E92 M3 vs 2017 STI

[R3dliner]

Originally Posted by BLiteM

My friend has a 2015 STI, I have a 2009 M3. His car has a Cobb access port tune and an intake I’m not sure where that puts him power wise. I have a drop in k&n filter and that’s it.
With that said I’ve driven both cars back to back and the M3 feels much faster all around. The STI does take off fast but it falls flat after that.

Additionally I couldn’t help but feel I was in a fast and furious movie with the STI and he hasn’t changed anything inside from how it comes from Subaru. It’s subjective but the STI feels very boy racer compared to the M3 both inside and out.
The bright point I will note about his STI is that is does seem to handle on par with the M3. While probably not a fair comparison as my car needs a bushing and suspension refresh and his STI has had nearly every bushing or suspension component upgraded. I mean everything.
The STI also seems more fragile, he refuses to rev it out, said the stock injectors are “at the top of their duty cycle” with just a tune and some of the suspension upgrades mentioned above were done because certainly stock pieces will catestrophically fail if they aren’t upgraded/braced. Not sure on how true these are.
The other bright point is all of the upgrades he did cost a fraction of most modifications/upgrades for the M3.

If I read this correctly your buddy has a protune but no exhaust or dp was mentioned. If it's a just a access port and a intake he has a stg1 tune which is dog slow. Full exhaust with a dp and protune will beat our car stock from a dig or roll 0-80. We will walk them top end. Those sti stg2's have 350+ ft lbs of torque to the wheels.

They handle well due to the 3 diff's they have compared to our single diff.

[LKN624]

Originally Posted by KPop

I just sold my tuned 2004 STi (it was pristine, had 16k miles and was a "collector car") and got an E90 M3 6MT, so I can provide some perspective.

First, I'd only make the switch if you really want to experience a different kind of car, not because you're afraid of rod bearings going out. If you really like your M3, spend the $2500-$3k and do the preventative RBs. BMW will never make another M3 like this again and your car is highly desirable in that configuration in addition to the relatively low miles.

That said...I can appreciate the interest in the STi. It's a great, raw / analog car that's practical, quick (not fast) and offers all-weather AWD practicality. You'll love the shifter and clutch feel as it's mechanical and very direct. You won't like the steering as much unless you go with a 2015 or newer model. My 2004 steering was way too light and they used a very low-effort ratio. At times I felt like I was driving a semi truck with the amount of turns-to-lock my blobeye STi had. It was one of the worst features of the car. That aside, I miss how wonderfully simple the car was. No navigation. No traction control. No electronic nannies. Just you, the machine, and the road. Very early 2000's and it felt like a civilized race car.

The M3 is the epitomie of luxury by comparison and is almost too muted and too luxurious to a fault. I wish I had a "stripper" model with the cloth seats and no nav for that reason. I find all that luxury crap to be a distraction from what I really care about, which is driving.

Stock-for-stock, the M3 is much faster than a non-tuned STi. My car was "stage 2" which means intake, downpipe, exhaust, tune, but I also had a lightened crank pully, lightweight single-mass flywheel, and about $8k worth of suspension upgrades. It made just a tick over 300 WHP and around 330 lb/ft torque at the wheels, so probably around 360-375 crank HP (drivetrain loss is high on these cars). Stock they make around 240 WHP. Point is, you'd almost certainly want to tune it.

Tuning STis can be expensive. Beyond 325 WHP (375 crank) you'll need to upgrade your injectors/fuel pump and fuel rails as the stock fuel system maxes out at that power level and you risk running a lean condition with aggressive tuning. Lean mixture = bad news for your piston ringlands. Full bolt-ons including intake, turbo inlet, exhaust, ECBS, clutch, upgraded turbo, AOS, front-mount intercooler, etc. will be upwards of $9-10k with labor depending on what you get. With those parts installed and a tune in place, a motor build is highly recommended if you want your car to last. That will cost at least $10-12k on top of what you already spent in supporting mods based on the two build estimates I got for my STi. You could quickly be close to $50k in the hole when you factor in the cost to buy the STi.

With that perspective, $2500-$3k in RB preventative maintenance sounds cheap, no?

The decision is yours, but I'd think carefully about what kind of car you want, how you're going to drive it, and if you are willing to take on the cost and risks that tuning brings. STi's are a lot of fun and I enjoy tuning, but there's also this car called the EVO that I'd consider before going down that rabbit hole...

By the way, here's what my STi looked like:

Clean STI! I had an 05 Aspen White STI last year and was my daily driver until I found another 05 STI that I bought with 149 miles on it (000149 mi) that I am keeping in a bubble at the moment and driving my R53 as a daily. The STI still has the plastic seat covers and stickers from the factory on it.

[Dan Bilzerian]

If you can swing it. The turbo S is AWD and boosted....

Just saying

[KPop]

Originally Posted by LKNM3777

Clean STI! I had an 05 Aspen White STI last year and was my daily driver until I found another 05 STI that I bought with 149 miles on it (000149 mi) that I am keeping in a bubble at the moment and driving my R53 as a daily. The STI still has the plastic seat covers and stickers from the factory on it.

Wow, 149 miles?! I'd be afraid to drive it as it's absolutely a collector car at that point and probably worth more than it was new. Only issues might be the fluids, seals, etc. from sitting so long without driving, but that's straightforward to fix if you did want to start driving it.

[NoynuR]

Please do not buy the STI i had a 08 e92 and went to a 16 STI and drove it for a year and absolutely hated it. At 11,000 miles i had the engine blow and i had to pay 3k to fix it and get it running. You will miss the E92 everyday, the interior quality is shit, the powerband is shit until the turbos kick in at 3500rpm and the community of people (no offense to anyone) is Immature and very self centered and rude.

I will never buy a subaru again or even consider owning a sti ever again. Underpowered, underpreforming 40k car

So happy i sold it and only lost 200$ on it and came back to the M3 Family

[Datsun280z]

Originally Posted by NoynuR

the community of people (no offense to anyone) is Immature and very self centered and rude.

Around Seattle, the Subro community is full of vaping kids wearing flat brim hats. That, among other reasons, deters me from buying another WRX ever again.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by R3dliner

The throws on the sti are very short. You will be rowing the gears more.
Stock STI esp the new bodies 15+(more weight) are slow. Unless you're willing to go stage 2, and risk losing warranty, I would think hard about it.

Mind you the EJ257 is prone to rod bearing and ring land problems more so than our E9x M3's.

Stg2 STi's are a blast to drive and the almost 400 wheel torque you get, you will never need to ring out the revs. 0-80 will beat the m all day but will have no top end.

Yeah right ! Our S65 bearings are great

[LKN624]

Originally Posted by KPop

Wow, 149 miles?! I'd be afraid to drive it as it's absolutely a collector car at that point and probably worth more than it was new. Only issues might be the fluids, seals, etc. from sitting so long without driving, but that's straightforward to fix if you did want to start driving it.

Haha yep! Well it has 158 miles on it right now since I drive it around the parking lot to keep everything moving once a month. Oh definitely...when I bought it, it went straight to the Subaru Dealership and had ALL fluids replaced twice over and all rubber hoses, belts and seals replaced by Subaru's top technician. Treated the car like it was a show car which I was thoroughly impressed with the "white glove" work. I also have the oil changed twice a year and the gas changed out once a year. The car is an absolute ready to drive car...but as you said its a collector's car now and sits happily in my garage while I wail on my other cars haha.

But back to the topic. Stick with the M3. Best STI is GD (05-06 years in my opinion) STI.

[NoynuR]

Originally Posted by Datsun280z

Around Seattle, the Subro community is full of vaping kids wearing flat brim hats. That, among other reasons, deters me from buying another WRX ever again.

Sadly it's the same here.. I don't even go to the local COBB meet cause its a bunch of immaturity

[KPop]

Originally Posted by LKNM3777

Haha yep! Well it has 158 miles on it right now since I drive it around the parking lot to keep everything moving once a month. Oh definitely...when I bought it, it went straight to the Subaru Dealership and had ALL fluids replaced twice over and all rubber hoses, belts and seals replaced by Subaru's top technician. Treated the car like it was a show car which I was thoroughly impressed with the "white glove" work. I also have the oil changed twice a year and the gas changed out once a year. The car is an absolute ready to drive car...but as you said its a collector's car now and sits happily in my garage while I wail on my other cars haha.

But back to the topic. Stick with the M3. Best STI is GD (05-06 years in my opinion) STI.

I had an '04 with 16k miles and still miss it. Probably a toss-up between that car and my E90 M3 in terms of which one I prefer. Depends on my mood

Pretty sure the 04's were considered GD as well.

[LKN624]

Originally Posted by KPop

I had an '04 with 16k miles and still miss it. Probably a toss-up between that car and my E90 M3 in terms of which one I prefer. Depends on my mood

Pretty sure the 04's were considered GD as well.

Yeah they are totally different cars, but amazing to drive. As far as sedans go, I think these two are the best combination...also look pretty menacing in my garage too.

Yeah the GD's were from 02-07, I was just saying I prefer the 05/06 years the most since they had the least issues and had the best looking front ends.

Happy Motoring!