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      07-25-2014, 10:33 AM   #1
dbyrd
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Replace Rack and Pinion Steering - really?!

After returning from the track last week, I had a vibration in the steering and felt it in the front wheels. I suspected that I had flat-spotted or cupped my street tires as I was running with maximum negative camber with unknown toe (corded my NT-01s on Saturday). I replaced both front tires, but the vibration/whop-whop was still there. I made sure it wasn't the rear wheels/tires even though it felt like the vibration was coming from the front.

The sound and vibration seemed to come from the right wheel and was pronounced when weighting the right side by turning left so suspected the wheel bearing was going bad.

I took it into my local mechanic who reported the rack and pinion gears on the steering column had play and needed to be replaced - quoted parts alone at $1,800 with unknown labor. He said that the wheel bearings were fine. I asked why it felt like the vibration is coming from the wheel and why the steering feels solid and like it has no play, and he said vibrations coming through the wheel were due to the play in the pinion gear. BTW, I have 96,000 miles on the car with a new engine since 82,000.

I'm taking into the dealership on Monday, but I wanted to get your advice or suggestions as this isn't making sense.

Your feedback is appreciated.

Last edited by dbyrd; 07-25-2014 at 11:00 AM..
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      07-25-2014, 03:57 PM   #2
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Do E9X M3s have the steering guibo like other BMWs? Maybe that just needs to be replaced?
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      07-25-2014, 05:40 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xeux View Post
Do E9X M3s have the steering guibo like other BMWs? Maybe that just needs to be replaced?
I don't know much about the mechanics of the steering mechanism and I've never heard of a guibo (maybe you meant guide), but I'll look into it. Thanks.
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      07-25-2014, 05:50 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
I don't know much about the mechanics of the steering mechanism and I've never heard of a guibo (maybe you meant guide), but I'll look into it. Thanks.
He meant guibo, but the guibo is in the driveline, there isn't one used in the steering assembly. Just u-joint type.

The column has some joints that do wear, in the lower assembly.
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      07-25-2014, 06:06 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekurgan View Post
He meant guibo, but the guibo is in the driveline, there isn't one used in the steering assembly. Just u-joint type.

The column has some joints that do wear, in the lower assembly.
Great info - thanks!

Do you have to replace the entire assembly?
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      07-25-2014, 06:16 PM   #6
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Something like this...

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?p=13077875

I am still curious if the E9x platform has it or not.
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      07-25-2014, 06:21 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
Great info - thanks!

Do you have to replace the entire assembly?
I believe so, and it's time consuming from what I understand. Your problem doesn't seem to be related to this issue. When your engine is off, and you wiggle your steering wheel, is there a lot of play/noise?

Generally when folks have this replaced it's because of the play in these joints, but your issue stems from the wheel bearing or hub area, might even be an FCAB or thrust bushing that's out.
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      07-26-2014, 08:38 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekurgan View Post
I believe so, and it's time consuming from what I understand. Your problem doesn't seem to be related to this issue. When your engine is off, and you wiggle your steering wheel, is there a lot of play/noise?

Generally when folks have this replaced it's because of the play in these joints, but your issue stems from the wheel bearing or hub area, might even be an FCAB or thrust bushing that's out.
No play, wiggle or noise from the steering wheel when the car is off or on - that's what doesn't make sense. I still think it may be the wheel bearing. Any more info on FCAB or thrust bushing?
Thanks.
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      07-26-2014, 08:42 AM   #9
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Definitely get the opinion from the dealer on this one. Sounds odd that the problem is as stated from this mechanic guy given the lack of play/noise when sitting.

Post up the results from the dealer. GL!
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      07-26-2014, 09:01 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
No play, wiggle or noise from the steering wheel when the car is off or on - that's what doesn't make sense. I still think it may be the wheel bearing. Any more info on FCAB or thrust bushing?
Thanks.
I believe #s 14 and 19 in this diagram. These would be pretty rare as far as being problematic, at least folks on this board haven't made much mention of them. Wheel bearing sounds more reasonable, cheaper. If it's a wheel bearing, I would expect some play if you try to move the wheel around while fitted on the car.
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      07-26-2014, 12:12 PM   #11
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Have you noticed any irregular wear on the tires.?
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      07-26-2014, 01:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman831
Have you noticed any irregular wear on the tires.?
No irregular wear prior to the track weekend, but as I mentioned, I ran extra camber with unknown toe with track tires on Saturday (corded outside rear), then ran PSS's on Sunday. I first noticed this on the drive back home. Suspecting a tire problem, I replaced both tires and also tested my track tires, but the vibration persisted.
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      07-26-2014, 01:36 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
No irregular wear prior to the track weekend, but as I mentioned, I ran extra camber with unknown toe with track tires on Saturday (corded outside rear), then ran PSS's on Sunday. I first noticed this on the drive back home. Suspecting a tire problem, I replaced both tires and also tested my track tires, but the vibration persisted.
Check the alignment?
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      07-26-2014, 01:48 PM   #14
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i doubt you have a bad wheel bearing. It would have to be really shot to result in a vibration. I had a bad left front wheel bearing (fair amount of track use) and the symptom I had was a rumbling noise coming from the front end most noticeable at freeway speeds going around long sweeping right hand corners.
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      07-27-2014, 10:43 AM   #15
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Thanks for all great feedback - this forum is awesome.

I'll post the results of the dealership diagnosis tomorrow.
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      07-27-2014, 11:17 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
Thanks for all great feedback - this forum is awesome.

I'll post the results of the dealership diagnosis tomorrow.
So true - you asked a question about steering problems and people are posting part diagrams and shit (hell yeah thekurgan). It's that kind of stuff that makes this place great!
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      07-28-2014, 01:58 PM   #17
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The dealership says it's the wheel bearings and that both sides have noise. Apparently, they used a listening device. They want $1680 for both sides. This is much less costly than replacing the entire steering assembly, but seems like both sides wouldn't let go at the same time.

I have two other estimates from local shops at $1200 and $933. They both say the replacement is relatively simple so I'll probably go with the less expensive mechanic unless I hear otherwise from the forum.

I'll keep this post updated - thanks for all the helpful feedback!
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      07-29-2014, 01:44 PM   #18
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Dealership came way down in price so I'm going with them. I'm still concerned that I have some wear to the steering assembly. I'll post an update when I get the car back.
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      07-29-2014, 01:47 PM   #19
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I had no idea wheel bearings were so expensive.
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      07-29-2014, 04:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thekurgan View Post
I had no idea wheel bearings were so expensive.
All shops quoted the price of each side at $366.85 with 1.8 to 2 hours of labor per side.
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      07-29-2014, 05:12 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
All shops quoted the price of each side at $366.85 with 1.8 to 2 hours of labor per side.
Yeah, I just looked up the parts on realoem, I was thinking the bearing itself was separate. That price makes sense now. I hope this resolves the issue.
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      07-30-2014, 11:41 PM   #22
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Got her back this afternoon and the problem is resolved - needed wheel bearings.

Thanks for all the advise - loved the diagrams and specs sheets.
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