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04-22-2007, 10:53 AM | #24 | |
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Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA 2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450 Last edited by GregW / Oregon; 04-22-2007 at 11:46 AM.. |
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04-22-2007, 11:23 AM | #25 |
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Forget Forced Induction
There will be few mods you can do for the new S65 and the biggest limitor is the 12:1 compression ratio.
At 12:1 compression ratio, forced induction is not going to happen for the new M3 no more than the current M5 / M6 (which has the same compression ratio). There is the Osh "800hp" twin turbo M5 for $350,000 but this is just someone with pipe dreams. M cars come tuned aggressively from the factory so the only areas for focus for tuning is where BMW had to make compromises for the street....
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04-22-2007, 12:18 PM | #26 |
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Well, cars like the M3 are in the boundary between the mass-market and the custom built pieces. So, I am saying that the factory M3 is much more refined than your average mid-range car when it comes to performance. In the end, everything is a trade-off--any kind of design process is comprised of a series of trade-offs. That is exactly what I am saying: if you are willing to trade off things like reliability and emissions for performance, you can. Heck, you can make the thing perform a space flight if you spend enough and disregard other civilized considerations. But then do you want a race car, or do you want something you can drive on the street? If you want a race car, there are much better options than the M3 out there. That said, I still assert that it is not possible to gain 60-80hp by simply replacing headers and programming ECUs on this thing. Maybe 20hp in total, which you most likely will not feel during daily driving conditions, but not 60-80hp.
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04-22-2007, 12:24 PM | #27 |
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Don't fool yourselves. Look at all the E46 M3 goodies available. Companies and vendors know that M3 owners will be more interested in performance modding their cars than the current majority of spend thrift 3-series owners who are concerned about voiding warranties.
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04-22-2007, 01:09 PM | #28 | |
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04-22-2007, 01:58 PM | #29 | |
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04-22-2007, 02:23 PM | #30 |
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roburado, the opinion/advice was solicited. read the first post in the thread before responding to others. if who want to mod will mod, then why are you posting? what is your point? stay on topic. i'm saying that there won't be much potential for hp gains in the M3 with typical bolt on stuff unless you do something really drastic and expensive and trade a bunch of other stuff for it.
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04-22-2007, 02:37 PM | #31 |
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ebuyuk. no, i have not "seen" the M5 headers, but i wouldn't judge their performance by the way they look. can you point to data from an independent source stating their alternative indeed increases hp drastically? (not from the manufacturer who makes them or the people who spent good money to acquire them)
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04-22-2007, 06:49 PM | #32 | |
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04-22-2007, 07:04 PM | #33 | |
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04-23-2007, 01:44 AM | #34 | |
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Here is some good info on supersprint headers http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/sho...835#post841835 |
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04-23-2007, 09:20 AM | #35 |
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headers
The M5 V10 header does not look bad or that inadequate at all
http://www.mbmw.com/M5%20V10%20Engine.htm |
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04-23-2007, 10:20 AM | #36 | |
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Cams, Headers and ECU tune only buys 3 mph and 0.4 seconds in the quartermile on an M6. BMW headers are great stock....particularly since they are hydroformed.
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04-23-2007, 01:55 PM | #38 |
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I know that you don't get too much. But 0.4 secsonds in the 1/4 mile is a good number IMO since the car already has a good time in the 1/4 mile to begin with. We both know from following the M5/M6 board is that the aftermarket headers do indeed provide about 35-40hp. That's all I was trying to say.
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04-23-2007, 03:07 PM | #39 | |
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i donno if he just calculated the crank hp but he ended up with Stock: 500 hp Header, Cats, ECU: 551.37 hp if it's just header + cat i'd say that's great..but with ECU upgrade that's just ok........I was expecting ECU would add like 40-50hp on euro car haha |
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04-23-2007, 04:19 PM | #40 | |
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The E92 M3 has 3.84 final drive ratio, and tall rear tires at 18/265/40. I think 2nd gear max at 72 mph. By changing to shorter final drive to 4.1 or 4.45, acceleration will even stronger. |
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04-23-2007, 10:32 PM | #41 |
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I think the highest powered naturally aspirated S54s are at around 380 crank horsepower, right? I'm not counting the PTG cars which will probably need a rebuild after 10K miles or less and I believe they are not using a stock shortblock anyway (higher compression). So that's around 15% or so. Figure the same for the S65, and you get about 60hp after all possible bolt ons. Don't expect much more torque though (maybe 20 ft-lb).
If you want more than that, you need to go FI (and thus spend big bucks). |
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