Lightweight BMW M Engineering Concept Coming to 2011 Tokyo Show (not a 1M)

Jake C · 03-22-2011, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyrat

you guys are not getting it, BMW is going to show off for example a 1M that definitely weights in below 3000 because it will have a CF chassy etc. The single car will cost BMW a fortune because it is a single concept car. They will showcase the improved performance and weight of a car like this that will not see production as a CSL. Then it will be implemented in the i8, i3 and maybe next gen M cars.

+1

- J

ManGGouste · 03-22-2011, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyphab

If you want that kind of car, you gotta buy a Lotus.

You're right. But Lotus is still for fortunate people. My E82 is my daily driver (no other car).
I'd love a Lotus with a bavarian 6L and a decent trunk. Who wouldn't?

skyphab · 03-22-2011, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManGGouste

You're right. But Lotus is still for fortunate people. My E82 is my daily driver (no other car).
I'd love a Lotus with a bavarian 6L and a decent trunk. Who wouldn't?

Buy an Lotus Evora!

Kidding. Yeah, I know what you mean. Problem is, there is only a very narrow market for cars like you think of. Even Lotus does a re-focus on the more comfortable sportscar market to attract new clients.

A real sportscar with a boot (like an Evora but bigger) will have a too small target group. The big brands like BMW, Audi, VW, etc. will always have the focus on a broad spectrum of clients and that means compromises in terms of sportiness.

pyrat · 03-22-2011, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

It's a future lab... It proves that all the resources and investment put into BMWi at the expense of "image" only projects that competitors have invested in will be worth it in the future. Everyone Benefits...

Let the comments that BMW are on the wrong path for their future... end.
This will show why BMW were right to focus on this path.
As I said everyone including BMW M benefits.

like the sound of this.

///M1 · 03-22-2011, 04:12 PM

I'll start believing in BMW's efforts on weight reduction and use of 'lightweight materials of the future' that translate into meaningful reduction in overall mass once I start seeing that reflected on actual road cars, not the pony show one-off concept exhibits.

The latest to be released M-offering - the new F10 M5 - is tipping the scales at over 4400lbs. Yeah, sure you can crank the HP to still claim a so-so HP-to-weight ratio, but really, who is this fooling? Staments on where BMW is going, vs. what it is actually rolling out, is in complete discord.

Wolf · 03-22-2011, 05:52 PM

So in other words... The pick-up M3 is what you are talking about Scott?... but the pick-up M3 will not showcase in Tokyo in a form of a pick-up but it will be probably in a normal looking M3 with the lightweight materials of the pickup?

SamS · 03-22-2011, 05:55 PM

Maybe they chopped up an M3 into a truck to see how an M3 would perform with ~500lbs less weight on it.

SCOTT26 · 03-22-2011, 06:02 PM

In terms of materials use and majority , the Concept is far more advanced than the BMW M3 CSL (E46).

WAY · 03-22-2011, 06:06 PM

Isn't Toyko show in December? So we will have this thread open for the next 9 months with us speculating what it is and Scott throwing more hints at it bit by bit?

Matski · 03-22-2011, 06:09 PM

M3 basis, possibly related to an M3 'vert with no roof and a flatbed area seen testing.

Not a 1M

Visually it could be as radical as the 135tii (ie. nothing to blow your socks off)

The definition of a Light-weight Sports Coupe.

A show case for light-weight materials...

Based around an existing but outgoing M product.

Not for production.

hmmmmmm... I need Columbo on speed dial to piece this one together.

but...

I'd guess it is a very sporting version of the M3, since it's the only M nearing the end of it's production.

The M3 Camino, IF it's related to this, is missing a lot of rigidity and weight from the roof, yet the steel checkplate that replace's it would be very heavy, un-necessarily neat for a mule, add to that the increase weight in reinforcing the chassis of the M3 to fight against twist and scuttle-shake - I don't see how this would be a light-weight concept mule - it doesn't offer anything a 'vert mule with its folding roof removed could. So this I think is a red herring... SCOTT only mentions it, I believe, because that, and this new concept are both made possible because BMW allows for like-minded employees to create new stuff on company time, to further explore creativity, knowledge and understanding.

If it truly is the definition of a CSL, then it must be a light-weight coupe... so it will have two doors and a roof. But weigh significantly less than it's series counterpart.. so if it's an M3.. it must be lighter again than the GTS at least.

Since it's not destined for production it's cost does not need to be factored in.

It's technology is on par with something BMW-i is doing.... this must relate to Carbon fibre Tech since BMW is relying so heavily on CF for i3 and i8, and it's something that could benefit M.

SCOTT mentions the E46 CSL, but hints it will be more extreme.

At the end of the M5's life BMW allowed it employees (that also built M3 Caminos..) to build an M5 CSL.

I really am leaning towards an CF chassis M3. I can't see the logic in much else... an ultimate CSL version of the M3.... that will hint at the next gen M3 having much more weight saving tech to go with its smaller FI engine.

edit: it would be great if BMW revisited light-weight tech found on the GINA... as in the bonnet, boot and doors, (hood, trunk and doors).. were lightweight CF skeletons with fabric panels for further weight saving tech... with an 'active' element in the boot-lid, for a seamless pop-up spoiler......OKAY this is wild guess... but SCOTT, can you PLEASE get somebody at BMW to investigate this.. it's a great idea and it's a shame to waste geometry in n applications as an idea.

Diver · 03-22-2011, 06:32 PM

Balsa wood.

Robert · 03-22-2011, 06:53 PM

What if I want a car now... what now? This future may or may not come and at least 12-18 mo. out

Jblack4083 · 03-22-2011, 06:55 PM

How about... It's simply an M3 CSL concept...

Why is everyone looking so far into this?

OC3 · 03-22-2011, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmikeh

does that mean we really ARE getting an M3 El Camino?

Quote:

Originally Posted by skiernan36

lightweight BMW? i'll believe it when i see it

Indeed

Franken///M · 03-22-2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jblack4083

How about... It's simply an M3 CSL concept...

Why is everyone looking so far into this?

+1

Franken///M · 03-22-2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WAY

Isn't Toyko show in December? So we will have this thread open for the next 9 months with us speculating what it is and Scott throwing more hints at it bit by bit?

Just like the 1M for the last year plus.

TxFeatFan · 03-22-2011, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radiantm3

Quote:

Originally Posted by WAY

Especially given how well 1M has sold.

Are you from the future?

1

OC3 · 03-22-2011, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jblack4083

How about... It's simply an M3 CSL concept...

Going off on a tangent a bit, esquire's Dakar with Vorsteiner Bootlid to me might be what a M3 CSL concept would look like.

antzcrashing · 03-22-2011, 07:23 PM

if it is a CF-full M3 that would be sick.

JB135MDCT · 03-22-2011, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyrat

you guys are not getting it, BMW is going to show off for example a 1M that definitely weights in below 3000 because it will have a CF chassy etc. The single car will cost BMW a fortune because it is a single concept car. They will showcase the improved performance and weight of a car like this that will not see production as a CSL. Then it will be implemented in the i8, i3 and maybe next gen M cars.

"just" below 3000 doesn't cut it.

antzcrashing · 03-22-2011, 08:58 PM

Scott can you confirm this is related to the M3?

Erhan · 03-22-2011, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

if it is a CF-full M3 that would be sick.

There are several companies does that. It was featured in one of the Roundel issues.. I forgot but I think they cost something around a Murcielago..

There is no getting around unfortunately.

03-22-2011, 04:12 PM	#27
///M1 Brigadier General 275 Rep 3,164 Posts Drives: Many Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: North of 7K RPM iTrader: (1) Garage List 2020 BMW M2 CS [0.00] 1994 Audi RS2 Avant [0.00] 2021 Audi RS6 Avant [0.00] 1988 BMW E30 M3 [0.00] 2011 BMW 1///M [0.00] 2017 BMW F80 M3 30 ... [0.00] 2018 Porsche 991.2 GT3 [0.00] 2015 Porsche Macan ... [0.00] 1998 Porsche 993 C4S [0.00] 1994 Lancia Delta I ... [0.00] 2008 Audi RS4 [0.00]	I'll start believing in BMW's efforts on weight reduction and use of 'lightweight materials of the future' that translate into meaningful reduction in overall mass once I start seeing that reflected on actual road cars, not the pony show one-off concept exhibits. The latest to be released M-offering - the new F10 M5 - is tipping the scales at over 4400lbs. Yeah, sure you can crank the HP to still claim a so-so HP-to-weight ratio, but really, who is this fooling? Staments on where BMW is going, vs. what it is actually rolling out, is in complete discord. __________________ *2011 BMW E82 1///M: AW, all options; Renntech, Akrapovic, Forge, P3, RevoZ CF bits, many mods 1988 BMW E30 M3: Hennarot, S14, stock 2018 Porsche 991.2 GT3: PtS, CXX, LWBS, PCCB 1998 Porsche 993 C4S: Zenith Blue, last aircooled widebody, Bilstein PSS10, Fister II + Fabspeed exhaust 2008 Audi B7 RS 4*: Sprint Blue, Audi Exclusive Euro Bucket Interior, Premium+Titanium, many mods
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03-22-2011, 05:55 PM	#29
SamS Banned 867 Rep 6,248 Posts Drives: Tesla M3 Perf + '18 X3 M40i Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Dallas, TX iTrader: (0)	Maybe they chopped up an M3 into a truck to see how an M3 would perform with ~500lbs less weight on it.
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03-22-2011, 06:02 PM	#30
SCOTT26 Major General 5311 Rep 5,824 Posts Drives: A big F-off German Truck. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: WORLDWIDE iTrader: (0)	In terms of materials use and majority , the Concept is far more advanced than the BMW M3 CSL (E46). __________________ The M850i is evidence that BMW have got their mojo back when it comes to dynamic sports cars...
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03-22-2011, 06:06 PM	#31
WAY Brigadier General 458 Rep 4,822 Posts Drives: Fast ones Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Melbourne, Australia iTrader: (0)	Isn't Toyko show in December? So we will have this thread open for the next 9 months with us speculating what it is and Scott throwing more hints at it bit by bit?
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03-22-2011, 06:09 PM	#32
Matski Captain 151 Rep 842 Posts Drives: A slow BMW Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: England iTrader: (0)	M3 basis, possibly related to an M3 'vert with no roof and a flatbed area seen testing. Not a 1M Visually it could be as radical as the 135tii (ie. nothing to blow your socks off) The definition of a Light-weight Sports Coupe. A show case for light-weight materials... Based around an existing but outgoing M product. Not for production. hmmmmmm... I need Columbo on speed dial to piece this one together. but... I'd guess it is a very sporting version of the M3, since it's the only M nearing the end of it's production. The M3 Camino, IF it's related to this, is missing a lot of rigidity and weight from the roof, yet the steel checkplate that replace's it would be very heavy, un-necessarily neat for a mule, add to that the increase weight in reinforcing the chassis of the M3 to fight against twist and scuttle-shake - I don't see how this would be a light-weight concept mule - it doesn't offer anything a 'vert mule with its folding roof removed could. So this I think is a red herring... SCOTT only mentions it, I believe, because that, and this new concept are both made possible because BMW allows for like-minded employees to create new stuff on company time, to further explore creativity, knowledge and understanding. If it truly is the definition of a CSL, then it must be a light-weight coupe... so it will have two doors and a roof. But weigh significantly less than it's series counterpart.. so if it's an M3.. it must be lighter again than the GTS at least. Since it's not destined for production it's cost does not need to be factored in. It's technology is on par with something BMW-i is doing.... this must relate to Carbon fibre Tech since BMW is relying so heavily on CF for i3 and i8, and it's something that could benefit M. SCOTT mentions the E46 CSL, but hints it will be more extreme. At the end of the M5's life BMW allowed it employees (that also built M3 Caminos..) to build an M5 CSL. I really am leaning towards an CF chassis M3. I can't see the logic in much else... an ultimate CSL version of the M3.... that will hint at the next gen M3 having much more weight saving tech to go with its smaller FI engine. edit: it would be great if BMW revisited light-weight tech found on the GINA... as in the bonnet, boot and doors, (hood, trunk and doors).. were lightweight CF skeletons with fabric panels for further weight saving tech... with an 'active' element in the boot-lid, for a seamless pop-up spoiler......OKAY this is wild guess... but SCOTT, can you PLEASE get somebody at BMW to investigate this.. it's a great idea and it's a shame to waste geometry in n applications as an idea. Last edited by Matski; 03-22-2011 at 06:28 PM..
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03-22-2011, 06:32 PM	#33
Diver Brigadier General 504 Rep 3,446 Posts Drives: Black '12 135i - Sold Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Texas iTrader: (0)	Balsa wood. __________________ See my photography at http://ronscubadiver.wordpress.com
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03-22-2011, 06:53 PM	#34
Robert Major General 414 Rep 6,968 Posts Drives: 135i -> is350 -> Tesla M3 perf Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Socal iTrader: (1)	What if I want a car now... what now? This future may or may not come and at least 12-18 mo. out __________________ - There's nothing in my pocket other than knives and lint
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03-22-2011, 06:55 PM	#35
Jblack4083 Captain 116 Rep 888 Posts Drives: E46 ///M3 JB/CB Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Queens, NYC iTrader: (0)	How about... It's simply an M3 CSL concept... Why is everyone looking so far into this?
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03-22-2011, 07:23 PM	#41
antzcrashing Brigadier General 1910 Rep 3,217 Posts Drives: 2018 BMW 440i GC Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Eastern MA iTrader: (1) Garage List 2018 BMW 440i GC xD ... [9.75]	if it is a CF-full M3 that would be sick.
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03-22-2011, 08:58 PM	#43
antzcrashing Brigadier General 1910 Rep 3,217 Posts Drives: 2018 BMW 440i GC Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Eastern MA iTrader: (1) Garage List 2018 BMW 440i GC xD ... [9.75]	Scott can you confirm this is related to the M3?
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