Cadillac prices 2009 CTS-V from $59,995:

[TLud]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

Nothing wrong with the drivetrain in those cars either, reliability-wise.

Bruce

You've got to be kidding. Try telling that to the few 1st gen. CTS-V owners who took their cars out to the track. Have you even driven one?

I've noticed that you have a penchant for tossing out unsupported conjecture like it's fact. This is more of the same.

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by TLud

You've got to be kidding. Try telling that to the few 1st gen. CTS-V owners who took their cars out to the track. Have you even driven one?

I've noticed that you have a penchant for tossing out unsupported conjecture like it's fact. This is more of the same.

I have in fact driven one, on track. It went quite well, thank you.

I even tried a hard start after discussing it with the student, and sure enough, horrendous axle hop. He said he'd complained about it to the service guys, who said amongst other things that there was no fix for it, but that they they hadn't had any issues with broken drivetrain components. That's just anecdotal, however, but speaking of unsupported conjecture, how about you come up with some actual fact in regard to CTS or CTS-V drivetrain problems.

Thanks in advance,

Bruce

[thefly]

ARE YOU SERIOUS?

here is one of many samples:
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...p-carnage.html

do a search on broken diff.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...es-forum-2004/

or if you are a member click below, and obviously you aren't cause you know the diff, was the weak point in gen 1 cars.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...earchid=903197



just searching on broken differential brings up over 317 threads. 2004-2005's actually have a recall to replacing the bushing and in several cases replace the differential with a newer '06 one. the early one would develop a horrible whine at about 40-45 mph so loud you could barely have a conversation in the car. the suspension and differential were never designed to handle the power the car was generating. many actually resorted to installing all kinds of custom parts to keep it from breaking under load.

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by thefly

ARE YOU SERIOUS?

do a search on broken diff.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...es-forum-2004/

or if you are a member click below, and obviously you aren't cause you know the diff, was the weak point in gen 1 cars.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...earchid=903197

just searching on broken differential brings up over 317 threads. 2004-2005's actually have a recall to replacing the bushing and in several cases replace the differential with a newer '06 one. the early one would develop a horrible whine at about 40-45 mph so loud you could barely have a conversation in the car. the suspension and differential were never designed to handle the power the car was generating. many actually resorted to installing all kinds of custom parts to keep it from breaking under load.

Well hell, I can't get into that site without registering (which I don't feel like doing), but I'll take your word for it, and I guess I'm quite guilty of unsupported conjecture, after all.

How 'bout I change my initial post to something on the order of "engine and transmission ought to be reliable" - and we'll see about the differential.

Bruce

[TLud]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

I have in fact driven one, on track. It went quite well, thank you.

I even tried a hard start after discussing it with the student, and sure enough, horrendous axle hop. He said he'd complained about it to the service guys, who said amongst other things that there was no fix for it, but that they they hadn't had any issues with broken drivetrain components. That's just anecdotal, however, but speaking of unsupported conjecture, how about you come up with some actual fact in regard to CTS or CTS-V drivetrain problems.

Thanks in advance,

Bruce

So you're going off of the word of one owner who was allegedly told by his (completely unbiased, of course) service department that the CTS-V drivetrain hadn't had any broken components or issues? Wow.

My uncle was one of those who blew his diff. I personally test drove a low-mileage used '05 CTS-V, and the engine sounded like it was running without any lubrication and the transmission had so much play and made so much noise that it felt like it was going to fall out after every hard shift.

But don't just take my word for it. As thefly has already pointed out, the horor stories aren't hard to find.

[TLud]

One would think that the tried and proven LS6 engine and the T56 tranny, which was further reinforced for use in the CTS-V, would have been solid. My suspicion is that problems arose from simply dropping this drivetrain (even reinforced) into a car not designed from the ground up to handle that kind of power. It sounds like Cadillac has learned their lesson in this regard though and engineered the 2nd generation CTS around the V model.

[thefly]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

Well hell, I can't get into that site without registering (which I don't feel like doing), but I'll take your word for it, and I guess I'm quite guilty of unsupported conjecture, after all.

How 'bout I change my initial post to something on the order of "engine and transmission ought to be reliable" - and we'll see about the differential.

Bruce

now that i would agree with. the LSX motors combined with the tranny are very reliable, requiring little maintenance till 100K, and the tranny held up to abuse also. and the early motors respond well to mods (except really nitrous on the high compression ones)...

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by TLud

So you're going off of the word of one owner who was allegedly told by his (completely unbiased, of course) service department that the CTS-V drivetrain hadn't had any broken components or issues? Wow.

My uncle was one of those who blew his diff. I personally test drove a low-mileage used '05 CTS-V, and the engine sounded like it was running without any lubrication and the transmission had so much play and made so much noise that it felt like it was going to fall out after every hard shift.

But don't just take my word for it. As thefly has already pointed out, the horor stories aren't hard to find.

I already did my mea culpa above. Is there something else you require?

Bruce

[TLud]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

I already did my mea culpa above. Is there something else you require?

Bruce

I posted that before I saw your acknowledgement. Hence my second post immediately after. My ire has been appeased. Carry on.

[spearfisher]

I think time will tell with the 09 CTS-V, the brakes are from the ZO6, suspension, engine and trans, from the ZR-1, all parts that should be reliable, but it's in a car that weigh 4200+ lbs, so more pounding on the drivetrain. But that much HP and performance for 59k is impressive.

[Heat00]

an ugly GM for almost the same price for a piece of art like the M3......

[Congoman775]

The New CTS-V is one BADASS car.



Performance wise...

CTS-V > M5


everything else...

M5 > CTS-V

[Heat00]

IMO it should read more like this:


Performance wise..

M3 > CTS-V

everything else
M3 > CTS-V

[MTROIS]

Is this the same model as the one that was tested in Top Gear (

) or is it a new one?

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by Heat00

IMO it should read more like this:

Performance wise..

M3 > CTS-V

everything else
M3 > CTS-V

Looking forward to somebody's comparison test with this new member of the cast - along with repeats of everybody else, including a working DCT in the M3.

If equipped with an auto, the V will likely win the acceleration runs. It'll also very likely win in things like luxury, rear seat space and perhaps a couple of other things like sound levels.

The real reason I'd like to see yet another comparison test is to see how a properly programed M3 auto will do against the CTS-V auto on track. I'm thinking that since the V seems to be an able competitor for the M5 in such a venue, these cars will be very close indeed.

On the street, different story, I think. The M3 is big and heavy at over 3600 pounds and will never be considered really tossable, but it's a will-of-the-wisp compared to the M5-sized, 4300 pound Cadillac. As a back road bandit, it will play rapier to the V's broadsword, I think. Both weapons are very effective in combat, though. At a guess, the V will be hugely competent, the bimmer as competent but more exhilarating by comparison.

In cruise mode, advantage Cadillac.

Bruce

[thefly]

yeah, i am really curious about the interior feel, and how the luxury is. i just couldn't bring myself to buy another one, and face the depreciation that they have. though my old salesman said i could come by and take one out for a spin

[Congoman775]

Originally Posted by Heat00

IMO it should read more like this:


Performance wise..

M3 > CTS-V

everything else
M3 > CTS-V

the CTS-V beat the M5 in a comparo...

M5>M3

V>M5

V>M3

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by Congoman775

the CTS-V beat the M5 in a comparo...

M5>M3

V>M5

V>M3

Are you sure the M5 will beat the M3 around any given race course? I'm not.

Bruce

[EnemyM3]

I've owned 2 Cadillac CTS-V's. A Black 2005 and a Silver 2007. The only issue I've ever had was a some noise from my differential on the 2007.

My M3 is going into the shop tomorrow with 10k miles on it.

Frankly I miss the torque in the CTS-V. I don't know if I'm in love with the styling but I'll have to see how it looks in person. When that new CTS-V reaches dealers, you better believe I'm gonna go look at one.....

I love my M but sometimes I find myself avoiding 335i's in case they're chipped. You guys should do some research on the reviews of the new V.

[Congoman775]

Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast.

Are you sure the M5 will beat the M3 around any given race course? I'm not.

Bruce

nope im not. Nor do i care. the CTS-V beat the M3 around the Ring.

CTS-V > M3

CTS-V > M5

[UltimateBMW]

Originally Posted by Congoman775

nope im not. Nor do i care. the CTS-V beat the M3 around the Ring.

CTS-V > M3

CTS-V > M5

The 'ring is a power track though. While it has alot of turns, what track wouldn't at 10 miles in length?

Most of the track is straights.

[Congoman775]

Originally Posted by UltimateBMW

The 'ring is a power track though. While it has alot of turns, what track wouldn't at 10 miles in length?

Most of the track is straights.

even so, there is a reason it is used as a benchmark for automotive track ability.