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      11-27-2010, 02:08 PM   #1
SIIK2NR
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335i xdrive vs. M3

Drove almost a thousand miles in 3 days in a loner car from BMW due to an error on their part. All I can say is that the m3 is in a different league As the 335. Specifically in the handling dept. NA power also feels much more responsive. I'll be one of the those that buys the new v6 turbo M's.... But I hope BMW isn't making a mistake here. Bottom line is that I was glad to get my M back and the spirited driving put the smile
Back on my face!
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      11-27-2010, 02:19 PM   #2
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Agreed- I just got rid if my 335xi and feel the M3 is in another league as well. I like the NA V8 much better than the turbo. Still don't understand the "you'll miss the torque of the 335" comments. So long as you are in the correct RPM range the M3 pulls very nicely and I like the power delivery much better. Had a JB3 on the 335 also.
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      11-27-2010, 02:43 PM   #3
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GhostRide, I own a 2010 M3 and a 2008 335i and would have to disagree with your assessment of the V8. I do concede that the M requires a better understanding of the engine and current/proper gear for desired acceleration. And a willingness to shift gears more frequently.
However, having put over 11K miles on my M3 since I bought it in April, I have found it to be brutally fast in every situation when directly compared to my 335. If I drive the 335 after several days, weeks, or a month of driving the M3, I wonder where all the power has gone. When I get back into the M, my mind has to noticeably speed up to get back up to speed with the sheer acceleration and handling abilities of the fast car.
I will say this, it took me 3 or 4 months of daily driving my M3 to fully understand how to ring out every ounce of performance from the M3 in all situations. In comparison, the 335 feels more accessible right out of the gate. I think this partly has to do with the loaded throttle tip-in of the 335. The first 10 to 15% of throttle travel of the tti delivers much more torque and power than the rest of the throttle travel, while the M3 is much more linear.
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      11-27-2010, 02:49 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by JustABreathAway View Post
I will say this, it took me 3 or 4 months of daily driving my M3 to fully understand how to ring out every ounce of performance from the M3 in all situations. In comparison, the 335 feels more accessible right out of the gate. I think this partly has to do with the loaded throttle tip-in of the 335. The first 10 to 15% of throttle travel of the tti delivers much more torque and power than the rest of the throttle travel, while the M3 is much more linear.
Total newbie with the M3 as I just picked mine up last night. Have to agree with the 335 being more accessible out the gate. Having only put on 100 miles, I am def trying to still figure this thing out! So many settings to choose from. I am also babying this thing like you wouldn't believe. Can't wait to get to the 1200 mile mark and really see what this can do. The M-DCT is def something to get used to, well, at least for me.
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      11-27-2010, 06:43 PM   #5
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I always said and will say again....
335 is the new kid on the block, trying to strut its stuff around. Its a nice car, and no matter how many packages BMW creates for it, it will not be a M series vehicle.
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      11-27-2010, 07:49 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIIK2NR View Post
Drove almost a thousand miles in 3 days in a loner car from BMW due to an error on their part. All I can say is that the m3 is in a different league As the 335. Specifically in the handling dept. NA power also feels much more responsive. I'll be one of the those that buys the new v6 turbo M's.... But I hope BMW isn't making a mistake here. Bottom line is that I was glad to get my M back and the spirited driving put the smile
Back on my face!
did the fuel pump go on the 335? did the front end feel like it was going to fall off when you hit the smallest of bumps? did the engine catch fire?. i wouldnt touch the 335 unless they gave it to me for free.
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      11-27-2010, 08:02 PM   #7
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Another 335 vs M3 thread...Why??
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      11-27-2010, 09:04 PM   #8
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Another 335 vs M3 thread...Why??
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      11-27-2010, 09:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustABreathAway View Post
GhostRide, I own a 2010 M3 and a 2008 335i and would have to disagree with your assessment of the V8. I do concede that the M requires a better understanding of the engine and current/proper gear for desired acceleration. And a willingness to shift gears more frequently.
However, having put over 11K miles on my M3 since I bought it in April, I have found it to be brutally fast in every situation when directly compared to my 335. If I drive the 335 after several days, weeks, or a month of driving the M3, I wonder where all the power has gone. When I get back into the M, my mind has to noticeably speed up to get back up to speed with the sheer acceleration and handling abilities of the fast car.
I will say this, it took me 3 or 4 months of daily driving my M3 to fully understand how to ring out every ounce of performance from the M3 in all situations. In comparison, the 335 feels more accessible right out of the gate. I think this partly has to do with the loaded throttle tip-in of the 335. The first 10 to 15% of throttle travel of the tti delivers much more torque and power than the rest of the throttle travel, while the M3 is much more linear.
I see you are new. Just a little FYI... Ghost is a troll. He's all over threads bashing the M3. He doesn't even drive a BMW... yet he likes to offer commentary on the M3. I'm guessing he's not even old enough to drive. Try to resist the temptation to engage him/her. It goes nowhere.

More on topic, I've been driving a 335 for most of the last month, and while I like the car, it's nothing compared to the M. I miss my car.
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      11-27-2010, 10:12 PM   #10
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I have to say that I've always like a NA motor better than TC/SC motor.

Let's not start another 335 vs. M3 thread but we all know that those two cars are in different leagues.

And whoever claims that the 335 is "more accessible" than an M3 are smoking some serious stuff, what in the world is more accessible? Driving at around the city in 5th gear at 1,200RPMs? Yeah, torque will pull you forward in that situation but I see no reason to be driving in such a speed/range combo.

I rarely drive my M in D, always in S4 minimum (maybe S3 very rarely) --- the engine requires an understanding, it begs you to drive it properly. Remember, we redline at 8,300 here.

If you bought an M3 and are driving in 5th gear at 30mph you deserve an execution by a Chinese firing squad. The S65 is not meant for driving like that, it lives above the 3,000 mark. If you know how to drive the car you'll understand why it is what it is.

I remember when I had my W211 E55 - what a beast of a motor that was, but it wasn't brilliant, it was a big block AMG motor with a SC blowing away. It still hauled ass and was a storm on the road. The 6,3 AMG NA V8 is a brilliant motor - NA, just an amazing engine. Same goes with the S85/S65 - brilliant motors. Add Ferrari's engines in this "brilliant motor" category.

I have never been overly impressed with SC/TC motors (OK, the 911 TT not included!). I feel it's a major achievement to achieve specs/numbers on a NA engine that are close if not better than SC engines. It's more a marvel of engineering than slapping a SC/TC on. Even when I was about to sign a lease on a 2010 911 "S" PDK that motor felt absolutely incredible. I couldn't imagine how much better the TT could be, until I drove it, I realized it was a very similar motor - with twin-turbochargers.

I remember something that Walter Rohrl said "I think a naturally aspirated engine is best suited for the track while a turbocharged engine is great for the city when you need that extra power to pull you forward." I agree and disagree with this statement since I feel this all depends on YOUR driving style.

Some of us will always continue to drive 35mph in 5th gear (regardless of the car) and some of us will feel the need to be one with the car, time the shifts, time the ranges, make sure we're driving the car properly. I personally fall into the latter car and that's why I bought an M3.

Just my opinion
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      11-28-2010, 12:27 AM   #11
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      11-29-2010, 04:57 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustABreathAway View Post
GhostRide, I own a 2010 M3 and a 2008 335i and would have to disagree with your assessment of the V8. I do concede that the M requires a better understanding of the engine and current/proper gear for desired acceleration. And a willingness to shift gears more frequently.
However, having put over 11K miles on my M3 since I bought it in April, I have found it to be brutally fast in every situation when directly compared to my 335. If I drive the 335 after several days, weeks, or a month of driving the M3, I wonder where all the power has gone. When I get back into the M, my mind has to noticeably speed up to get back up to speed with the sheer acceleration and handling abilities of the fast car.
I will say this, it took me 3 or 4 months of daily driving my M3 to fully understand how to ring out every ounce of performance from the M3 in all situations. In comparison, the 335 feels more accessible right out of the gate. I think this partly has to do with the loaded throttle tip-in of the 335. The first 10 to 15% of throttle travel of the tti delivers much more torque and power than the rest of the throttle travel, while the M3 is much more linear.
+100000


My M3 is scary fast

My 335i was never scary fast
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      11-29-2010, 05:34 AM   #13
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there is no comparison.
the 335 has serious engine problems and needs bmw to completely rectify the situation before i will ever consider a turbo engine bmw. huge company issue for bmw to save its customer base.
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      11-29-2010, 05:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
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there is no comparison.
the 335 has serious engine problems and needs bmw to completely rectify the situation before i will ever consider a turbo engine bmw. huge company issue for bmw to save its customer base.
There is no comparison, however, the 335 hardly has "serious engine problems". There are some fuel pump problems but let's not get carried away. Although the M3 is clearly the better car let us not forget its DCT safety issues.

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      11-29-2010, 11:32 PM   #15
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I'll never forget my 1ST M3 in 08' I traded in a audi a5 and the dealer loaned me a 335i for a day. i was like wow, this car has power. The M3 must be a killer then.

Pulled out of dealer two days later in brand new M3, pushed it a little and was thinking "thats it?" This is a 414 hp car? WTF? BUT after break-in and "learning" the car it is scary fast. It's funny, the torque on the 335 is decieving but a broke in M3 with a trained driver is a sleeping giant.

11" M3 ZCP intake/xpipes/exhaust/pulleys makes it even better! I will mourn the loss of the V8. BMW should just put the 4.4L S65 in the next M3. They would save money too by already having the motor in production! Are you reading this BMW!
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      11-30-2010, 10:47 AM   #16
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i think the main enemy is weight. if somehow I can find a used m3 v8 for less than 10k and shove that in my e46 m3 (stripped down to 3200lbs). it would be a rocket.
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      12-03-2010, 10:45 AM   #17
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o boyyyy....

here goes....









M3>335!

there, I said it.
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      12-03-2010, 12:47 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaykay View Post
I have to say that I've always like a NA motor better than TC/SC motor.

Let's not start another 335 vs. M3 thread but we all know that those two cars are in different leagues.

And whoever claims that the 335 is "more accessible" than an M3 are smoking some serious stuff, what in the world is more accessible? Driving at around the city in 5th gear at 1,200RPMs? Yeah, torque will pull you forward in that situation but I see no reason to be driving in such a speed/range combo.

I rarely drive my M in D, always in S4 minimum (maybe S3 very rarely) --- the engine requires an understanding, it begs you to drive it properly. Remember, we redline at 8,300 here.

If you bought an M3 and are driving in 5th gear at 30mph you deserve an execution by a Chinese firing squad. The S65 is not meant for driving like that, it lives above the 3,000 mark. If you know how to drive the car you'll understand why it is what it is.

I remember when I had my W211 E55 - what a beast of a motor that was, but it wasn't brilliant, it was a big block AMG motor with a SC blowing away. It still hauled ass and was a storm on the road. The 6,3 AMG NA V8 is a brilliant motor - NA, just an amazing engine. Same goes with the S85/S65 - brilliant motors. Add Ferrari's engines in this "brilliant motor" category.

I have never been overly impressed with SC/TC motors (OK, the 911 TT not included!). I feel it's a major achievement to achieve specs/numbers on a NA engine that are close if not better than SC engines. It's more a marvel of engineering than slapping a SC/TC on. Even when I was about to sign a lease on a 2010 911 "S" PDK that motor felt absolutely incredible. I couldn't imagine how much better the TT could be, until I drove it, I realized it was a very similar motor - with twin-turbochargers.

I remember something that Walter Rohrl said "I think a naturally aspirated engine is best suited for the track while a turbocharged engine is great for the city when you need that extra power to pull you forward." I agree and disagree with this statement since I feel this all depends on YOUR driving style.

Some of us will always continue to drive 35mph in 5th gear (regardless of the car) and some of us will feel the need to be one with the car, time the shifts, time the ranges, make sure we're driving the car properly. I personally fall into the latter car and that's why I bought an M3.

Just my opinion
I think power is more accessible in the 335i for daily driving because at normal driving speeds/rpms, you are right there in the power band. If you need to pass someone you can just step on the gas and you are gone without much of a peep. In the M3 you need to downshift a gear or 2 all while making enough noise to have every head turn to look at you. Obviously it depends on the driver, but I think it's safe to assume that for the average driver, the x35i cars make a better daily driver with a more accessible power band (for everyday driving). Obviously I prefer the nature of the M3, but there are times when I wish I could pass a v6 camry (who apparently decides to "race" me) before the next light without going above 5000rpms (and sounding like I'm racing him). That's something you can do in the 335i because it's not so loud.
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      12-03-2010, 12:53 PM   #19
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Quote:
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+100000


My M3 is scary fast

My 335i was never scary fast
Actually I have to disagree with this. My chipped 335i was scary fast, with the scary part coming from the fact that the chassis never kept up with the pull of the engine. I'd constantly find myself doing 40mph more than the rest of the car was prepared to deal with - floaty suspension, inconsistent rear traction and/or runflats, excessive front/back load transfer etc.
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      12-03-2010, 03:13 PM   #20
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Exactly right. I, too, had a chipped 335i and it felt torquey below the 3500 RPM line, but that was the extent of it. Revving higher felt like I was going to hurt it as the suspension struggled to hang on. When pushing harder, the torque faded and the engine strained.

Now enter my new M3 with ZCP... rev to 3500 RPM and the Nav lady says, "Is that all you've got Big Boy?" It's a whole other level. I've had to completely adjust my driving style to match the M3's potential.

Folks who whine about the M3 not having enough torque on the low side are not properly driving it. I know so because I was one of them.
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      12-06-2010, 04:02 AM   #21
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Actually I have to disagree with this. My chipped 335i was scary fast, with the scary part coming from the fact that the chassis never kept up with the pull of the engine. I'd constantly find myself doing 40mph more than the rest of the car was prepared to deal with - floaty suspension, inconsistent rear traction and/or runflats, excessive front/back load transfer etc.


My 335i was never chipped, it was a fast car and that's all.

The M3 though
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      12-10-2010, 03:58 PM   #22
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Iíve had my mechanicís 335i for two days while heís putting a brake system on my M3, and Iím really impressed with it. The twin turbo setup has really reduced lag, and like all blowers, you get a lot of low end torque, a great combination for a high performance street car. I couldnít tell much about the handling, as this one had Eibach springs, and they are way too stiff. I donít know which spring set it is, but with street tires, I think the car would be all over the place on track. Maybe dampers with greater control would help, but I found it uncomfortable and, when pushed, difficult to control. But Iím sure itís totally different with the OE springs.
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