Delete

[Helmsman]

How can the exhaust has anything to do with the engine warranty part!? My (insurance) says should I mess with for instance exhaust they dont cover but where ever is OEM should be.
And should the "tune" be critical - which makes sense to me - surely they have to prove it exist..!?!

[vegnomeat]

If you alter anything on your car you are just giving them an excuse to deny warranty claims.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

Changing the bearings won't fix that random ticking.
3 other owners have had the same noise and it was nothing to do with rod bearings. Neither does it appear to be at all terminal or detrimental to long term reliability.

Short time memory problems ? (Sorry for that)
Scrippy's case is only from 9 day's ago ! ( May 21 )
He had also ticking noises , and you said like always =>" Normal random ticking noises for the S65" .
Most said...The pulled bearings were looking still good ...
But do you heard the videos , before and after the bearing change ? => http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...1129386&page=4
# 85 => Video before the bearing replacement
#109 => Video after the bearing replacement
Scrippy was right from day 1, and like I said he's ticking noises were NOT normal !
Same thing for OP .

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M__3__R__A__G__E

BMW North America voided my power train warranty because of my aftermarket exhaust and they are claiming I installed tuning software on the vehicle when I haven't...because of this they have refused to let the dealer do tests or repairs under warranty....i don't know what to do

Oh wow !
They are trying to screw you , like always BMW only wants to "WALK" !
After 12 years of BF failures they just negate the problem ?!?! That's really BS !
The problem is that they know about the $$$$$ of a rebuilt S65 and all the labor , they had examples enough from all over the world !
After market exhaust would be the reason of BF ...My A$$ too , what a joke !
Now the fix is found for all the bearing failures => It's all about our exhaust !
Really hope the best for you my friend , and think you need a very good lawyer in this case .
Note:
About the i3 .." your loaner car " you need to watch out , when they are not recognizing your problem with your car they also will charge you money for each day that you drove the i3 !

Edit:
For example , for the i3 .
$50 USD per day x 10 days => "$500 USD" !
Damn you BMW !!!

[Candide13]

Originally Posted by M__3__R__A__G__E

I'm devastated.... I literally feel like my car is worthless now

This is a bitter pill, and odd as well. The exhaust is a red herring; as others have said, this voids warranty for the exhaust but nothing else, and the burden of proof is on BMW to demonstrate that a non-OEM part caused another part to fail. This has been discussed and found to hold up in practice many times.

The tune is another thing. I find it hard to believe that BMW would claim there is a tune if there was none, even if OP did not install it. This is a grey area, but I have not heard of wholesale voiding of warranty before this.

Edit: sorry mate, could not resist looking for a tune on your car..

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...78&postcount=7

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Candide13

This is a bitter pill, and odd as well. The exhaust is a red herring; as others have said, this voids warranty for the exhaust but nothing else, and the burden of proof is on BMW to demonstrate that a non-OEM part caused another part to fail. This has been discussed and found to hold up in practice many times.

The tune is another thing. I find it hard to believe that BMW would claim there is a tune if there was none, even if OP did not install it. This is a grey area, but I have not heard of wholesale voiding of warranty before this.

Edit: sorry mate, could not resist looking for a tune on your car..

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...78&postcount=7

Clicked on your link...
Invisible information becomes clear , good from you but over here that's not possible

[thekurgan]

Originally Posted by M__3__R__A__G__E

It was BMW of Mountain View mate

BMW fucks all the N5x guys with tunes out of the warranty, you would be best to believe they will do it for an S65. Sorry to hear, man, just start saving some coin if it is rod bearing noise, although it doesn't sound like it from the vid.

[SenorFunkyPants]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Short time memory problems ? (Sorry for that)
Scrippy's case is only from 9 day's ago ! ( May 21 )
He had also ticking noises , and you said like always =>" Normal random ticking noises for the S65" .
Most said...The pulled bearings were looking still good ...
But do you heard the videos , before and after the bearing change ? => http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...1129386&page=4
# 85 => Video before the bearing replacement
#109 => Video after the bearing replacement
Scrippy was right from day 1, and like I said he's ticking noises were NOT normal !
Same thing for OP .

The ticking noise is not normal, and I said "Nothing in the photo indicates any problem with them [the rod bearings] or that they could be a cause of engine noise" and I stand by that statement. Scrippys bearings were fine and were not producing the random ticking noise. There was little wear, none through into the copper layer. If they were tapping at idle with no load on them they would have knocked like crazy by 3k rpm. He ran with that noise for around 3 weeks IIUC, no engine with rod bearing damage could survive that length of time. The fact that the noise disappeared after the bearings were needlessly changed was more likely due to changing the oil from whatever oil it came with from Carmax.
You were wrong then as you are now.

[maloo]

Originally Posted by Candide13

This is a bitter pill, and odd as well. The exhaust is a red herring; as others have said, this voids warranty for the exhaust but nothing else, and the burden of proof is on BMW to demonstrate that a non-OEM part caused another part to fail. This has been discussed and found to hold up in practice many times.

The tune is another thing. I find it hard to believe that BMW would claim there is a tune if there was none, even if OP did not install it. This is a grey area, but I have not heard of wholesale voiding of warranty before this.

Edit: sorry mate, could not resist looking for a tune on your car..

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...78&postcount=7

So he did in fact have a tune and was fully aware of it. You can lie to us but at least flash back before you roll into the dealership with a major problem like that.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

The ticking noise is not normal, and I said "Nothing in the photo indicates any problem with them [the rod bearings] or that they could be a cause of engine noise" and I stand by that statement. Scrippys bearings were fine and were not producing the random ticking noise. There was little wear, none through into the copper layer. If they were tapping at idle with no load on them they would have knocked like crazy by 3k rpm. He ran with that noise for around 3 weeks IIUC, no engine with rod bearing damage could survive that length of time. The fact that the noise disappeared after the bearings were needlessly changed was more likely due to changing the oil from whatever oil it came with from Carmax.
You were wrong then as you are now.

Now things become complicated .
In your statement above you are saying .."Scrippys bearings were fine"
So what do you think from Scrippys ticking noises in the video from before his bearing replacement ?
For me personal his ticking noises are horrible , an I saw S65's go with less of ticking noises ?
So I'll repait Scrippys ticking noises were absolutely "NOT" normal for me !
BTW...The noises in this video have nothing to do with an oil change ..
I never heard this noises on my car with or without oil change , hot oil or not .
Most of the ticking noises are very slight "in the beginning" , but get always worse and become in the end rattle noises and that's too late (game over) !
From what I know is that some people had "ignored" such ticking noises with a black hole as result !


So here is Scrippys video again from out my database before bearing replacement ...sounds not healty to me !

[heart_doctor]

Originally Posted by M__3__R__A__G__E

I'm devastated.... I literally feel like my car is worthless now

Your car isn't worthless. Even with the tune I would fight it. They may be willing to work with you. Did the tune raise the redline? Even with the tune you really shouldn't have had a catastrophic engine failure. If they aren't willing to work with you and the warranty is void then I would find a good independent shop and have them find and solve the problem. At least you didn't throw a rod and the motor still runs. Best case scenario it's not the bearings worse case you pay to have them replaced/fixed. Cost is somewhere around $2500 to $3000 I think. Also depends if there is more damage than just the bearings.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Now things become complicated .
In your statement above you are saying .."Scrippys bearings were fine"
So what do you think from Scrippys ticking noises in the video from before his bearing replacement ?
For me personal his ticking noises are horrible , an I saw S65's go with less of ticking noises ?
So I'll repait Scrippys ticking noises were absolutely "NOT" normal for me !
BTW...The noises in this video have nothing to do with an oil change ..
I never heard this noises on my car with or without oil change , hot oil or not .
Most of the ticking noises are very slight "in the beginning" , but get always worse and become in the end rattle noises and that's too late (game over) !
From what I know is that some people had "ignored" such ticking noises with a black hole as result !


So here is Scrippys video again from out my database before bearing replacement ...sounds not healty to me !

That's not rod knock. It's just not. It's an entirely wrong frequency for rod knock. Listen to the last two videos in this post:

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...5&postcount=52

Hear the difference in the frequency? The frequency is the pitch, not the interval. A rod knock is much lower pitch.

Also, I have never heard rod knock occur at an arrhythmic interval like this. The physics of rod knock make it extremely unlikely.

Note that I'm not saying this sound is good or that it's OK. Just that I don't think it's rod knock. I've heard plenty of rod knock in person and it never sounds like this.

This sounds like pre-ignition ping to me. Pre-ignition ping is frequently arrhythmic because the engine is constantly adjusting parameters like spark advance and fuel-air mixture.

OP, the first thing I would do is ditch the tune. An overly aggressive tune can definitely cause pre-ignition ping, even with 100 octane. Higher octane is not a cure-all.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

That's not rod knock. It's just not. It's an entirely wrong frequency for rod knock. Listen to the last two videos in this post:

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...5&postcount=52

Hear the difference in the frequency? The frequency is the pitch, not the interval. A rod knock is much lower pitch.

Also, I have never heard rod knock occur at an arrhythmic interval like this. The physics of rod knock make it extremely unlikely.

Note that I'm not saying this sound is good or that it's OK. Just that I don't think it's rod knock. I've heard plenty of rod knock in person and it never sounds like this.

This sounds like pre-ignition ping to me. Pre-ignition ping is frequently arrhythmic because the engine is constantly adjusting parameters like spark advance and fuel-air mixture.

OP, the first thing I would do is ditch the tune. An overly aggressive tune can definitely cause pre-ignition ping, even with 100 octane. Higher octane is not a cure-all.

I heard the 2 videos before from your link and about 27 X (think I know all of them from Youtube)
In my database are more than 200 cases of bearing noises , but also a lot of videos from people from all over the world ..Received this week 6 videos ...all good . ( Received via Email)
Rod knock are the rattle noises and that's for me the 3 rd degree of failure and is actually game over and too late , and probably the crank is damaged too with shavings all over into the oil system .
Ticking noises are the pre-warning noises with slight bearing wear, most of us don't even notice them , because the S65 makes a lot of noises .

[SenorFunkyPants]

Apart from Scrippys, there are 2 other identical cases of irregular engine ticking and neither of them were rod bearings.
Doesn't matter how many videos you have, rod bearings simply don't make ticking noises at idle and even if they did they would then sound like a bag of spanners under load.

[nthretourNAFTW]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

The ticking noise is not normal, and I said "Nothing in the photo indicates any problem with them [the rod bearings] or that they could be a cause of engine noise" and I stand by that statement. Scrippys bearings were fine and were not producing the random ticking noise. There was little wear, none through into the copper layer. If they were tapping at idle with no load on them they would have knocked like crazy by 3k rpm. He ran with that noise for around 3 weeks IIUC, no engine with rod bearing damage could survive that length of time. The fact that the noise disappeared after the bearings were needlessly changed was more likely due to changing the oil from whatever oil it came with from Carmax.
You were wrong then as you are now.

Fully agreed. Glad to see there are still some rational people with good sense on this forum. It's enough already with all the self improvised engine whisperers with 5% knowledge and 95% emotional crap.

[nthretourNAFTW]

Originally Posted by maloo

So he did in fact have a tune and was fully aware of it. You can lie to us but at least flash back before you roll into the dealership with a major problem like that.

... and there you go, another tuned engine trying to blame his problem on you guessed it RB. This forum is so dominated by undisclosed tuned car owners it's why they're so whiny and militant, any engine pb 'must' absolutely be RB.

So this will set a precedent in the right direction. By following a clear refusal line on tuned engine claims, bmw will be able to take care of stock cars more readily. This is good for the vast majority of M3 owners. If bmw is reticent to address engine problems it's because of tuned car owners who try to pass as stock owners. Nearly all these aftermarket tuners (except a very few respected names like Dinan) are just file loaders who sell garbage at gold prices.

This a precedent for you , phil / Belgium guy, the minute your engine starts ticking your warranty will be voided by bmw because of your internet file loading benvo tune.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by nthretourNAFTW

Fully agreed. Glad to see there are still some rational people with good sense on this forum. It's enough already with all the self improvised engine whisperers with 5% knowledge and 95% emotional crap talk.

You need to say that to "ME" !
And "NOT" under SFP post , because you are speaking from me .
Rational people , emotional crap talk ? Depends for how long.. till they get in trouble too with BF ..You included !
If you are man enough , I'm waiting for you to see more of how you other people reproach from bitching such as you do always !
For me personal you need to re-learn your language with "civilized words" !
Edit:
And if there is someone talking "CRAP" it comes only from you..

[Yoddha]

Originally Posted by Candide13

This is a bitter pill, and odd as well. The exhaust is a red herring; as others have said, this voids warranty for the exhaust but nothing else, and the burden of proof is on BMW to demonstrate that a non-OEM part caused another part to fail. This has been discussed and found to hold up in practice many times.

The tune is another thing. I find it hard to believe that BMW would claim there is a tune if there was none, even if OP did not install it. This is a grey area, but I have not heard of wholesale voiding of warranty before this.

Edit: sorry mate, could not resist looking for a tune on your car..

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...78&postcount=7

Hey mate an update on that. I did have the tune back then, however I did remove it quite soon after that after reading some bearing threads...so there wasn't a tune when I took the car into the dealer

[Yoddha]

UPDATE: for those thinking I have a tune, the car used to have a tune, I bought it second hand like that, and had removed it soon after due to reading the rod bearing threads. The dealer told me the BMW NA rep assumed I had a tune because I had removed my cats. Otherwise he said the engine would run funny. I did install an O2 spacer to make the car think it has cats so I DIDNT have to get a tune

[Yoddha]

Originally Posted by maloo

So he did in fact have a tune and was fully aware of it. You can lie to us but at least flash back before you roll into the dealership with a major problem like that.

Haven't had the tune for the longest time, close to a year now, for this very reason. I bought the car second hand with the tune

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M__3__R__A__G__E

Haven't had the tune for the longest time, close to a year now, for this very reason. I bought the car second hand with the tune

A tune is "not" the reason why we are seeing BF .
Oem. stock cars without tune have also BF .
BTW...When BMW has software updates , that's actually the same thing as a tune .
That's why it is called by BMW "the latest software updates" such as the 240E was , the proof of this is..that people can feel the difference of it that the S65 becomes more responsive ..
So actually most of the S65's are tuned by BMW => "BMW software upgrade"
Reason why is...Sofware upgrades never stands still , even not with BMW !

[Yoddha]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

A tune is "not" the reason why we are seeing BF .
Oem. stock cars without tune have also BF .
BTW...When BMW has software updates , that's actually the same thing as a tune .
That's why it is called by BMW "the latest software updates" such as the 240E was , the proof of this is..that people can feel the difference of it that the S65 becomes more responsive ..
So actually most of the S65's are tuned by BMW => "BMW software upgrade"
Reason why is...Sofware upgrades never stands still , even not with BMW !

Yea under U.S law they cannot void warranty simply because I have aftermarket parts. They have to prove that the aftermarket part (in this case the exhaust) directly causes damage to the power train