayin'.

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by BMRLVR

If you ask me you are the only one baiting..... I have never posted on a Lexus IS-F Forum because I don't own one and am not interested in owning one at this point. You on the other hand are trolling on M3Post singing the virtues of Lexus owners and cutting us BMW owners down when you don't have an M3, in my opinion, that is not very classy.

The reason why Lexus, MB, and Porsche Forums are more open is plain and simple..... there are fewer enthusiasts involved on those sites and fewer of the owners of those cars are enthusiasts. You can plainly see by the number of posts, views, and threads that the most activity on of all the car Forums in this category is the BMW Forums by far...... The reason why people like yourself, footie etc. come over here and post the virtues of other brands like Lexus and Audi is because you actually get a reply from fellow enthusiasts over here..... Instead of posting and waiting for days before you get a reply.

I respect the capabilities, performance and quality of the IS-F, C63, RS4, and RS5 but I drive an M3 and prefer it to either of the other candidates in this list (To be honest the only other one I would consider out of those 4 choices is the RS4 because the one thing I have to have in a performance car is a manual transmission and the RS4 is the only one of those cars that even offers it)

Please realize that my original reply to you was not intended to offend you, I was just basically replying with the reciprocal of your post.


P.S. BTW.... You are right it should have been "You're" and not "Your". Try and refrain from stooping to the level of correcting grammar and punctuation on the forums. I have to admit, I do try and make my posts as grammatically correct as possible, without spending too much time proof reading. I don't think it makes a person seem smart by correcting someones punctuation and grammar.

This is exactly the kind of attitude that leads to the perception of M3 drivers.

Please show me where I said anything negative about the M3 or was "cutting down M3 owners"? I stated two facts. That as far as speed goes comparing the two cars it's a drivers race. FACT. I also stated that CL is a more objective site when discussing these two cars. Also FACT. If "cutting down" is pointing out that you're wrong, we'll have to disagree.

For you to think that only M3 owners should be posting here is a complete and total joke. It is the "M3 vs. " forum after all. You start a discussion about one of the cars I actually own and I'm not allowed to talk about it? Laughable. Secondly, I own a current BMW, had another one before that, and have been around them for years before with my father's vehicles.

Somehow BMW drivers are more car enthusiasts than other brands? Also highly laughable. The M3 has been around longer, set the benchmark, and continues to be a good offering so of course there are going to be more M3 enthusiasts than the other options. But to suggest other brands don't have plenty of enthusiasts is bordering on fanboy. Guess you can't be an enthusiast if you don't drive the almighty M3?

It's ironic that you have chosen to post only responses to my posts creating animosity than actually talking about the thread topic when I didn't say one negative thing about the M3 or their owners.

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

And in all honesty, I'm part of many MB,BMW,Lexus,Audi,Acura forums and BMW has the largest following by far followed by MB,then Lexus, finally Audi. All great cars, but not as great of a following. No other brand has the culture to throw something like Bimmerfest.

I feel bad for Audi owners because they don't have any active forums to visit. Fourtitude, and AudiWorld aren't as populated as Bimmerpost, even if you put them together.

P.S. I don't think BMRLVR he was saying only BMW owners should post here. I think he's saying you should of known of the answers you were going to get because it's a BMW forum.

[-=Hot|Ice=-]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

^ I agree with that statement... but you'll always get a somewhat bias response on any corresponding forum.

I never really understood the M3 fanboy attitude... I love that there are other cars out there that are in the same league, healthy competition is what pushes car makers to improve.

I love to see S4's, C63's, and IS-F's around town... it shows that we are all car-nuts, just prefer different flavors. In the end you can't go wrong with any of those cars... it comes down to what you prefer.

And I agree, on the track all these cars are pretty close, which means it depends on the driver's skill and balls. Any good track driver can take any of theses cars and beat the crap out of a mediocre driver in an M3.

Exactly the point I was trying to make.

[alms211]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

^ I agree with that statement... but you'll always get a somewhat bias response on any corresponding forum.

I never really understood the M3 fanboy attitude... I love that there are other cars out there that are in the same league, healthy competition is what pushes car makers to improve.

I love to see S4's, C63's, and IS-F's around town... it shows that we are all car-nuts, just prefer different flavors. In the end you can't go wrong with any of those cars... it comes down to what you prefer.

And I agree, on the track all these cars are pretty close, which means it depends on the driver's skill and balls. Any good track driver can take any of theses cars and beat the crap out of a mediocre driver in an M3.

I am on 6Speed, Corvetteforum, Rennlist, M5Board, and here. There are fanboi douches on every single one of them. It just comes with the territory. I never have been one and (hopefully) never will be one. I can appreciate all great cars regardless of the badge on the hood. Vette guys can be as bad, if not worse, than the Porsche, Audi and BMW guys.

I've tired of pointing it out to them.

[BMRLVR]

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-

P.S. I don't think BMRLVR he was saying only BMW owners should post here. I think he's saying you should of known of the answers you were going to get because it's a BMW forum.

At least someone realizes what I was saying

[trapit]

Originally Posted by slo_guy

But what would it run in Denver?

Pretty sure it's high 13's on stock tires...I ran 13.0 on 35" mud terrains haha...turbos in the high altitude, gotta love um

[klammer]

Who's the fastest driver?

[klammer]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Not me... just ask Ilia - I drive like his grandma.

lol:
Heard she lapped the ring in under 8:00 in a spec miata though...

[blast1st]

Originally Posted by E92_SID

Wow. This is depressing. The best stock M3s have run here in Denver (5280ft above sea level) is 14.7 at 100

oviously the m3 owner doesnt know how to drive. lol

[houstonT]

Having owned an 08 ISF and an 09 ISF (and now an 11 M3) I would say that from a dig the DCT M3 with lc is quicker. The ISF is a TOUGH car to launch, especially with the older STIFF suspension. The 11 ISF might be easier with LSD and a more compliant suspension. From a roll, TOO close for my butt dyno to determine. Overall both great cars...
Peter