Disappointing track experience is eating at me

[cmk227]

Originally Posted by armyav8tor

Yeah, you need the driver mod before coming to the conclusion that the M3 is not track worthy. I ran 2:13 at VIR full, one of the best track in North America with a mostly stock M3 w/ street rubber. Oh, and it was my 3rd time at the track. Granted I am a better driver than most but I ran 2:15 the first weekend there which is pretty ridiculous when most of the seasoned drivers can only muster laps in the 2:20s. I was the fastest guy in my group period the last time out. It is all because of the M3, makes this zero into a hero every time.

I want to be like you when I grow up.

[karussell]

without reading the replies, i am willing to bet the instructor and you didn't get along so well. sometimes an instructor/student combination just doesn't match up. nothing against either. I have had instructors that ruined my day and many more that made me hooked for more. when it was my turn to sit in the right seat I also experienced this on the other side. the good thing is there are many instructors and most clubs are happy to move you to another instructor. don't be afraid to ask for a different one. usually though they just want you to try something new. an instructor asking you to short shift usually means they are trying to get you to learn to be smoother with the inputs instead of relying on the power to mask mistakes. i do this many times with students in high hp cars. anyways, don't be discouraged too much. the car is great and as long as you have a good attitude there is plenty more learning and fun to be had.

[aus]

Typical M3 owner bitch. I'm a good driver... but I only go to the track once a year.
The car must suck because I'm a good driver, but everyone is passing me. It must be the car because I'm a track whore since I go once a year. I can learn a track easily, so it must be the car that's holding me back.

Maybe you didn't give your instructor enough confidence in yout driving ability to push the car??? Nawww, it must be the car's fault.

.

[bimmerjph]

I wouldn't be so down on your self. Its a relatively new car, your first time tracking it, new track, and at an event like that there were probably a lot more experienced drivers. So continue to enjoy your M3!

[Transfer]

The Ridge is a much different driving experience than PR and is more difficult to drive fast. It will take a lot more work to become comfortable at the Ridge. It sounds like your instructor may not have been very helpful though either.

[Talk2meg00se]

I'm not exactly a track pro - I've only been once - but I believe that the one time that I did go went relatively well. The instructor, who was a fairly accomplished racer, was very complimentary at the end. Maybe more importantly, half his advice during the course of the day was to go "faster" - he very much wanted me to push the car. A vote of confidence?

Take this advice for what it is, but I watched a ton of videos like the one posted below before going (a pro driving a near bone stock M3 around Spa like a bat out of hell). Watch where he keeps the RPMs / where he changes gears / when he starts breaking / the lines he's taking, etc. I'm not saying to get out there and try to emulate this - the result would probably be ugly - but try to pick up on some of the fundamentals. Watch enough of these things (E92 M3 only, of course), and some of the motions will start to imprint. I found this to be very helpful.

[1MOREMOD]

i think its just a case of new track and new car. that combined with an instructor can be a humbling experience. each time i have an instructor i feel a little out of sorts for the day as im trying to do what they want rather than experiment on sections in the fashion i am accustomed to. it will make you a better driver, and what they said is true you need more laps. i try to go once a month and think that isnt sufficient.

[HALOTHANE]

If your brakes "suck," consider changing your brake fluid to high-performance / high-temp brand of your choice. That should reduce any tangible fade you experienced.

[chili cheese]

Go back out to a familiar track and learn the car. You will be fast and you will love it. You gotta go more than once a year though man. The "C" group is basically a beginner group where I'm from, so give it some time.

[Titanium Silver]

Maybe check out the M Driving School out East? You might not be going hard enough.

You just didn't want it hard enough

[m3buckeye]

In between actual track days, try signing up for some SCCA autocross events - i.e. cone course in a huge parking lot. It is amazing how much that will help you for actual track days at a very cheap price. You could also try some "pro" help and do a www.bondurant.com or www.springmountainmotorsports.com if you can swing it.

YMMV.

[Giggs]

push it harder. if that doesnt work supercharge it, it becomes a whole new level of beast.

[w00tw00t]

I think the OP gave up on replying to this thread ...

[soberin]

Originally Posted by Z K

I have similar reservations about the M3 on track. I had an Evo before and it was very fast and fun on track. The M3 is definitely a lot softer and more comfort oriented as a car. It has a detached feel to it and the extra weight doesn't help things. I could not get the same lap time of the Evo in the M3 while stock.

That said, most of what you are feeling can be changed. Coilover suspension, stiffer bushings, tires and a bucket seat will very much change the feel of the car. But in stock form, the M3 is definitely not a race car for the street as BMW and the journalists advertise.

Agreed. I had an EVO VIII MR modded to the limit which would destroy my current E90 M3, which also has every Dinan mod except the stroker engine. As was noted in another post above, the numb steering is a drag--I have posted this complaint often. It's a great GT, and a good but not great track car. That's why I rent a Spec Miata full racecar with a cage for my track days. Way more fun than the M3.

[paradocs98]

Originally Posted by BimmFiniti

I recently had a disappointing track experience in my M3 and it's really bothering me. I'm starting to wonder why I have this car and have lost some of the initial passion I had about the car.

Have any of you had similar experiences and recovered? Any words of wisdom or advice? Am I just not a good enough driver to drive the M3? Should I switch to a car I can get more out of in normal driving?

I agree with most of the responses. One track day a year is way too infrequent to draw any meaningful conclusions about the M3. I still feel that there is no other car on the market that can combine ride, handling, comfort, relative luxury, quality, practicality, and track prowess like the M3 can--especially the sedan.

A well-driven Z06 or GT3 is much faster on the track, but you can't haul your kids around in them on the weekends, you can't go to Home Depot, etc. A highly modded Evo or STi may be faster on the track, but the noise, harshness, rattles and overall cheapness would drive you nuts when used as a daily driver.

It sounds like you're playing one round of golf a year, and when that round doesn't go well, you start to doubt your clubs. You've just got to do it much more often. I've taken this car to the track 20+ times now, and most of the time it thrills and amazes. In most intermediate run groups it keeps up easily with Porsches, Corvettes, Evos, etc., and even poorly-driven GTRs (plenty of those around). But not every time out is great. My last track event this season, at NJMP Thunderbolt a couple of weeks ago with the local PCA, was disappointing. I never really felt like I got into a groove or rhythm, despite the fact that I've run on that circuit several times before. Part of it had to do with the rainy conditions for the first couple of sessions, followed by a dry session where everyone was so antsy to go go go that it became a mess--slower cars being oblivious or obstructionist, refusing to give point-bys, mixed with impatient hot-heads who would just blast around several cars at a time with no point-by. So the point is that some days on track just won't gel properly, no matter what car you're in or how much experience you have. That's why you have to do it a lot in this particular car, so you can realize that the good days far outnumber the disappointing ones.

On the other hand, if it's only realistic for you to hit the track once a year, the M3 might not be for you. Its performance is probably lost on those who only use it on the street, and can't explore the upper ranges of the revband practically or safely. In that case, something like a 335i might be a better bet, since that car's power comes on early at lower rpms, and it may be more practical for the fun point-and-squirt driving of daily traffic. For that matter, the replacement M3 with its return to turbo power may suit your daily needs better as well.

[OSAB1]

It's not the car. Stop it. One track day a year is not going to cut it. Forget the M3 for now. Go to some driving schools next year and develop your skills. Then come back to the M3 with new eyes. Don't listen to anyone who boasts they are "fast" or I run this time at a track. They are not you and you will get yourself into trouble listening to egos. Takes lots of seat time and hard work. The car is beyond most "drivers" capabilities. Enjoy this time of exploring, growing, and learning. Don't get discouraged.

[soberin]

I would also remember the old saying that for many of us " a bad day at the track is better than a good day at work."

[Sully1Time]

Originally Posted by BimmFiniti

I recently had a disappointing track experience in my M3 and it's really bothering me. I'm starting to wonder why I have this car and have lost some of the initial passion I had about the car.

Have any of you had similar experiences and recovered? Any words of wisdom or advice? Am I just not a good enough driver to drive the M3? Should I switch to a car I can get more out of in normal driving?

Still think the M3 is cool, but I'm not feeling like a member of the "club" right now...

Background

• I have only owned my M3 for 8 months now. My previous high performance cars were a 2007 Cayman S and a 2002 911. I also own a 2001 330i
• I have tracked all those cars over the years - all at Pacific Raceways in Kent, WA - and have progressed up to a pretty solid, fast driver. At my last session at Pacific Raceways, for example, I drove my Cayman S and was fast, smooth and solid in my "C" group, only being passed by a few instructors
• I recently went to a BMW High Performance Driving event at the Ridge Motorsport Park in Shelton, WA in my M3, again sitting in the "C" group since I typically only get out to the track once per year.
• My session at the Ridge was just incredibly disappointing. That track is definitely tricky, and way different from Pacific Raceways, but I just thought I'd do better, and feel better about it, with my "monster" M3 on the track. I was constantly getting passed; I never seemed to use any of the higher RPM range of the M3, seemingly always being in a high gear (at my instructor's request). I never felt like I was pushing the car; I always felt that before in my other vehicles. I ... um ... sucked.
• Since my session, I have definitely noticed that I'm not as "in to" my M3 as I was before. Commuting and normal street driving doesn't give you the opportunity to get the most out of the car, but neither did my track experience. What the heck? What am I doing with this car?

Sell it and buy a prius

[aus]

Originally Posted by Team Plutonium

Dude, who pissed in your cereal?

Yeah, it's a little harsh but I've been on this board since the beginning (I also had a 2008 car), and I keep seeing people think they're the sizzle driver and blame the car for their lack of skill.

Meanwhile we've had Leh Keen and Junior Strauss here who loved the car (except maybe the brakes). There's also another pro driver here now who's on at times. They don't have any issues with the car.

.

[klammer]

Agreed. It's a pretty sick all around car and can more than hold its own in a track setting.

[Car54]

I had typed up a long response on my iphone and lost it when I clicked submit. Ugh.

Cribs:

I often slow a student down when they have brought bad habits to our weekend. I break habits first, then work on line, then speed. This often frustrates people who've been allowed to get away or get by. By lunch time...I can usually prove what we're doing is working and the habits melt away. Then the learning usually happens so fast that we need to be careful not out drive talent.

In other words...sometimes your driving feels fast because you're limiting yourself in ways you cannot understand without an instructor. Once those things are pointed out and corrected....suddenly it doesn't "feel" fast.

Did we lose the OP?

[av2]

If you are unfamiliar with the track and the correct lines, I totally understand why the instructor asked you to slow down and use higher gears. Some tracks take more time to learn than others. To me, the M3 is a very fast car when driven with smooth inputs.