Any love for MCS?

[dbyrd]

I'm interested in any feedback for MCS single adjustables for street and monthly track days for my daily driver. I've searched and I don't see much on the forum. I'm looking at 450/900 spring rates.
Thanks folks.

[Yaw]

I suppose my feedback would be why would buy MCS singles when you can get Ohlins road and track for the same price? Also, I think you will be giving up grip at those spring rates particularly on corner exit and especially over bumps. If you are looking to firm up response then get a larger front anti-roll bar.

[Richbot]

Currently have about 25000 street miles and tons of competition events on my MCS double remotes. Would buy again. Search for more info

[dbyrd]

Originally Posted by Yaw

I suppose my feedback would be why would buy MCS singles when you can get Ohlins road and track for the same price? Also, I think you will be giving up grip at those spring rates particularly on corner exit and especially over bumps. If you are looking to firm up response then get a larger front anti-roll bar.

I considered Ohlins, but I'm hearing they are more street oriented, and I may turn this into a full-time track car in the future. I also heard that the MCS is as good if not better than Ohlins. What spring rates do you recommend?

I appreciate the feedback!

[Z K]

The Ohlins "Road and Track" are track ready and still comfortable to drive every day on the street. Ohlins shocks are used in all forms of competition and OEM on Lamborghini, Pagani and other high performance cars. If you are looking for a great package, this is it. They also have the TTX which is designed for competition racing use.

[Yaw]

The opinion of Ohlins being more street oriented is the softer spring rate with the dampers valved around that spring rate. MCS states they offer a wider range of adjustment with the idea that they can be used on a wider range of spring rates but I would argue that is a compromise and makes them more of a generic damper vs. the Ohlins which are designed for the specific application.

[Groundpilot]

OP, there are two members on this forum, i forgot their screen names, they posted very fast lap times at WGI with MCS single adjustables. On the other hand, Ohlins R&T get exellent reviews by owners. We just recently installed this system on my m3, i have not tested it on the track yet, but from what i feel so far, the ride is better than stock EDC, and car feels very stable at high speed corners with some body roll. But that could be attributed to the soft settings that i chose for street driving. Will come back with my review after i hit WGI soon.

[Richbot]

Originally Posted by Yaw

The opinion of Ohlins being more street oriented is the softer spring rate with the dampers valved around that spring rate. MCS states they offer a wider range of adjustment with the idea that they can be used on a wider range of spring rates but I would argue that is a compromise and makes them more of a generic damper vs. the Ohlins which are designed for the specific application.

More adjustment range means you get more adjustment range. Dampers are dampers and spring are springs. How much spring a damper can "handle" is a construct of the internet as far as I can tell, and means nothing without real numbers put to it. Less adjustment range means less adjustment range. There's nothing "application specific" about that other than a damper with less range is often less expensive to manufacture. More means more. Valving that provides a great deal of adjustment is more difficult to make and not many people bother with it, so it costs more. For most people, it's not worth it. For most people, setting and forgetting with a known spring and bar and wheel and tire combo is sufficient. This is what the OEM does and what most off the shelf spring plus damper coil over kits offer. For me it was necessary to be able to go from comfortable damping with OEM spring rates all the way to ludicrously overdamped, because stock springs were mandated by the rules and tons of damping was the only legal way to stiffen the car. The MCS dampers provide that plus the aforementioned excellent service after the sale. MCS dampers are on the same level as Moton, Penske, and the Ohlins high end stuff. They bake in the same quality to their entry level as they do their 3-ways, just a matter of how much you are willing to pay. Just like Ohlins seems to.

There is also no way to know from ad materials which one has the better damping curves, or which one maintains the integrity of te curve throughout its adjustment range. Shock dyno is the only way to know that. Rebound-only MCS could have less range for all we know, or be super linear, and vice versa

[Richbot]

Originally Posted by dbyrd

I considered Ohlins, but I'm hearing they are more street oriented, and I may turn this into a full-time track car in the future. I also heard that the MCS is as good if not better than Ohlins. What spring rates do you recommend?

I appreciate the feedback!

If I were in your shoes I would make my decisions based on what I will do with the car now. If you do get serious about tracking or racing a single adjustable is not going to be what you want anyway

I recommend calling Lex Carson at MCS he may talk you out of buying something from him, or talk you into something different, very knowledgeable and not a salesman.

[TheKosherStogie]

the ohlins R/T are too soft for the serious track rat. drove 2 cars with them, and one owner changed them after. Maybe if you can get them re valved for higher rates they would do better.

[dbyrd]

Seems like Richbot is the only one with much knowledge and feedback about MCS - I will call Lex, thanks. This will continue to be my DD for some time.

I hear more love for Ohlins, but I would like more info about MCS. Any reason to think that MCS is not as good (performance and quality) as Ohlins?

[Yaw]

While I agree with much of what Richbot is saying I do not agree with the point on dismissing application specific as being irrelevant. Ohlins are digressive and from the posted force curves I have seen, MCS are as well. If both their force curves were linear than I would somewhat agree more adjustment is better but they aren't, they're digressive, and the shape of the curve is much of what matters. And when you are talking single adjustables it really matters what compression looks like relative to rebound as you twist your one adjustment knob. Ultimately you want a damper to be valved for the spring that is on it and the chassis they are mounted to. I would quite like to see both shock dyno plots posted up for a true comparison.

[Richbot]

Sure but so long as one or two of the clicks on the range are optimal for most conditions the car will see or compete in, you are better served by a damper with a wider adjustment range. Digressive doesn't mean the knee lands the damping in the same place after the ramp. It's just a fancy way of saying the slope of the curve becomes sharply less steep at some point. A Digressive damper with a wider adjustment range will still be able to provide more damping force if that's where the range is bigger. And more damping force means more dampi force. Personally id rather have more tuning options than less, especially when you consider that a stiffer damper can take the place of a spring change for fine adjustments to balance, and takes 30 seconds rather than 30+ minutes for a spring change at one end or 2-3 minutes for a bar change

And glad we are in agreement that a dyno is the only way to know what's going on. Suspension tuners have been talking about matching components for years it's the number one marketing slogan "specifically tuned for your car" often meaning "we figured out the spring/damping rates it runs from the factory and didn't change it much!" Without a dyno showing how the damper behaves not only at the "default" setting but at each point in the range of adjustment, all we have to rely on is the assometer

[1MOREMOD]

I have mcs singles on my e46 and think they are great, my spring rates won't help you as wrong car. It was my understanding at time of purchase that the mcs is more geared towards a stiffer spring track set up and have great customer service as well.

[Groundpilot]

Hahahaha. Assometer could be a very accurate tool. Especially if that ass is very sensitive.

[PrimeBMW]

I have one of the first triple adj. MCS for an E46 M3, have driven the Miata on track used to develop the singles, have two friend with doubles (one on a 911 GT3 another on an E92 M3), and then there is 1moremod with singles……I guess I will call him a friend The MCS singles are spec for the new spec E46 class. MCS is also used in ST and GS Grand AM racing. Considering the singles are used in spec E46 I am sure they will be more than enough for HPDE. As far as I understand the quality of the singles is still top notch…….you just don’t get the extra adjustment. They are the top of my list and am considering them for my E92 M3 grocery getter
Spring rates? You will have to describe your driving expectations, style, experience, etc to an expert.
Call Eddie at AR Auto Service 503-697-3311 He has set up all the above mentioned cars and more with MCS. All cars are very fast.

[GTB/ZR-1]

Much love... Had the singles on my SCCA FR-S. Quality is fantastic & excellent support.

Would definitely do them again--anybody have a used set for sale? lol

[PrimeBMW]

Originally Posted by GTB/ZR-1

Much love... Had the singles on my SCCA FR-S. Quality is fantastic & excellent support.

Would definitely do them again--anybody have a used set for sale? lol

There you go....that explains it!

[bigjae1976]

WTF does track ready mean? That means nothing. What's suitable for a track only car? Depends. I like my TC Kline x2s on my E46...I'm going to keep running my TC Kline coilovers which are track ready in my opinion. I have no races to win and they make me happy.

Your main consideration is you'd like to run R-Comps or stickier tires in the future. Probably won't run full aero or need to win a race. I'd go with a coilover that has a well established acceptably performing spring rate for performance and comfort.

What you probably do NOT want is to have to fiddle around with spring rates. Quite frankly, the difference in the HPDE world between Ohlins R&T and MCS is all in the driver. You can debate which one is more track oriented until this thread is 1,000,000 pages long. You want to put the coilovers on and then drive with a smile on your face.

I ended up with the TC Kline's on my E46 because of the whole "the best spring rate depends on..." with every other coilover I asked other vendors about. Didn't want to waste my time and money trying to figure it all out. TC Kline did that work for me. I got my TC Kline's made one rebound adjustment. Haven't touched it 2.5 years later, still catch people in the corners. That makes it a great coilover. Nowadays there is more and more data for the MCS and JRZs. Just a thought.

[1MOREMOD]

Originally Posted by PrimeBMW

I have one of the first triple adj. MCS for an E46 M3, have driven the Miata on track used to develop the singles, have two friend with doubles (one on a 911 GT3 another on an E92 M3), and then there is 1moremod with singles……I guess I will call him a friend The MCS singles are spec for the new spec E46 class. MCS is also used in ST and GS Grand AM racing. Considering the singles are used in spec E46 I am sure they will be more than enough for HPDE. As far as I understand the quality of the singles is still top notch…….you just don’t get the extra adjustment. They are the top of my list and am considering them for my E92 M3 grocery getter
Spring rates? You will have to describe your driving expectations, style, experience, etc to an expert.
Call Eddie at AR Auto Service 503-697-3311 He has set up all the above mentioned cars and more with MCS. All cars are very fast.

hey?

[PrimeBMW]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

I have mcs singles on my e46 and think they are great, my spring rates won't help you as wrong car. It was my understanding at time of purchase that the mcs is more geared towards a stiffer spring track set up and have great customer service as well.

I'm glad you chimed in. Honestly I think the single would be the way to go for most. Things get a little complicated with doubles or triples.

[1MOREMOD]

Originally Posted by PrimeBMW

I'm glad you chimed in. Honestly I think the single would be the way to go for most. Things get a little complicated with doubles or triples.

I think that also, although I sometimes wonder if I should have gotten doubles. For now the singles are great. I adjust one click softer for pacific and that's all I have to do, simple. I think too many variables would just confuse me, I like to show up and drive not sort out problems.